WICHITA STATE (4-0) vs. LIBERTY (3-0) Game Thread

[BOBB]

All about match ups guys.
Liberty is one smart bunch of white dudes that know how to play the game.
They passed and moved without the ball and were a joy to watch.
They also proved you don't need a 6"10" shot stuffer in the paint to win.

Don't get on the HCPM and this team after that game. They aren't there yet 5 games in the season.
It was a learning experience and yes, they got schooled tonight.
When I watched Liberty do the same to Furman the night before, I knew tonight would be a challenge.
Liberty is just a well coached, fundamental team that plays well together. Vermont better be ready to go on Sunday or they will get their asses waxed too
If WSU can pop STL and get out of there with two wins, mission accomplished.

Stay positive guys. Better days are ahead.

That is all.

Obviously it’s fair to say turning on the coach five games in would be a knee-jerk reaction. I am asking you though, did you see any offense other than clear outs for one on one? I saw one pick and roll executed with Ballard and then the rest were just decoys apparently. How were there so few paint touches?

Were there no adjustments we could have made defensively?

HCPM has been with these guys since the summer. Are the systems that difficult to pick up? How were like 1:5 A/TO?

I fully expect to get out-duded a lot this year. That isn’t what happened last night. I have had bad days, hell even bad stretches at the office, where someone judging me on that performance would rightfully give me my walking papers, but over a 20 year career I’ve had a lot more good days than bad. So, I’m willing to chalk that up to a bad performance by the coach, but that was a stinker last night.

[newshock1234]

I always know when we lose, cuz our game threads are 10 pages longer lol

[Rize Ballz]

All of this and it was still just a two point game midway through the second half. Then in a two minute span we were knocked out. Was no depth, lack of a settling presence on the court, or just not having the dudes the main reason this happened? All of these can be fixed, but it isn’t happening this year.

[TrackSuitAndTie]

There wasn't much to celebrate from yesterday's game, but I was pleased to see Colby Rogers finding success driving to the basket. The threat of a drive, rather than just being a perimeter/midrange player, will give defenders another thing to worry about when guarding him.

[TrackSuitAndTie]

Bev's been through the ringer health wise in college. I'm really hoping it's just a sprain, for his sake...but yeah, ugh. Going to find out what kind of heart Joy has because he's going to be tested.

If Bev has to miss some time, ideally it's 2-3 games and Joy proves he belongs in the rotation during that stretch.

[pinstripers]

7 wasn't enough before. Now Joy makes 7 and we still need 8.

[WuDrWu]

Bev's been through the ringer health wise in college. I'm really hoping it's just a sprain, for his sake...but yeah, ugh. Going to find out what kind of heart Joy has because he's going to be tested.

[Bluzrover]

Well, that was…humbling. I liked the way the guys battled back from two double-digit deficits to make it a competitive game. But Liberty just had an answer each time and I believe fatigue and unfamiliarity with each other was a big reason the Shox couldn’t prevail. The Liberty guys were just quicker and it was obvious they were far more cohesive as a team.

I’m not a very good lip reader but it sure looked that he told the trainer that he “broke” his ankle. I’ve both broke an ankle and suffered an ankle sprain and both were excruciatingly painful. Regardless of the injury, our short bench just got 50% shorter and that does not bode well for the immediate future of the season. Hope the young man is okay and recovers completely.

It’s going to be a long season but I’m here for it.

[asiseeit]

I guess it ain't that simple, but why didn't we post up them smurfs?

Good question. KP scores first two buckets inside and then never sees the rock again. He was posting up well the end of last season and we need that again but it won't happen with him standing around in the deep corner to clear the paint for drivers.

[TrackSuitAndTie]

I guess it ain't that simple, but why didn't we post up them smurfs?

Ballard doesn't really have a back-to-the-basket game and Pohto is shooting like 30% from directly under the basket this season. That being said, they didn't even try to get a post game going which made no sense.

[Dan]

I guess it ain't that simple, but why didn't we post up them smurfs?

What good does it do to post up if we don’t have anyone willing to feed the post? I get the driving into the lane to exploit the size mismatch, but Liberty’s plan was to collapse on the driver and swipe the ball every time the ball handler turned their back to the basket. Our players, for some reason, are unable to recognize the double team and pass it out.

[pinstripers]

I guess it ain't that simple, but why didn't we post up them smurfs?

[WuDrWu]

Seven players deep and no (true) PG was always going to lead to some stinkers; this one was beyond stinky.

I had liked what I had seen from the Shox before tonight. I’m going to try and remind myself to enjoy the little moments and wins as they happen this season, because the rebuild is in the early stages.

How they come back and adapt and grow from this is what will be telling; both players and coaches.

TIMES A MILLION.

If you're bothered or butthurt because we got run out of the gym, your expectations were out of line. Liberty beats us 8+ out of 10 away from the Chuck, and a bunch of times there too. They are a top 75 team at least and we are not.

Also, one of our biggest nightmares is the back half of games on consecutive days. That showed bigly.

Don't blame X, he played his heart out, out of position. It's going to be exceedingly tough to share the ball when you don't have a single facilitator in uniform.

And if we do have someone that can share the ball, it's Bev, and it looked to me like he's going to miss some time.


To review, good team, back to back game, very tough matchup, no depth, no PG. Could be worse.


The only thing that really bothered me were the 13 offensive rebounds we gave up. Liberty rarely sent more than 1 guy while everyone else retreated. That is inexcusable. It's not like we had to block out all 5 Houston Cougars. Put a body on the guy and send him into the cheerleaders if you have to...it's just some want and we can't afford to lose the "want" part of the game.

3rd place would be a spectacular result, but I'm not holding my breath. St Louis is tough. And Vermont/Liberty SHOULD be the final and should be a great game to watch.

Go Shocks

[forevershockerfan]

Did many of us think we would be 4-1 now before the Season begin? If somehow our thin team could beat St. Louis and get home at 5-1 with possibly 6 players that normally play, I would be ecstatic.

However, it's glaring that we tried too much 1 on 5. Small ball and teamwork last night against us exposed several adjustments needed. Another problem was all the one on one penetration with no kick out passing or hitting the open man inside at least sometimes. Result was 3 assist and a brutal thumping in the barn yard.

Lastly, what a team of excellent shooters Liberty had. They were an excellent coached teamwork/move the ball with quick and crisp passes, with limited dribbling, machine. They should Dance in March.

[asiseeit]

Thanks to Liberty for giving us a lesson on how to play TEAM basketball. HCPM should keep and show the game tape periodically to our players. As for KP keep in mind Mills is not playing him around the paint or using him to post up. I was one who wanted the experiment of using him at PF but now believe I was wrong. Yes, wrong. Like him more running the old high post pick and roll or simply posting up. We need a decent post up guy and he is it. He hardly touched the ball last night. Last night our offense was to clear the lane for drivers mainly XB. This kept KP out of good rebounding position as they were very good at blocking out our guys. For those of you that have not played ball when you have an offense where one or two guys dominate the ball handling, continually dribble to create for themselves and eventually shoot it themselves you get the others standing around and watching too much. Have to have all five guys engaged like Liberty did........we usually had one or two on offense. This has to change or we will be easy to defend and losses will mount up. So will player discontent when they are excluded from a fluid offense. We needed that butt kicking. Hopefully we will learn from it.