2017-18 Smack Talk

[MoValley John]

What leads you to believe KU's an upgrade?

KU isn't. It's a value based on a fan living in Kansas, reading Kansas media, being a fan of KU and overvaluing his school.

Kansas is a great BASKETBALL brand. What KU fans forget is that realignment is about media markets and football. And in the entire history of Kansas football, they've won six bowl games. Kansas would have the second smallest stadium in the B1G, a stadium they can't fill. As an athletic program with all of the advantages of competing in a "P-5" conference, the school hass only amassed eight national championships in all sports, five championships were in t/f and cross country, decades ago.

For media markets, they can only claim KC and Wichita, both only bring fragmented support. Mizzou could just as easilly bring in the KC market. Wichita is split between Kansas, Kansas State and maybe a snattering of OU fans. There is little to gain media wise for adding Kansas.

Once again, Kansas would bring a great basketball program, the problem being, basketball is secondary in the decision making process.

I'm not saying Kansas won't get to the B1G, but it's a much tougher road than many of their fans believe, far from a slam dunk. It appears that the administration fully understands, the school has never invested in football and are suddenly throwing out $300m. That means they have had the talks with the B1G and fully understand that in its current state, KU isn't a B1G consideration.

[Dave Stalwart]

It appears that the administration fully understands, the school has never invested in football and are suddenly throwing out $300m. That means they have had the talks with the B1G and fully understand that in its current state, KU isn't a B1G consideration.

I think this is exactly right. There was a rude awakening in a meeting somewhere, and they decided they better make the decision a little easier for the B1G. And I think the plan will work. Personally, I think the B1G is the place where KU ought to be trying to get. When you look at what options would be available to them and the geography involved, it's pretty clear. But let there be no doubt that it was unlikely before. This move demonstrates that it probably wasn't even close.

Likewise, WSU wasn't even close to getting into the AAC before we hired Marshall, went on a huge successful streak and then hired a university President who "Presides Angry." A lot of preparation had to happen. Where preparation meets opportunity is where success or "luck" are.

Good luck to KU on getting where they want to go. But if it doesn't work out, we will see you in the AAC in a couple years :)

[MoValley John]

I think this is exactly right. There was a rude awakening in a meeting somewhere, and they decided they better make the decision a little easier for the B1G. And I think the plan will work. Personally, I think the B1G is the place where KU ought to be trying to get.

Yup. The administration has had a wakeup call. The fans haven't. In the entire history of Kansas athletics, everything has been basketball. They even built luxury dorms for the basketball players to smoke dope and rape underage girls, but not for football. They finally spent a few million to build the football players a locker room, they brag about it, but it's no better than the lockers at Iowa State. Probably not as nice as the Iowa State lockers, actually.

Suddenly, they realized that the ship is soon going to sail, there are only so many seats, and they don't have a reservation. The administration can't tell the fans that they are on the outside looking in, the fans can't handle such a stark reality. Instead, they put together an actual foitball strategy and throw a $300mm Hail Mary, in hopes of catching that last seat in standby.

[Dave Stalwart]

Yup. The administration has had a wakeup call. The fans haven't. In the entire history of Kansas athletics, everything has been basketball. They even built luxury dorms for the basketball players to smoke dope and rape underage girls, but not for football. They finally spent a few million to build the football players a locker room, they brag about it, but it's no better than the lockers at Iowa State. Probably not as nice as the Iowa State lockers, actually.

Suddenly, they realized that the ship is soon going to sail, there are only so many seats, and they don't have a reservation. The administration can't tell the fans that they are on the outside looking in, the fans can't handle such a stark reality. Instead, they put together an actual foitball strategy and throw a $300mm Hail Mary, in hopes of catching that last seat in standby.

I love everything about this post.

[WuShock16]

I have been out of the loop for the last week, so I am a bit behind on some of this latest info.

Does KU actually have $300 million on hand to invest into football, or did they come to the realization that the $300m figure is what is needed and that they need to raise that money (which may or may not happen)?

[vbird53]

I have been out of the loop for the last week, so I am a bit behind on some of this latest info.

Does KU actually have $300 million on hand to invest into football, or did they come to the realization that the $300m figure is what is needed and that they need to raise that money (which may or may not happen)?

...and, as a Kansas tax payer, where is that cash coming from if it's already in the bank?

[Fred Marrs]

Welcome back @Fred Marrs:! It has been along time since Shockernet has witnessed your capacious paragraphs.

Thank you kind sir. I note your use of the word "capacious", not "capricious". In fact, I had more; but I thought its existing length might defend itself from being read for substance, so I quit.

[Aargh]

I think the $300 mill is coming from their GoR, plus borrowing money on future GoR's. KU is placing a huge wager on FB, and they're definitely not using house money.

Football at KU is skewered permanently. Any FB coach good enough to pull off the rebuild KU needs is too good to want to play second fiddle behind the basketball coach - particularly with the margin by which that coach would be second fiddle. KU is a basketball school with a deceased football program.

I believe Mangino is about the only former KU coach who stayed in coaching at any decent level after coaching at KU. It's a career-ending job. Mangine took them to an orange bowl and got fired because he wasn't nice enough to the players. Now he's an assistant.

Besides, they hired Lew Perkins as their AD. Any school that hires Perkins has their football program sabotaged. UConn is distraught that they got left behind in the AAC during realignment (Perkins started their program). KU went further into the tank under Perkins. WSU lost their program completely under Perkins. The guy has a track record.

[MoValley John]

I have been out of the loop for the last week, so I am a bit behind on some of this latest info.

Does KU actually have $300 million on hand to invest into football, or did they come to the realization that the $300m figure is what is needed and that they need to raise that money (which may or may not happen)?

