American Athletic Conference

[Shocker1976]

Leave him alone. I have sure Rlh04d will have an answer for your charge.

You have had your moments of ignorance, particularly with AD/VP Sexton.

Please cite one of my "moments of ignorance, particularly with AD/VP Sexton", as I am unaware that any of my posts were as ill informed as confusing the AAC with the New Big East.

[Shocker1976]

I dislike KU as much as most Shocker fans (perhaps more), so I'm not sure if your inference that KU football is essentially interchangeable with Butler and Villanova football is a dig or a joke, or if you are actually serious. I hope it is the former, rather than the latter.

KU plays D1 FBS football (85 scholarships), has a football stadium with a capacity of around 50K, football-only revenues of $23M, and an overall AD budget pushing $100M.

Nova plays D1 FCS football (63 scholarships), has a football stadium that seats only 12,500 (less than minimum required for FBS entry), football-only revenues of $6M, and an overall AD budget of $35M.

Butler also plays D1 FCS football (63 scholarships), but in a conference that does not even allow for scholarships, has a football stadium that seats 7,500 (again, not even close to getting your foot in the FBS door in this regard), football-only revenues of $900K, and an overall AD budget of $17.5M.

For context, Wichita State has an actual, but small, 30,000 seat football stadium that would allow for FBS inclusion if we had a football program, and we spend almost 30% more on athletics than Butler does, a gap that will widen even further after the bump from 3G's new salary, and the ticket price increases.

If Butler or Nova were to ever make the jump to KU's level of football program (as pathetic as it is amongst the big boys), it would make what Bill Snyder did at K-State look like child's play. Nova football would fit fine in all regards in the MVFC; Butler is not even at the level of the MVFC. The gap between Nova and B1G football is absolutely massive; the gap between Butler and B1G football is something NASA would measure in light years.

A feeble attempt to "help" the Beakers understand their plight of missing out on a potential P4 Conference if the Big 12 implodes, apologies if you thought I was serious.

My wish is that both Texas and OU join the B1G and the Beakers get left to their own devices trying to support their athletic budget without benefit of $23 million they receive annually from the Big 12.

[Shocker1976]

That sounds about right on what I remember. I was surprised that ku wasn't highly sought out, but it was all about football, and no thought what so ever to basketball.

I will see if I can find the articles mentioning this...

Thanks I would appreciate receiving them; I have a couple of Beaker friends who need to read them. My searches for such publications have been unsuccessful.

[Jhook89]

I seem to remember that too. KSU was definitely on the oitside with iowa state. KU was speculated to be picked up by the big 10 but many werent sure at all about it.

Texas, OU, TTech, and OSU were going to the PAC12, mizzou was originally supposed to go to the big 10. A&M was going SEC the whole time. I cant remember Baylor, and TCU wasnt a member yet. Baylor would be on the outside too this time.

Baylor has a strong football and basketball program. We all know football is the key and they almost made the 4 team playoffs last year. They are also a Texas school. Lol what I'm trying to say is, they don't need to worry about being left out.

[Shocker1976]

Baylor has a strong football and basketball program. We all know football is the key and they almost made the 4 team playoffs last year. They are also a Texas school. Lol what I'm trying to say is, they don't need to worry about being left out.

I agree with your thoughts and pose the thought that Texas A&M might prefer Baylor to Texas in an expanded SEC; if correct, this would help the B1G's efforts to recruit Texas. Now if the SEC would accept Oklahoma State rather than OU my desire for the Beakers to be left out in the cold would be very likely; which would make a new MidWest Conference comprised of basketball centric schools a real possibility. Not that I think WSU would be asked to join but this would IMO improve the Shockers chances for scheduling out of conference BB games.

[Kung Wu]

I know this is completely off the track of this conversation, but I would just like to say that I really appreciate everything Doug Elgin has done for this conference over the years. He was the right man for WSU at the right time, in bringing in Marshall. His attempt to raise the awareness of the conference with the Bracket Busters initiative was at least creative, even if ESPN turned it into a net negative for the elite non-P5 teams. His attempt to bolster RPI with scheduling requirements has been good.

That said, we need a new visionary leader that can turn this conference into a truly elite basketball only powerhouse. We need an entrepreneur with serious connections, to make some serious change. That will be difficult, but not impossible. Here's one concept:

- Grow the conference and turn the conference into a promotion/relegation system, like many international soccer conferences. The conference would add several teams and then has two tiers/levels/divisions/whatever you want to call it. I'll call it "upper division" and "lower division".

The divisions are decided purely by success and/or failure: If you win or place second in the lower division, you are automatically bumped up to the upper division the following year. If you place last or second to last in the upper division, you are automatically bumped down to the lower division the following year. There is no "gaming" the system. Simply win or lose your games and the politics are completely left out of it.

