American Athletic Conference

[The Mad Hatter]

I must be dense, but I'm having trouble grasping this statement from the article by Sully. Does the following statement reference that a large part of our athletic budget is funded by donations, contributions, and sponsorship like you might see at a private university? And those funding sources have grown considerably over the last 5 years?

"Over the past five years, WSU has become to look less like an MVC school and more like … well, it looks more like a private school and that’s part of the problem."

Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/sports/college...#storylink=cpy

I think he was starting to develop a thought, but never got around to it. The potential application that I see is that for conference realignment our best fit might be with a set of private schools, but that there is potential that such private schools would prefer an all-private league (as the new big east did).

[Shocker-maniac]

I think he was starting to develop a thought, but never got around to it. The potential application that I see is that for conference realignment our best fit might be with a set of private schools, but that there is potential that such private schools would prefer an all-private league (as the new big east did).

That is plausible.

[mattdalt]

I think he was developing this thought: WSU is looking more like a private school, meaning self-supporting, and not relying on football kickbacks, (KU, KSU), nor state funding, (MSU, ISUr, ISUb, UNI, etc.) We are moving toward financial independence, which allows us to compete in ways the other conference schools cannot. Lest we forget, when conference realignment was super hot several years ago, no one cared about KU basketball history, and KSU is only relevant to the degree that Snyder is there. (The previous
sentence may have been unnecessary, no matter how accurate lol)

[Shocker-maniac]

I think he was developing this thought: WSU is looking more like a private school, meaning self-supporting, and not relying on football kickbacks, (KU, KSU), nor state funding, (MSU, ISUr, ISUb, UNI, etc.) We are moving toward financial independence, which allows us to compete in ways the other conference schools cannot. Lest we forget, when conference realignment was super hot several years ago, no one cared about KU basketball history, and KSU is only relevant to the degree that Snyder is there. (The previous
sentence may have been unnecessary, no matter how accurate lol)

I hope Sully will develop this thought because I am curious where he was going with it.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

Yeah, not sure where Sully was going with that. Perhaps he was trying to make the point that many of the MVC's public institutions receive quite a bit of public funding for their athletic programs? I don't know if that's really the case, just throwing ideas out there.

If that's his point, it brings up an interesting observation about the Big East. I don't believe its current make up is sustainable, with membership of only non-football private institutions. If the league would be interested in the future of adding public institutions, it may look for publics that are not heavily supported with public funding. I am of course, not advocating joining the BE, it's just an observation and wild speculation about Sully's point.

[WSUwatcher]

Interesting read on Mississippi State Football, currently ranked #1 in AP Poll.

Yes, Mississippi State learned from the Cam Newton situation that trying to buy players doesn't work. So they somehow convinced Dak Prescott to come for just the cost of a scholarship. If they had to pay him what he's actually worth, their budget would go up dramatically.

The point, obviously, is that there's more to success than just spending, which we see in all sports (e.g., major league baseball and the teams who have been most successful in postseason play recently). WSU has found a coach who can give them an elite-level basketball program while spending at a good but not elite level, and a level that can be sustained and even grown without either state funding or Power Five football money.

Edit: I just read PaulS's post and was equally as mystified as anyone else here about the reference to private schools and how that's part of the problem (what problem?) for WSU. So it would help if he'd clarify. But the real key for WSU is that the Shockers have the money to do what it takes to keep up with the power conferences, and that isn't necessarily true of everyone in the Valley, state or private. And their basketball commitment and success are a big part of why that's the case.

[Downtown Shocker Brown]

What happens to the college sports landscape when Football is taken out of the picture?

[Dave Stalwart]

What happens to the college sports landscape when Football is taken out of the picture?

No idea. I did appreciate Paul Suellentrop's perspective that he would like to see football divided out of college athletics in a way that allowed conferences to be more appropriately designed for other sports. I may not be communicating the idea right, but it would be nice to see the imminent change be something that strengthened other sports rather than marginalize everyone who isn't in the power 5 conferences. What if the changes open the door for the idea of WSU to participate in non-football sports in the Big 12?

