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  • The program was not in decline.
    Any rational observer knew that the Shox were entering a natural period of transition with the conference move and a large group of veterans leaving after the first year. The NIT Final Four was actually playing way over the heads of where the team should have been (or would have been under a normal coach).

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    • Originally posted by StunningSteve View Post
      The program was not in decline.
      Any rational observer knew that the Shox were entering a natural period of transition with the conference move and a large group of veterans leaving after the first year. The NIT Final Four was actually playing way over the heads of where the team should have been (or would have been under a normal coach).
      Yes, Thanks Steve. Until your post I thought I was talking to a Stick.

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      • The program was clearly trending downwards. I called it a couple years ago and I was spot on (like usual). "The program" being: The coach + the roster + postseason success. I was hoping Marshall would have another success swing before he hung it up for good.

        Without much of a roster, if we lose a top 15 coach on top of that... then we are indeed in a steep decline which will require a formidable rebuild. We're not Kentucky; we don't reload. Any new coach will be allowed to have 2-3 years of modest success before expectations steepen.. similar to Marshall's trajectory. If this whole thing goes tits up we likely won't see the NCAA's for quite some time. Unless we're very lucky.

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        • Originally posted by C0|dB|00ded View Post
          The program was clearly trending downwards. I called it a couple years ago and I was spot on (like usual). "The program" being: The coach + the roster + postseason success. I was hoping Marshall would have another success swing before he hung it up for good.

          Without much of a roster, if we lose a top 15 coach on top of that... then we are indeed in a steep decline which will require a formidable rebuild. We're not Kentucky; we don't reload. Any new coach will be allowed to have 2-3 years of modest success before expectations steepen.. similar to Marshall's trajectory. If this whole thing goes tits up we likely won't see the NCAA's for quite some time. Unless we're very lucky.
          It really wasn't a good future outlook from the start. Marshall had lost all of his assistants that were around for the Final 4 run and the chances of landing another Ron&Fred were 1 in a million. If we got lucky he would of coached till he retired and made WSU seem like an appealing place to coach in the AAC. But by the looks of this -everyone turned a blind eye cause of the success- this just makes WSU look bad. Maybe we can get lucky and land a good coach right off the bat, but I doubt it. It seems more likely this fiasco sets us back 4 or 5 years

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          • Could WSU find a coach to have big success like Gregg? Sure. The resources seem to be in place. However, if a hire will be made right now/next spring, you damn sure better get it right...because getting it wrong might irreparably damage the program. If this program falls back to .500 or below for an extended time, the Marshall Faithful won’t exist to keep the attendance at 6-7k while the bandwagoners wait to fill the rest in good times.
            78-65

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            • Originally posted by C0|dB|00ded View Post
              The program was clearly trending downwards. I called it a couple years ago and I was spot on (like usual). "The program" being: The coach + the roster + postseason success. I was hoping Marshall would have another success swing before he hung it up for good.

              Without much of a roster, if we lose a top 15 coach on top of that... then we are indeed in a steep decline which will require a formidable rebuild. We're not Kentucky; we don't reload. Any new coach will be allowed to have 2-3 years of modest success before expectations steepen.. similar to Marshall's trajectory. If this whole thing goes tits up we likely won't see the NCAA's for quite some time. Unless we're very lucky.
              Pretty much agree with all of this.

              The American makes it all the harder for WSU to gain traction once a fall-off occurs. WSU can’t out-resource Houston/ Cincinnati/Memphis and almost all of the schools have geographical recruiting advantages. WSU can’t have NCAA success prior to dominating the conference; therefore, it is critical we come out of this mid level trend fast.

              Assuming the coaching situation has to change, it is helpful that it happens now so the coaching staff can get ahead of departures and recruiting in this mess of a season.

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              • Marshall's career as a D1 coach is IMO a classic example of the Peter Principle, in the hierarchical world of D1 MBB Marshall rose (MVC to AAC) to his level of incompetence as his coaching skills were lacking when he was required to routinely compete with coaches/schools that possessed similar or superior resources he enjoyed at WSU.

