American Athletic Conference

[Flip1381]

Not sure if this has been mentioned in reference to the conferences being discussed, but in addition to the recruiting boost that comes with being in a bigger better conference, there would also be a recruiting boost from specific players perspective. Think about the benefits of going after an east coast recruit and being able to show them the schedule of all the games near the east coast they are going to play where they can have family and friends see the the game in person, compared to N. Iowa, Missouri St, etc.

[Shoxthemonkey]

My personal opinion is that the only way WSU can keep HCGM long term is to upgrade leagues. I have zero faith that the rest of the MVC is going to raise their financial commitment to even close to WSU levels. No rule will ever force the "big" programs to play the Shocks, so every successful year will be met with "yeah, but...". Having to defend your program against that nonsense has to be tiresome. I grow weary from it, I can't imagine it's any different for Coach. Putting WSU Athletics into the AAC or A10 allows him to show his programs strengths against teams and coaches that have perceived strengths greater than the Valley offers. It may not be right but it's so. HCGM is the most competitive coach I have ever watched closely, I think that drives him.

[ripemupshocks]

From the AAC CSNbbs site:


www.csnbbs.com/thread-678772.html

www.csnbbs.com/thread-679912.html

ripemupshocks
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Post: #80
RE: Expansion Rumors - Should AAC act before MWC???

(02-26-2014 12:15 PM)Tigersmoke Wrote: The only additions we should make now should be houston going after witchita's coach with a vengence and a fistfull of money and ucf or usf doing the same for skaka smart. Think like a p5 and you cant go wrong. They rarely add lower teams when they can take your coaches and not splint any more conference dollars.

(2-27-2014 4:29 PM)ripemupshocks Wrote: Don't believe UH is looking for a new coach. Even if they were, they'd have no chance of getting Gregg Marshall. Not enough money. Not enough amenities. Not enough fan interest. Not enough of anything. The only upside to UH is the AAC. Everything else would be a huge step down from Wichita State University.

BigHouston
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Post: #83
RE: Expansion Rumors - Should AAC act before MWC???

(02-26-2014 12:15 PM)Tigersmoke Wrote: The only additions we should make now should be houston going after witchita's coach with a vengence and a fistfull of money and ucf or usf doing the same for skaka smart. Think like a p5 and you cant go wrong. They rarely add lower teams when they can take your coaches and not splint any more conference dollars.

(2-27-2014 4:29 PM)ripemupshocks Wrote: Don't believe UH is looking for a new coach. Even if they were, they'd have no chance of getting Gregg Marshall. Not enough money. Not enough amenities. Not enough fan interest. Not enough of anything. The only upside to UH is the AAC. Everything else would be a huge step down from Wichita State University.

(2-27-2014 7:13 pm)BigHouston Wrote: My favorite part "A huge step down from Wichita State University"

---

[SHOCKvalue]

From the AAC CSNbbs site:

Snip...

Perhaps this Houston fan would be happy to know that we spend over twice as much as they do on MBB ($2.5M versus $5.5M), average close to 3 times the fan attendance (3,707 versus 10,312), and have done far, far more over the past 10-15 years by any definable metric.

I especially like the part where he talks about putting together a package to lure away HCGM. Again, their entire MBB budget is only about 25% more than what HCGM makes. Half of the putrid MVC spends more on MBB than they do.

[ShockTalk]

Perhaps this Houston fan would be happy to know that we spend over twice as much as they do on MBB ($2.5M versus $5.5M), average close to 3 times the fan attendance (3,707 versus 10,312), and have done far, far more over the past 10-15 years by any definable metric.

I especially like the part where he talks about putting together a package to lure away HCGM. Again, their entire MBB budget is only about 25% more than what HCGM makes. Half of the putrid MVC spends more on MBB than they do.

In our gloomiest days during the 90's, our season average was 7,500 per game and over 10,000 per game for the last 10-11 years, mostly 10,506 sell-outs. Plus we have Intrust downtown which is good for 15,000.

Houston drew 7,000 for Louisville, 4,000 for UConn, 3,800 for Cincinnati, and 3,600 for Memphis. Hell, we draw those numbers for Volleyball. This all by itself would exclude Houston from any chance.

[RoyalShock]

Most of the fans would rather their conference deal with an odd number of non-football participants than to have their school give up $50k-$100k of TV revenue per year (which I would estimate to be less than 1% of their average budgets) to share with a 12th non-football member.

If the school presidents and league commissioner feel that way, too, we will have to settle for being Kings of the Valley for the next decade, at least.

[GiantHouston]

My personal opinion is that the only way WSU can keep HCGM long term is to upgrade leagues. I have zero faith that the rest of the MVC is going to raise their financial commitment to even close to WSU levels. No rule will ever force the "big" programs to play the Shocks, so every successful year will be met with "yeah, but...". Having to defend your program against that nonsense has to be tiresome. I grow weary from it, I can't imagine it's any different for Coach. Putting WSU Athletics into the AAC or A10 allows him to show his programs strengths against teams and coaches that have perceived strengths greater than the Valley offers. It may not be right but it's so. HCGM is the most competitive coach I have ever watched closely, I think that drives him.

Good points ^^^

[boyshocker]

And Houston is a pit hole.

[ShockTalk]

Good points ^^^

New Big East: The new Big East isn't what it once was... They have downgraded, lost its National appeal and lost their outstanding massive ESPN tv exposure.

