Marshall to Texas offseason rumors...

[jocoshock]

There are plenty of 5 star recruits that have huge chips on their shoulders and feel like they have been disrespected.

Really? If so, who are they and why aren't they playing, signed, or visitimg Wichita State? Where are these outcasts playing now? Other than homeboy Frankamp, of course...

[jocoshock]

Probably quoted months before but this was laugh out loud funny:

Kansas:

Worst-case scenario: Can a program really lose the No. 1 and 3 picks in the draft and get better? No. Though Kansas replaces the scoring of Wiggins and Embiid, the Jayhawks miss their defensive prowess. A Kansas team that was already Self's worst defensively last season slips even further with referees still whistling fouls at a record pace and with their top shot blocker and perimeter stopper both in the NBA. Turnovers and poor decisions once again plague the Jayhawks as well because they lack an elite point guard for a third straight season. Mason doesn't make a sophomore leap, Graham isn't ready to make an immediate impact as a starter and Frankamp proves to be more of a pure shooter than a distributing combo guard. Between costly turnovers and defensive breakdowns, Kansas cedes the Big 12 to Texas and Jayhawks fans learn that league titles are not a birthright. They're also reminded that deep NCAA tournament runs aren't either when Kansas falls for a second straight season in the Round of 32 — to in-state foe Wichita State no less. Self leaves for an NBA gig over the summer and, after swinging and missing in bids to land a couple high-profile coaches, Zenger decides to bring Weis back to coach both the football and basketball programs. Tens of thousands of Kansas fans revolt and decide to root for the Shockers.

There would be mass suicides off the Rock Chalk before any significant refugee exodus to Wichita...

[jocoshock]

This ^^. I think we underestimate the value of being able to recruit not only the talent, but the character type of guys that 3G wants. Say he goes to TX for a few bucks more, he doesn't get a FVV cause he's the type of guy who honors his commitment to a school that recruited him when the big boys didn't. He doesn't get a Tekele Cotton because he's not blue chip enough. And can you imagine if he recruited a walk-on from a small town in Kansas? The fans would be saying "we ONLY consider 4* recruits here." And so you get the attitudes and egos that go along with those recruits, and not the relationships you build with the guys here. I think 3G is smart enough to know not only does he make good money, he can recruit the type of guys he wants w/o question, and if he drops back to .500 for a year no one will question it (don't see that happening though). And after watching the end of that TX-Baylor game last night I can't imagine he would want to go to Texas! Looking to fight after a loose ball scuffle then staring down the opponent as they leave the court?!?

Correctomundo...

[shockmonster]

There are plenty of 5 star recruits that have huge chips on their shoulders and feel like they have been disrespected.

Yes, those McDonald's All Americans aren't handled with kids gloves at all.

[jocoshock]

Probably quoted months before but this was laugh out loud funny:

Kansas:

Worst-case scenario: Can a program really lose the No. 1 and 3 picks in the draft and get better? No. Though Kansas replaces the scoring of Wiggins and Embiid, the Jayhawks miss their defensive prowess. A Kansas team that was already Self's worst defensively last season slips even further with referees still whistling fouls at a record pace and with their top shot blocker and perimeter stopper both in the NBA. Turnovers and poor decisions once again plague the Jayhawks as well because they lack an elite point guard for a third straight season. Mason doesn't make a sophomore leap, Graham isn't ready to make an immediate impact as a starter and Frankamp proves to be more of a pure shooter than a distributing combo guard. Between costly turnovers and defensive breakdowns, Kansas cedes the Big 12 to Texas and Jayhawks fans learn that league titles are not a birthright. They're also reminded that deep NCAA tournament runs aren't either when Kansas falls for a second straight season in the Round of 32 — to in-state foe Wichita State no less. Self leaves for an NBA gig over the summer and, after swinging and missing in bids to land a couple high-profile coaches, Zenger decides to bring Weis back to coach both the football and basketball programs. Tens of thousands of Kansas fans revolt and decide to root for the Shockers.

Actually, it may have been from the same article...

[jdshock]

I think anyone who says someone like Anthony Davis, Andrew Wiggins, or Jahlil Okafor wouldn't fit into a HCGM system just doesn't understand how hard those athletes work. It's easy to say 5 star recruits are wusses and prima donnas, but those guys just have to put in so much time to be as good as they are. The lazy 5 star recruit is the exception not the rule.

That said, I'll be the first to say that I think there are obvious problems with a roster of 18 year old 5 star recruits. I think teams need veteran leadership and 5 star recruits tend not to stick around. But to say HCGM has not signed a 5 star recruit because he believes they would be a worse player or fit for his system is silly.

And that should make you happy! HCGM has done a lot with guys that are hard workers and less touted by the traditional recruiting media. I think if HCGM had coached the Anthony Davis UK team they may have gone undefeated. HCGM does an incredible job keeping our athletes focused and prepared. The future is very very bright.