If you are in the upper division, you get:

a) Schedule. A home and away game against every other team in the upper division and a single (preferably home) game against every other team in the lower division. This allows the upper division to "protect" their RPIs and con-SOS from getting jacked by the lower division teams.

b) Money. A larger piece of the combined NCAA winnings of the teams in your conference. Say the upper division splits 70% of the winnings, while the lower division teams split 30% of the winnings, or something.

c) Television. The conference television package picks up only upper division games (including when an upper division team plays a lower division team). This way the marquee programs are getting a much larger share of the national spotlight, while the lower division teams get a little exposure just by playing against the upper division teams.

d) Tournament. Only upper division teams and the best two teams from the lower division get to play in the conference tournament. This allows the two best teams from the lower division a chance to make it to the NCAAs, but prevents the other crappy lower division teams that go on a 3 game winning streak from taking a spot that they have no chance in Hades from being able to defend (and thus lose the conference money).

This entire process can be carried down to the individual sport, and sports that do not have enough participation for two divisions can collapse into a single division. For example, if we grow the league to 18 teams and only 11 have football -- then there is not promotion/relegation divisions for that sport.

I would also have a probation status for schools that are in the lower division of Men's basketball too many years out of, say, 20. For example, if Loser University (I don't want to use any names so please do not "fix" what I said and replace with Evansville -- hee hee) is in the lower division of the Men's basketball league for, say 18 out of 20 years, then they get put on probation status and have to wear a scarlet letter P on their uniforms. Actually if on probation, it should be understood that they are in grave danger of being replaced by a new conference member.

[capnkirk]

Thanks I would appreciate receiving them; I have a couple of Beaker friends who need to read them. My searches for such publications have been unsuccessful.

Here are a couple different articles that mention ku.

http://www.casualhoya.com/2010/6/11/1512966/expansion-chaos-news-rumors-and

Self 'very concerned' for Kansas' future - Beyond the Arc - NBC Sports
"I'm not in panic mode yet, but I'm very concerned," [Bill] Self told SI.com's Luke Winn. "I believe that Kansas will be OK no matter what, but for us to continue to compete at the level where we've been competing, and recruit at that level, I really believe that we need to be aligned with a BCS conference. It would be very disappointing to me if a team that's won three national championships, and is one of the three winningest programs in college basketball, wouldn't be a part of a BCS conference. "I think there are a lot of Kansas alums out there right now that are very concerned, that the face of our athletic department and our university could be changing, in the next 72 hours, for the next 30 years."

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/836538-big-12-breakup-where-the-kansas-jayhawks-should-land-in-conference-realignment

[shock]

Here are a couple different articles that mention ku.

http://www.casualhoya.com/2010/6/11/1512966/expansion-chaos-news-rumors-and

Self 'very concerned' for Kansas' future - Beyond the Arc - NBC Sports
"I'm not in panic mode yet, but I'm very concerned," [Bill] Self told SI.com's Luke Winn. "I believe that Kansas will be OK no matter what, but for us to continue to compete at the level where we've been competing, and recruit at that level, I really believe that we need to be aligned with a BCS conference. It would be very disappointing to me if a team that's won three national championships, and is one of the three winningest programs in college basketball, wouldn't be a part of a BCS conference. "I think there are a lot of Kansas alums out there right now that are very concerned, that the face of our athletic department and our university could be changing, in the next 72 hours, for the next 30 years."

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles...ce-realignment

Might be interesting if those articles were anywhere close to relevant.

[Aargh]

By Hire Esherick @CasualHoya on Jun 11, 2010, 9:28a

Just thought I might throw the byline from that article in there to give those comments some context.

Here are a couple different articles that mention ku.

http://www.casualhoya.com/2010/6/11/1512966/expansion-chaos-news-rumors-and

Self 'very concerned' for Kansas' future - Beyond the Arc - NBC Sports
"I'm not in panic mode yet, but I'm very concerned," [Bill] Self told SI.com's Luke Winn. "I believe that Kansas will be OK no matter what, but for us to continue to compete at the level where we've been competing, and recruit at that level, I really believe that we need to be aligned with a BCS conference. It would be very disappointing to me if a team that's won three national championships, and is one of the three winningest programs in college basketball, wouldn't be a part of a BCS conference. "I think there are a lot of Kansas alums out there right now that are very concerned, that the face of our athletic department and our university could be changing, in the next 72 hours, for the next 30 years."

By Hire Esherick @CasualHoya on Jun 11, 2010, 9:28a

Just thought I might throw the byline from that article in there to give those comments some context.

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles...ce-realignment

[Shocker1976]

Here are a couple different articles that mention ku.

http://www.casualhoya.com/2010/6/11/1512966/expansion-chaos-news-rumors-and

Self 'very concerned' for Kansas' future - Beyond the Arc - NBC Sports
"I'm not in panic mode yet, but I'm very concerned," [Bill] Self told SI.com's Luke Winn. "I believe that Kansas will be OK no matter what, but for us to continue to compete at the level where we've been competing, and recruit at that level, I really believe that we need to be aligned with a BCS conference. It would be very disappointing to me if a team that's won three national championships, and is one of the three winningest programs in college basketball, wouldn't be a part of a BCS conference. "I think there are a lot of Kansas alums out there right now that are very concerned, that the face of our athletic department and our university could be changing, in the next 72 hours, for the next 30 years."

