Poll Watch (2013-14 Edition)

[pogo]

I think that even if they have a record like they did last year they still get in. How in the world will college basketball survive if kentucky were to miss the dance two years in a row?

[1972Shocker]

To sum up that excellent and spot on analysis:

1. The bar is higher for us when we win
2. And the threshold to fall out is lower when we lose.

We get it coming and going. That's life for a major team not playing in a major conference...

I think that sums it up as well as you could. The Shocks are probably in a position where they need to win to maintain their ranking, but if they do lose it will result in a significant drop in the polls, especially if we lose at home.

The thing is that this Shocker teams is still a work in progress and I expect them to be better by the end of the year than they are now. Whether or not that will be reflected in our ranking remains to be seen, but if that happens we will be one tough out in the NCAA Tournament, assuming that is our destination.

[RoyalShock]

In my opinion, the reason WSU would drop a long way after a loss has more to do with the fact that: 1. we've yet to put together a complete game, and 2. aren't getting consistently good post play. Those poor 1st halves may not show up in the W/L record, but they are noticed by the pollsters.

How the team, especially the bigs, perform against UT on Saturday will likely answer those questions.

[Cdizzle]

In my opinion, the reason WSU would drop a long way after a loss has more to do with the fact that: 1. we've yet to put together a complete game, and 2. aren't getting consistently good post play. Those poor 1st halves may not show up in the W/L record, but they are noticed by the pollsters.

How the team, especially the bigs, perform against UT on Saturday will likely answer those questions.

While I agree, the primary problem is that those same type of issues are not held against some teams --- teams that HAVE incurred losses because of their flaws. KU gets a pass for having terrible guards, Kentucky gets a pass for having no toughness, Duke gets a pass for not being able to guard a chair.

[jocoshock]

In my opinion, the reason WSU would drop a long way after a loss has more to do with the fact that: 1. we've yet to put together a complete game, and 2. aren't getting consistently good post play. Those poor 1st halves may not show up in the W/L record, but they are noticed by the pollsters.

How the team, especially the bigs, perform against UT on Saturday will likely answer those questions.

They are absolutely noticed, but we will pay a much higher price if/when we lose then KU, UK, Duke, Michigan State. Even North Carolina, which has dropped much more than I expected, rebounds much higher when they pull a win out of their you know what. Some of that would be expected if we lose to a Valley bottom dweller, but even if we played a top 25 mid-season, and beat them, our bounce would not buy us as much. Not much we can do about it. And we are not the only team that has this problem. It goes with the territory we exist in...

It is what it is. We just need to let the team play the games. I expect them to take care of business and I expect us to be in the dance. That is our opportunity to perform.

[SHOCKvalue]

I get kind of burnt out hearing about how WSU has sketchy underpinnings for it's place in the polls, due mostly to our "weak" schedule, or how "we haven't played/beat anyone yet." I see this in the national media, and I also see it justified on SN in mostly a passive manner. My question is, am I in the minority that I actually look to metrics before I form an opinion of something? I say that because for a while now this season our SOS has compared just fine contrasted against other top 25 teams.

I don't have all day to look at all sites and check for calculation updates, but I just looked at warrennolan.com and our SOS to date puts us smack dab in the middle of the SOS's for the top 25. In fact, we have a better SOS than 4 out of the 10 teams in front of us in the current AP poll. Who are those teams? Little known programs like: Kentucky, Louisville, Duke, and Ohio State.

The Doug Gottlieb's of the world - perfectly content to be blissfully ignorant while bloviating at the mouth - be damned.

[wushock27]

Kentucky has 3 more ranked (or getting votes) games coming up in the next couple of weeks....not totally sold on them having such a "weak" schedule, seeing as how they will have played 5 such teams before conference schedules start
Louisville on the other hand will not play any tough competition this season except for UK, UConn, and Memphis due to being in the weak conference known as the AAC

[SHOCKvalue]

Kentucky has 3 more ranked (or getting votes) games coming up in the next couple of weeks....not totally sold on them having such a "weak" schedule, seeing as how they will have played 5 such teams before conference schedules start
Louisville on the other hand will not play any tough competition this season except for UK, UConn, and Memphis due to being in the weak conference known as the AAC

Your Kentucky comment has absolutely zero context to the conversation at hand. You do understand that, right? In time value of money terms: Future value versus present value.

[jocoshock]

I get kind of burnt out hearing about how WSU has sketchy underpinnings for it's place in the polls, due mostly to our "weak" schedule, or how "we haven't played/beat anyone yet." I see this in the national media, and I also see it justified on SN in mostly a passive manner. My question is, am I in the minority that I actually look to metrics before I form an opinion of something? I say that because for a while now this season our SOS has compared just fine contrasted against other top 25 teams.

I don't have all day to look at all sites and check for calculation updates, but I just looked at warrennolan.com and our SOS to date puts us smack dab in the middle of the SOS's for the top 25. In fact, we have a better SOS than 4 out of the 10 teams in front of us in the current AP poll. Who are those teams? Little known programs like: Kentucky, Louisville, Duke, and Ohio State.

The Doug Gottlieb's of the world - perfectly content to be blissfully ignorant while bloviating at the mouth - be damned.

I think most everyone on this board agrees with you, and are simply reflecting or projecting what the "experts" will start saying in a few weeks after the conference season starts and our schedule flattens out. Some "experts" look at those metrics and take them into account; some don't. Mostly venting (in advance) by the majority of posters here..

[1979Shocker]

I think that even if they have a record like they did last year they still get in. How in the world will college basketball survive if kentucky were to miss the dance two years in a row?

If they do miss out two years in a row, some of those future one and dones might have second thoughts about going to Kentucky.

[wushock27]

Your Kentucky comment has absolutely zero context to the conversation at hand. You do understand that, right? In time value of money terms: Future value versus present value.

Well then, tell that to the people making predictions of how they will end up in the NIT...
Pardon me for trying to give some insight into what they have on their upcoming schedule for some people!
Quit being pissy... Sheesh

[SHOCKvalue]

I think most everyone on this board agrees with you, and are simply reflecting or projecting what the "experts" will start saying in a few weeks after the conference season starts and our schedule flattens out. Some "experts" look at those metrics and take them into account; some don't. Mostly venting (in advance) by the majority of posters here..

Sure. I probably should have clarified my comment. I did not mean that it was a prevalent undertone on the forum, just that it existed.

[shocks771]

Shockers at #8 in the Coaches Poll

[martymoose]

Shockers at #8 in the Coaches Poll

Wow, bigger jump than I expected...thought 1 spot if we were lucky.

[proshox]

That was quick!