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                • Originally posted by Shocker1976 View Post
                  Marshall's career as a D1 coach is IMO a classic example of the Peter Principle, in the hierarchical world of D1 MBB Marshall rose (MVC to AAC) to his level of incompetence as his coaching skills were lacking when he was required to routinely compete with coaches/schools that possessed similar or superior resources he enjoyed at WSU.
                  This couldn't be more wrong.

                  Even with a roster of primarily FR & SOs, Gregg Marshall never dipped below 20 wins. It was his coaching skills that did that. It certainly wasn't the talent.
                  In College Basketball, it's almost always AGE that decides who moves highest up the ladder. Wichita State was just young.

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                  • Agree with that last post, Steve!

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                    • Originally posted by Shocker1976 View Post
                      Marshall's career as a D1 coach is IMO a classic example of the Peter Principle, in the hierarchical world of D1 MBB Marshall rose (MVC to AAC) to his level of incompetence as his coaching skills were lacking when he was required to routinely compete with coaches/schools that possessed similar or superior resources he enjoyed at WSU.
                      You serious dude? You post some weird stuff but this is really special. Just go away

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                      • Originally posted by Shocker1976 View Post
                        Marshall's career as a D1 coach is IMO a classic example of the Peter Principle, in the hierarchical world of D1 MBB Marshall rose (MVC to AAC) to his level of incompetence as his coaching skills were lacking when he was required to routinely compete with coaches/schools that possessed similar or superior resources he enjoyed at WSU.
                        You have set the bar for stupidity. Congrats!

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                        • I suppose it Coach Brown becomes Interim Head Coach, that opens up an assistant's job. Baker is already in town......

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                          • "The program was clearly trending downwards". Really?

                            This whole last Shockernet page was on this. After we got into the American Conference, were we trending down? Things weren't as easy. Fred gave us 4 years of team play and leadership that we lacked for the last 4 years. We lacked team unity some in 2017-18 and we then lacked experience and team unity in 2018-19, and 19-20. The 2012-13 team wasn't perfect until we went on a run to the Final 4. I remember that team not even winning the Valley Tournament. A last comment is that this year's team was positioned to be as good as some of our better teams. I think that the team concept was alive, the classes were balanced, there seems to be leadership, and they want to win.

                            This was a fantastic run for the last 10 years, and some of you lack perspective of it.

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                            • Originally posted by StunningSteve View Post

                              This couldn't be more wrong.

                              Even with a roster of primarily FR & SOs, Gregg Marshall never dipped below 20 wins. It was his coaching skills that did that. It certainly wasn't the talent.
                              In College Basketball, it's almost always AGE that decides who moves highest up the ladder.Wichita State was just young.
                              You mean - like a team with 5 Sr's? How'd that work out last time WSU had that? There's a reason why WSU had a team with mostly Fr/So on the roster the next year. How does a team end up relying on so much youth? Stacking a class for a deep run and then having a bunch of transfers has to be attributed to the coach.

                              That class with a lot of AGE seems to have preceded two restarts in the next 3 years. One triggered by graduation and transfers. The second triggered almost exclusively by transfers. You can't give Marshall a break because he had such a young team, when Marshall is the reason he had such a young team.
                              The future's so bright - I gotta wear shades.
                              We like to cut down nets and get sized for championship rings.

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                              • Aargh With your hatred of Marshall, You're spoiled and have no perspective. You forget all of these eleven 20 win seasons, 3 30 win seasons, and only one below 500 in 13 years. You forget Scott Thompson, Gary Thompson, Mike Cohe(almost always under 500) *, and even Harry Miller was usually 500 or below.. And you remember that we had 5 Seniors a year or two and then only won 22 and 23 games the next year with only Fr/So.

                                Again, You are just spoiled and lack perspective in your hatred.

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