Thanks for providing the link that identifies Luke Winn's SI.com article; meets my needs for my Beaker friends perfectly!

http://www.si.com/more-sports/2010/06/09/kansas-kansasstate

[Shocker1976]

I know this is completely off the track of this conversation, but I would just like to say that I really appreciate everything Doug Elgin has done for this conference over the years. He was the right man for WSU at the right time, in bringing in Marshall. His attempt to raise the awareness of the conference with the Bracket Busters initiative was at least creative, even if ESPN turned it into a net negative for the elite non-P5 teams. His attempt to bolster RPI with scheduling requirements has been good.

That said, we need a new visionary leader that can turn this conference into a truly elite basketball only powerhouse. We need an entrepreneur with serious connections, to make some serious change. That will be difficult, but not impossible. Here's one concept:

- Grow the conference and turn the conference into a promotion/relegation system, like many international soccer conferences. The conference would add several teams and then has two tiers/levels/divisions/whatever you want to call it. I'll call it "upper division" and "lower division".

The divisions are decided purely by success and/or failure: If you win or place second in the lower division, you are automatically bumped up to the upper division the following year. If you place last or second to last in the upper division, you are automatically bumped down to the lower division the following year. There is no "gaming" the system. Simply win or lose your games and the politics are completely left out of it.

If you are in the upper division, you get:

a) Schedule. A home and away game against every other team in the upper division and a single (preferably home) game against every other team in the lower division. This allows the upper division to "protect" their RPIs and con-SOS from getting jacked by the lower division teams.

b) Money. A larger piece of the combined NCAA winnings of the teams in your conference. Say the upper division splits 70% of the winnings, while the lower division teams split 30% of the winnings, or something.

c) Television. The conference television package picks up only upper division games (including when an upper division team plays a lower division team). This way the marquee programs are getting a much larger share of the national spotlight, while the lower division teams get a little exposure just by playing against the upper division teams.

d) Tournament. Only upper division teams and the best two teams from the lower division get to play in the conference tournament. This allows the two best teams from the lower division a chance to make it to the NCAAs, but prevents the other crappy lower division teams that go on a 3 game winning streak from taking a spot that they have no chance in Hades from being able to defend (and thus lose the conference money).

This entire process can be carried down to the individual sport, and sports that do not have enough participation for two divisions can collapse into a single division. For example, if we grow the league to 18 teams and only 11 have football -- then there is not promotion/relegation divisions for that sport.

I would also have a probation status for schools that are in the lower division of Men's basketball too many years out of, say, 20. For example, if Loser University (I don't want to use any names so please do not "fix" what I said and replace with Evansville -- hee hee) is in the lower division of the Men's basketball league for, say 18 out of 20 years, then they get put on probation status and have to wear a scarlet letter P on their uniforms. Actually if on probation, it should be understood that they are in grave danger of being replaced by a new conference member.

IMO travel constraints (especially costs) would be the major hurdle to be cleared regards such a two tiered conference. But if the Big 12 implodes then a number of schools would become available for inclusion in the MVC geographical footprint. Adding Iowa State, Kansas State, Oklahoma State, and TCU would greatly improve the Valley and could entice other schools (Cincinnati and Memphis) to join.

[shock]

Thanks for providing the link that identifies Luke Winn's SI.com article; meets my needs for my Beaker friends perfectly!
http://www.si.com/more-sports/2010/0...as-kansasstate

Paging Captain Kirk. It's 2015.

[Veritas]

Thanks for providing the link that identifies Luke Winn's SI.com article; meets my needs for my Beaker friends perfectly!
http://www.si.com/more-sports/2010/0...as-kansasstate

http://frankthetank.me/tag/big-ten-expansion/

http://www.knowitallfootball.com/2014/06/13/doomsday-scenario-big-ten-expand-16/

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/901020-kansas-football-4-reasons-the-jayhawks-belong-in-the-b1g

This kind of stuff could go on endlessly.

[capnkirk]

Paging Captain Kirk. It's 2015.

True, but 2010 conference realignment is what I was talking to shocker1976 about.....

[Rlh04d]

Leave him alone. I have sure Rlh04d will have an answer for your charge.

You have had your moments of ignorance, particularly with AD/VP Sexton.

Don't mind him. He's got a hard on for me because he tried to fight with me via PMs after @_kai_ asked for a discussion to go back on topic and I put him on ignore. Not the first time he's chased after me trying to get my attention since then. I'm sure it won't be the last. Childish comments like the one you quoted proved my decision to simply ignore him was by far the right choice.

I've got no interest in repeating some of the other nonstop fights others have on here. If he wants to mimic a chihuahua nipping at my heels for the rest of his time on this forum, that's his prerogative. I won't see it unless someone quotes it. It's been a month and he still clearly can't get over the heartbreak of learning I don't wish to read his posts. I hope he can get past the anger stage of his grief soon.