A-10: The A-10 $$$ revenue isnt anything to desire... Their tv exposure isn't even close to that of the downgraded new BE exposure now and are loosing members constantly.

MWC: The MWC is a nice conference, but if you (Wichita State) want National exposure perhaps the MWC isn't what you may want, IMO.

AAC: Not only does the AAC have the old Big East massive outstanding ESPN & CBS tv exposure, but haves National huge markets with likes of UCONN (Boston), Temple (Philadelphia), Cincinnati, Memphis, SMU (Dallas), Houston (4th largest city in the Country), Tulane (New Orleans), East Carolina etc.

Im not saying the AAC will offer membership, but last I checked, the AAC currently haves a spot available for a athletic sports program... And if Houston found itself in Wichita State position, I will want our AD to pursue the best plausible destination endlessly.

How long does that massive TV deal last? No doubt, losing Louisville will be a future negative to holding on to that at re-negotiations. And what impact would losing either UConn or Cincinnati, or both, have?

I like the idea of the AAC very much, but the new Big East could become more relevant for basketball than the AAC if more than Louisville leaves and the Big East makes a play for a couple of non-private schools.

[GiantHouston]

Everyone haves a bad apples or two, guys... I would love to have Wichita State in the AAC west division.

[GiantHouston]

How long does that massive TV deal last? No doubt, losing Louisville will be a future negative to holding on to that at re-negotiations. And what impact would losing either UConn or Cincinnati, or both, have?

I like the idea of the AAC very much, but the new Big East could become more relevant for basketball than the AAC if more than Louisville leaves and the Big East makes a play for a couple of non-private schools.

All good questions and concerns

The AAC took the small (6 year) length contract route rather then signing a 12 year long... That way after the AAC settles down we could go to the open market with out the intervention of other programs (C7).

Loosing Lousiville is a blow, but keep in mind, no one knew how strong the AAC would become with SMU now in the hunt... Temple taking a year off was unexpected but confident they will come back strong again.

Yes, the new BE could become revelant again, but time will tell...

[Rlh04d]

I just read it for the comedy relief. The evidence is WSU Institution is committed to MVC. I have even heard that WSU president was heavily consulted on who the MVC brought in to replace CU. I keep looking for a little smoke, but don't see any.

There's a far cry between "committed to the MVC" and "heavily consulted on who the MVC brought in."

It would be absolutely stupid of us not to be heavily involved in any future members of the MVC unless we had a contract with a new conference ready to go. Until the day we're not in the MVC, we have to plan long-term as if we're in the MVC. Otherwise we damage our standing in the MVC, where we might have to stay, or we damage the MVC itself ... where we might have to stay.

Whether we're actively hoping to get into another conference administratively or not should have nothing to do with the level of our involvement in Loyola's addition. It would be ignorant for us not to be heavily involved in that decision.

[WSUwatcher]

One small reminder of why it would be nice for WSU to be somewhere other than the Valley, from ESPN's coverage of the game between Illinois and Iowa:

"IOWA CITY, Iowa -- Jon Ekey hit a 3-pointer in the final second to lift Illinois to a 66-63 victory over No. 24 Iowa on Saturday night.

Rayvonte Rice scored 15 points to lead the Illini (18-13, 7-11 Big Ten), who notched consecutive road wins against ranked opponents for the first time since 2005..."

In case those names sound familiar, you're right -- both key names are former Valley players who decided they wanted a bigger stage, even though Illinois (7-11 in the B1G?) is hardly in the spotlight on that ostensibly bigger stage.

When you're in a league that players try to escape not for more playing time but to get promoted -- well, that's less than ideal, shall we say. There are ways to cope with it, of course, like dominating your league the way Gonzaga has controlled its (or Kansas has run the overhyped Big 12 for a decade now, for that matter) -- and WSU could win a whole bunch of MVC titles before they catch up with Gonzaga -- but even better would be to play in a league where failing to win doesn't automatically cast you in a bad light, which is probably what the diminished Valley has become for WSU under the Marshall plan.

[IlliniShocker]

One small reminder of why it would be nice for WSU to be somewhere other than the Valley, from ESPN's coverage of the game between Illinois and Iowa:

"IOWA CITY, Iowa -- Jon Ekey hit a 3-pointer in the final second to lift Illinois to a 66-63 victory over No. 24 Iowa on Saturday night.

Rayvonte Rice scored 15 points to lead the Illini (18-13, 7-11 Big Ten), who notched consecutive road wins against ranked opponents for the first time since 2005..."

In case those names sound familiar, you're right -- both key names are former Valley players who decided they wanted a bigger stage, even though Illinois (7-11 in the B1G?) is hardly in the spotlight on that ostensibly bigger stage.

Hey now, don't go running down my other team to make your point :D. But just to elaborate on it a little bit, Ekey is a 5th year graduate student who took advantage of that transfer rule, and Rayvonte is actually from Champaign. It doesn't diminish the point you're making, just shedding some light on those two particular situations.

But if we really want to keep that train rolling, in 2011-'12, Sam Maniscalco also used the graduate student transfer rule and transferred from Bradley to Illinois.

Come to think of it, thinking about all this is just depressing me again about the rebuild Illinois has been going through. Maybe that's why I've been clinging to the Shockers more than ever before :D

[wufan]

I believe the Valley will be displaying a couple of Illinois retreads next year with Shaw at Bradley and another big guy (who's name I can't spell, let alone pronounce) at SIU.