From what I understand, the $300mm is an estimate. The first goal is a real, full length, indoor practice facility dedicated to football. Once those funds are secured and the project completed, they will move on to the stadium. Unless they have since been released, there are no renderings for the new stadium, just a $300mm cost estimate for the entire project. While I dont think Iowa State will make the cut, the Cyclones are miles and miles ahead of the Jayhawks. Jack Trice stadium is larger, newly remodeled and beautiful. And Iowa State isn't finished.

[Shocker1976]

Nobody is leaving the ACC. There are some schools that would love to jump to the B1G, but the current GOR locks them in, long term. All ACC schools signed away their rights to the conference, so a move would cost the school hundreds of millions over the term of the GOR. Virginia and NC are set.

As usual with contracts involving big dollars and the assignment of certain rights, this GOR is a complex legal issue and IMO will be negotiated by the interested parties. These interested parties will include the conferences, individual schools and the media outlets who purchased certain rights. The 2025 expiration date for Big 12 GOR leads me to believe the Big 12 implosion will occur before that date. And when the implosion occurs all cards will be on the table regards realignment; no way will media outlets (especially ESPN) sit on the sidelines and wait for University Presidents to decide how the GOR cookies will crumble.

Damages will be determined by what actually confronts the new aligned schools, not some simple math calculation based on currently stated valuations in an existing contract. Clearly if the media company does not reduce the amount of payments it makes for such rights regardless of who stays and who leaves the conference, then there are no damages to be paid by the departing school(s) as the value of the contract was not diminished by their departures. A recent example of this is when Missouri and Texas A&M left the Big 12, ESPN and Fox did not reduce their payments. As of this date, to my knowledge, no media outlet has re-valued a GOR given the departure of a conference member(s).

In fact, I think the media outlets, especially ESPN, will play significant roles in downsizing and realigning existing P5 conferences to a P4 reality.

[Jes'Me]

Besides, they hired Lew Perkins as their AD. Any school that hires Perkins has their football program sabotaged. UConn is distraught that they got left behind in the AAC during realignment (Perkins started their program). KU went further into the tank under Perkins. WSU lost their program completely under Perkins. The guy has a track record.

Thinking about Lee Perkins and football is a lot like thinking about Captain Hook and foreplay.

[Aargh]

I think there is no doubt that the TV people let the AAC know that WSU would add value to the conference.

[MoValley John]

As usual with contracts involving big dollars and the assignment of certain rights, this GOR is a complex legal issue and IMO will be negotiated by the interested parties. These interested parties will include the conferences, individual schools and the media outlets who purchased certain rights. The 2025 expiration date for Big 12 GOR leads me to believe the Big 12 implosion will occur before that date. And when the implosion occurs all cards will be on the table regards realignment; no way will media outlets (especially ESPN) sit on the sidelines and wait for University Presidents to decide how the GOR cookies will crumble.

Damages will be determined by what actually confronts the new aligned schools, not some simple math calculation based on currently stated valuations in an existing contract. Clearly if the media company does not reduce the amount of payments it makes for such rights regardless of who stays and who leaves the conference, then there are no damages to be paid by the departing school(s) as the value of the contract was not diminished by their departures. A recent example of this is when Missouri and Texas A&M left the Big 12, ESPN and Fox did not reduce their payments. As of this date, to my knowledge, no media outlet has re-valued a GOR given the departure of a conference member(s).

In fact, I think the media outlets, especially ESPN, will play significant roles in downsizing and realigning existing P5 conferences to a P4 reality.

Except that realignment of teams from one "P-4" to another make little sense for ESPN. At the end of the day, we are talking four, 16 team conferences. 64 teams. Perhaps ESPN wants to dictate some, but the GOR in the ACC is insane. Walk away whenever. Unfortunately, each university has assigned all sports media rights to the ACC until 2036. The cost to leave would be in the hundreds of millions, negotiated or litigated still would be more than a school could stomach.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/17118743/john-swofford-solidifies-conference-future-acc-network

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

I'm not going to waste my time trying to dig up links for stuff I know is a fact.

Those who refuse to learn from others who have gone before them are some of the most ignorant people who have ever lived. You are fitting very well into that category.

These are old stories and difficult to find on the internet. Those stories aren't archived on free sites. You will need to visit the library.

Get real; the mini-troll has no interest in learning about the Shockers; if he did a simple google search would provide information sufficient to educate the troll.

Come on @mini-shock... Go do a simple google search for all that information that isn't archived on free sites and is hard to find! It's so hard to do, it's easy! Besides, anonymous posters on a message board are giving you 100% indisputable information. Forget independent verification! Just believe it! All of it! When has a message board post ever contained factual errors?!?!

/sarcasm

Some of you are just way too focused on "outing" trolls. Just present your case honestly and fairly. If there are trolls out there, they will out themselves on their own soon enough. This is why I disagree with the "if only Fever was here" folks. His approach doesn't help with trolls. Trolls love his attention, and good posters get drug through the mud due to his overzealous witch hunting tactics.

*steps off soap box*
*remembers it is summer and questions why he is even posting at all*

[Cdizzle]

Come on @mini-shock... Go do a simple google search for all that information that isn't archived on free sites and is hard to find! It's so hard to do, it's easy!

/sarcasm

Some of you are just way too focused on "outing" trolls. Just present your case honestly and fairly. If there are trolls out there, they will out themselves on their own soon enough. This is why I disagree with the "if only Fever was here" folks. His approach doesn't help with trolls. Trolls love his attention, and good posters get drug through the mud due to his overzealous witch hunting tactics.

*steps off soap box*
*remembers it is summer and questions why he is even posting at all*

Says the troll.

:tyrannosaurus: