16-17 Games of Interest

[Shocker1976]

You may be right but you list no facts for Izzo outcosching Gregg. Izzo did win, after all. But without complete knowledge about what happened on the sidelines, it could just as easily be the players not implementing Gtrgg's instructions. For example, Smith's last shot was not implemented as drawn up. Smith improvised and it looked like the shot was early and at a range outside his comfort zone. We don't know what could have been however.

HC3G stated after the UL game that the match-up zone was a surprise and he had not prepared the team for it.

As for Izzo, I am biased as I think he is the best in-game coach in college basketball.

[shocka khan]

IMO the two losses the Shockers have suffered this season are due to HC3G being out-coached by Pitino (no preparation for a match-up zone) and Izzo did a better job during the course of the game. But this opinion does not shake my faith in HC3G or the Shockers; another 30 win season is there for the Shockers, let's play the games and see what comes.

You and I must not have watched the same game. Marshall made a couple of adjustments about the middle of the second half that did get the shocks back into the game, one was aided by Izzo having the wrong team on the court. If that isn't 'doing a better job during the course of the game' and 'taking advantage of situations', I don't know what is.

Having said that, we can't continue to dig early graves for ourselves. Good teams like Michigan State and Louisville will beat you about 80 or 90 percent of the time when you do that.

[DwShock]

Just want to start off by saying I've never played basketball other than what you learn in PE class. So my X's and O's are pretty much non-exestiant.

I've watched a lot of hoops both on the HS and College level and to me what this team is missing is a natural leader. Guys are trying but it's missing and you could tell during those two losses. It's a young team and the guys are still trying to figure out their roles.

I have faith that they will get it figured out and I'd bet by conference time that long bench gets shortened.

[Shocker1976]

You and I must not have watched the same game. Marshall made a couple of adjustments about the middle of the second half that did get the shocks back into the game, one was aided by Izzo having the wrong team on the court. If that isn't 'doing a better job during the course of the game' and 'taking advantage of situations', I don't know what is.

Having said that, we can't continue to dig early graves for ourselves. Good teams like Michigan State and Louisville will beat you about 80 or 90 percent of the time when you do that.

I agree with your bolded statement and did not mean to imply that HC3G was brain dead for the entire game. But when HC3G starts the same five players and follows an almost identical substitution pattern in the first ten minutes of each game regardless of the Shockers opponent, experienced coaches like Pitino, Izzo and Jacobsen will take advantage of him.

[shockmonster]

You and I must not have watched the same game. Marshall made a couple of adjustments about the middle of the second half that did get the shocks back into the game, one was aided by Izzo having the wrong team on the court. If that isn't 'doing a better job during the course of the game' and 'taking advantage of situations', I don't know what is.

Having said that, we can't continue to dig early graves for ourselves. Good teams like Michigan State and Louisville will beat you about 80 or 90 percent of the time when you do that.

Yes I gave you the Louisville game because of the zone except that I read that Louisville put it in during a 55 minute walkthrough the morning of the game. Even though no one would expect a defense to work with so little preparation but it too could be argued that Pitino must not have thought he couldnt won with a m/m defense. Marshall should have had a spy following them.

As for MSU, you didn't give any facts at all for why he out coached Ggg. Someone with knowledge could probably make a case either way. If you may be right. I'm not sure I know enough inside information to know.

[Shocker1976]

Yes I gave you the Louisville game because of the zone except that I read that Louisville put it in during a 55 minute walkthrough the morning of the game. Even though no one would expect a defense to work with so little preparation but it too could be argued that Pitino must not have thought he couldnt won with a m/m defense. Marshall should have had a spy following them.
As for MSU, you didn't give any facts at all for why he out coached Ggg. Someone with knowledge could probably make a case either way. If you may be right. I'm not sure I know enough inside information to know.

Pitino used the same defense in our Final Four game, while I am cynical, please do not accept propaganda from UL that Pitino woke up at 2 AM from a dream that UL could beat the Shockers playing the same match-up zone they used in their Final Four game with the Shockers. His staff should have watched every game the Shockers played prior to their meeting in Atlantis and IMO practiced the match-up zone to the detriment of their preparation for their game with ODU.

I have no insider information regards HC3G's coaching preparation and in-game coaching against MSU. All I have is my opinion using the information I posted earlier regarding Shocker lineups and substitutions. I lack personal basketball experience of the quality and extent of the Shocker staff but I know what I saw and formulated my opinion on those observations.

[Stickboy46]

Kentucky just beat Arizona State 115 - 69 ...

[Kung Wu]

Kentucky just beat Arizona State 115 - 69 ...

Ouch.

[wusphlash]

Tulsa defeats ORU 79-65. Tulsa now 3-2.

[ShockingButTrue]

IMO the two losses the Shockers have suffered this season are due to HC3G being out-coached by Pitino (no preparation for a match-up zone) and Izzo did a better job during the course of the game. But this opinion does not shake my faith in HC3G or the Shockers; another 30 win season is there for the Shockers, let's play the games and see what comes.

Agreed. No shame in losing to 2 coaches who have multiple championships between them, but the talent disparity was certainly crystallized I'd say. No excuses though.

On the flip side we've seen Marshall outcoach Stallings, Matta, Few, Crean, Dixon, Jacobsen, Bennett & Self, with much less talent, so I have no worries there, just observing portion size alone. We'll be alright once he gets his rotation figured out.

The Valley is going to be pretty tough for us to win this year.

[ShockerFever]

The Valley is going to be pretty tough for us to win this year.

If you mean tougher than pervious years, then I would agree.

If you mean "tough" in general, then that would be false. The Valley sucks and if we got to the point where we weren't winning a mediocre league, then that would be cause for concern. We won the league by FOUR games last year. We may not be as good as the past but the Valley sure as hell isn't tougher. In fact, you could argue that it's trending worse. UNI will win some games but as noted last year, they're inconsistent as hell. Illinois State? LOL. Muller couldn't coach his way out of a paper bag. Same goes for Missouri State. And that there is our competition.

[Shocker1976]

If you mean tougher than pervious years, then I would agree.

If you mean "tough" in general, then that would be false. The Valley sucks and if we got to the point where we weren't winning a mediocre league, then that would be cause for concern. We won the league by FOUR games last year. We may not be as good as the past but the Valley sure as hell isn't tougher. In fact, you could argue that it's trending worse. UNI will win some games but as noted last year, they're inconsistent as hell. Illinois State? LOL. Muller couldn't coach his way out of a paper bag. Same goes for Missouri State. And that there is our competition.

At this point in time we share a common view Fever; UNI and Jacobsen for me represent potential losses for the Shockers. As for the rest of the Valley, IMO the Shockers will be favored and should win all of those games. Of course, surprises do happen and a bad shooting night for the Shockers is within the realm of possibilities; thus the Shockers could lose a game or two to a Valley team other than the Panthers. I pray to God every night that such a surprise does not happen.

[ShockingButTrue]

If you mean tougher than pervious years, then I would agree.

If you mean "tough" in general, then that would be false. The Valley sucks and if we got to the point where we weren't winning a mediocre league, then that would be cause for concern. We won the league by FOUR games last year. We may not be as good as the past but the Valley sure as hell isn't tougher. In fact, you could argue that it's trending worse. UNI will win some games but as noted last year, they're inconsistent as hell. Illinois State? LOL. Muller couldn't coach his way out of a paper bag. Same goes for Missouri State. And that there is our competition.

But the red-turds shut us down completely last year. Arizona couldn't.

[Stickboy46]

Bradley going to OT with eastern Illinois

[WuShock16]

SLU lost to Samford...