I know that won't happen, and it gets discussed way too much anyway. I just hope this whole thing doesn't destroy college athletics for anyone not part of the "in-crowd." What an incredibly sad thing that will be...even if WSU finds a way to stay relevant (and we will), it would bother me to see other colleges wither.

[WSUwatcher]

What happens to the college sports landscape when Football is taken out of the picture?

Interesting question, but it surprised me in reading the PaulS piece to see that the threat of the football Power 5 going their own way and starting their own basketball tournament should scare anyone. March Madness is a unique spectacle, in considerable part because of the madness aspect that comes from having teams come from relative obscurity to take the headlines: Butler's two (!) runs to the championship game (one accompanied by a Final Four trip from VCU as well); Florida Gulf Coast's Dunk City story, complete with a coach married to a major babe model; the Shockers in the Final Four, followed by a 35-0 start the next season, with their titanic game against Kentucky being one of the highlights of the tournament -- that stuff doesn't come from the power conferences, and it can't.

I'm not an AD, so maybe I don't know enough to be scared the way some of them apparently are. But I'm also not convinced that a basketball championship for the power conferences only would be an attraction that could dwarf a championship of only the remaining leagues and teams, because there are too many power conference teams that are bad in basketball and probably always will be, just as there are too many teams from other leagues who are really good in basketball and really entertaining besides. And in either case, neither of the two tournaments that would result from splitting basketball would hold a candle to the one that exists now with all the conferences in it together.

A power conference-only basketball tournament would be an inferior product vs. what exists at present, and it's hard to believe any advertiser or marketing person would doubt that. If so, then why should anyone be afraid that the power conferences would take their basketball and leave -- to do what: put out an inferior product? At the card table, that's what is known as bluffing.

[Dave Stalwart]

A power conference-only basketball tournament would be an inferior product vs. what exists at present, and it's hard to believe any advertiser or marketing person would doubt that. If so, then why should anyone be afraid that the power conferences would take their basketball and leave -- to do what: put out an inferior product? At the card table, that's what is known as bluffing.

This is all true, but then my mind immediately wonders if this argument is part of why they want 15 scholarships. They might want to take their basketball and leave, and at the same time, improve their product by hoarding more of the talent so the competitive level starts dwarfing the leftover conferences.

[TheDover1018]

Not quite sure where to put this, so I will put it here.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/2014-15-ncaa-basketball-preview-the-big-east-villanova-wildcats-georgetown-hoyas-xavier-butler-creighton-marquette/

The best line from this (and the whole reason I'm posting this):
Yes, I’m including the American and the Big East as power conferences. They’re both a step down from the real Power 5 and should probably be part of an “upper mid-major” category with the A-10, Mountain West, West Coast Conference, and Missouri Valley.

[Dave Stalwart]

"Yes, I’m including the American and the Big East as power conferences. They’re both a step down from the real Power 5 and should probably be part of an “upper mid-major” category with the A-10, Mountain West, West Coast Conference, and Missouri Valley."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[TheDover1018]

Some more gems: "It’s easy to think that Gregg Marshall, Shaka Smart, or Brad Stevens would have done more with Doug McDermott. "
"Grant Gibbs was so old that I’m pretty sure his medical redshirt year was due to gout. "
"Ethan Wragge played like he was wearing an electro-shock collar that buzzed him anytime he got within 30 feet of either rim "

[wu_shizzle]

Oliver Purnell makes $2m per year?

That's criminal theft.

But this is Chicago, so that's par for the course.

[Perezident]

This is all true, but then my mind immediately wonders if this argument is part of why they want 15 scholarships. They might want to take their basketball and leave, and at the same time, improve their product by hoarding more of the talent so the competitive level starts dwarfing the leftover conferences.

I agree. I strongly suspect that the quality of the product is of very little interest to the decision makers in this case. The end-game is increased profits for the few at the top, and screw everyone else. If that means a crappier tournament for awhile, I doubt they'll be detoured.