[shockmonster]

An Anthony Davus is great. I don't think that a team of them would fit as well. How many coaches succeed with a team of 5stars (Calipari, maybe Self) and how many coaches don't meet expectations with a good number of 5stars (N. Car. Texas Florida Michigan St. yada yada yada). We exceed expectations and a good number don't. This may be a consideration when the urge is to jump to greener pastures.

[im4wsu]

I think anyone who says someone like Anthony Davis, Andrew Wiggins, or Jahlil Okafor wouldn't fit into a HCGM system just doesn't understand how hard those athletes work. It's easy to say 5 star recruits are wusses and prima donnas, but those guys just have to put in so much time to be as good as they are. The lazy 5 star recruit is the exception not the rule.

That said, I'll be the first to say that I think there are obvious problems with a roster of 18 year old 5 star recruits. I think teams need veteran leadership and 5 star recruits tend not to stick around. But to say HCGM has not signed a 5 star recruit because he believes they would be a worse player or fit for his system is silly.

And that should make you happy! HCGM has done a lot with guys that are hard workers and less touted by the traditional recruiting media. I think if HCGM had coached the Anthony Davis UK team they may have gone undefeated. HCGM does an incredible job keeping our athletes focused and prepared. The future is very very bright.

It is clear that the vast majority have the work ethic to have gotten to be a five-star in the first place. That is only one part of the equation. It is one thing to work harder than other high school kids and dominate, mostly offensively, at that level. It is another to work even harder to compete and dominate offensively at the D-1 level. It is yet another to work even harder and compete and dominate defensively at the D1 level. And the final step is to commit to your teammate over yourself -- to achieve team greatness.

[WillieJeffJeffries]

Quite a bit of talk on this subject by Petro and Gottleib yesterday on WHB810..don't have time to link but just go to podcast at their website

[jocoshock]

I think anyone who says someone like Anthony Davis, Andrew Wiggins, or Jahlil Okafor wouldn't fit into a HCGM system just doesn't understand how hard those athletes work. It's easy to say 5 star recruits are wusses and prima donnas, but those guys just have to put in so much time to be as good as they are. The lazy 5 star recruit is the exception not the rule.

That said, I'll be the first to say that I think there are obvious problems with a roster of 18 year old 5 star recruits. I think teams need veteran leadership and 5 star recruits tend not to stick around. But to say HCGM has not signed a 5 star recruit because he believes they would be a worse player or fit for his system is silly.

And that should make you happy! HCGM has done a lot with guys that are hard workers and less touted by the traditional recruiting media. I think if HCGM had coached the Anthony Davis UK team they may have gone undefeated. HCGM does an incredible job keeping our athletes focused and prepared. The future is very very bright.

I think what most people are trying to covey here is simple.

1) There is the Marshall way of doing things.
2) There are the expectations of elite P5 fan bases towards chasing after the highest rated players.
3) Thete are the trials and tribulations of chasing after those recruits (see Bruce Weber at Illinois, the NC Carolina grade scandal, and the KU History thread in the Around the NCAA forum on this site).
4) Yes HCGM would love to have 5 star players on his terms.
5) It is easier to do things on his terms here than at NC, Duke, or even a place like Texas.

[Dan]

I don't think Marshall intentionally steears away from 5 star recruits. He has his way of evaluating talent and tries to find guys that a) he thinks he can sign and b) fit his system. He's not going to waste a lot of time recruiting guys like Thon Maker, it's a waste of time and money. He wants hard working, hungry, under the radar guys.

[molly jabali]

Maybe I missed it...is Barnes GOING to get fired???I'd be stunned. Have they underachieved this year? Massively...but he has done SOME good things there.

[pinstripers]

I think Barnes is on very thin ice.

[Kel Varnsen]

I think anyone who says someone like Anthony Davis, Andrew Wiggins, or Jahlil Okafor wouldn't fit into a HCGM system just doesn't understand how hard those athletes work. It's easy to say 5 star recruits are wusses and prima donnas, but those guys just have to put in so much time to be as good as they are. The lazy 5 star recruit is the exception not the rule.

That said, I'll be the first to say that I think there are obvious problems with a roster of 18 year old 5 star recruits. I think teams need veteran leadership and 5 star recruits tend not to stick around. But to say HCGM has not signed a 5 star recruit because he believes they would be a worse player or fit for his system is silly.

And that should make you happy! HCGM has done a lot with guys that are hard workers and less touted by the traditional recruiting media. I think if HCGM had coached the Anthony Davis UK team they may have gone undefeated. HCGM does an incredible job keeping our athletes focused and prepared. The future is very very bright.

Very much agree. Solid post. If someone on this board would not have taken players like Andrew Wiggins, Anthony Davis, Karl-Anthony Towns, etc., I am just very thankful they are not on our basketball coaching staff.

[im4wsu]

Very much agree. Solid post. If someone on this board would not have taken players like Andrew Wiggins, Anthony Davis, Karl-Anthony Towns, etc., I am just very thankful they are not on our basketball coaching staff.

No generalization is without exceptions, but there are 50 5* a year, so over Gregg's 8 years, 400 or so. There are quite of few of those that I believe I am pleased that they did not attend WSU. As for numbers, it is difficult to judge, but those named here on this sight are very few.