Future

[proshox]

Defense is preventing your opponent from scoring. CF's blocks are the "swat" variety. From behind as his man is by him.

He blocked multiple people from in front. He isn't a dominating defender by any stretch, but defense isn't going to keep him off the court unless we find someone that can absolutely dominate opposing point guards.

[im4wsu]

I had been encouraged by the posts I had been reading about DS. Today I looked at his season
stats and they just were NOT very impressive - not what I was expecting from a quality juco player
playing against lesser competition. Based on the stats I saw I just don't see him in the PG mix next
year. I am always happy to be proven wrong by players I question. I questioned TT and EH early on
when almost everyone was getting overly excited about them - you can check my posts. CJK is
the newcomer that intrigues me. Not suppose to have an outside shot but extremely athletic who
likes to play defense. If he can take care of the ball, drive, see the court and dish he could be the
surprise we need, but I think we will be in good hands with multiple players who can handle the ball. I
think our three point shooting improves significantly next year but our defense will not be as
dominant. We will win the valley and dance again. Of this I feel confident.

I haven't seen DS or looked at his stats compared to others, but the 247 link in post #161 above shows him as the #2 Combo Guard. Stats can be, but not necessarily are, misleading, particularly with respect to juco players.

If passes could be segregated into categories like "great," "good," "average/adequate," "poor" and "abysmal," on some teams it may take a great or good pass to result in an assist where an average pass may as likely be a turnover as an assist; on other teams, even adequate passes are 75% assists and poor passes are just poor passes result in nothing more than continued play 50% of the time, turnover the other 50% of the time. I've always been amazed how Antoine Carr and Larry Bird could take abysmal passes and turn them into assists/points/and-ones. We've all seen Fred/Ron/Simon (yes, even JR Simon) make some dandy passes that were botched on the receiving end. Wamakota, Nurger, Kelley are not AC or Larry Bird and have made some very good passes look abysmal.

A good pass to a shooter in a catch and shoot position can also make all the difference between a score and an opportunity to rebound. Receiving a pass at chest level for a catch and shoot increases the shooting percentage as compared to receiving the pass at knee level, all other things like defense and timing being equal.

I'm not making any comment about Daishon Smith or any other Shocker's ability, just saying that numbers on a stat sheet do not reflect the 3-pt shot off the glass from the corner or the Washpun game-winning shot that went up 10 feet off the back of the iron and dropped through, or the FVV layup that laid on the rim for eternity before falling out any different from the 3-pt swish from the corner, the game-winning shot that hits nothing but net or the layup airball. On the stat sheet they all look the same. Likewise, assists and turnovers all look the same on the stat sheet. If the receiver does not score, there is no assist.

I can't wait to see how a #2 combo guard performs in a Shocker uniform. Hopefully having the type of talent Gregg has assembled will result in better statistics for him.

[newshock1234]

Daishon Smith averaged 16 ppg 5.5 boards and 4.3 assist while shooting 37% from 3 point land this year. I don't how you can look at those and think he's gonna suck

[im4wsu]

He blocked multiple people from in front. He isn't a dominating defender by any stretch, but defense isn't going to keep him off the court unless we find someone that can absolutely dominate opposing point guards.

Blocking shots is not the only measure of defense, and not even close to the best measure. Neither is steals, although a steal if more valuable to the team than a block because not only is an opposition opportunity to score eliminated, but the steal actually gains possession for an opportunity to score. The important measure on defense isn't in the individual statistics records. A player may have a bunch of steals, but may also give up a lot of scores by attempting a steal and failing. A blocked shot may result from allowing a player a shot opportunity due to lack of good defense and then "recovering" and saving the day. But what percentage of those situations result in a blocked shot? 10%, 50%, 75%? Those would be "statistics" more revealing to me.

Gregg wants 45 (it may be 35, I cannot specifically recall) deflections a game on defense. That can be a block or a steal, or simply deflecting the ball out of bounds or making the opponent chase the ball down at mid court. Most deflections result in offensive inefficiency for the opponent (unfortunately, some deflections go right to a wide open three-point shooter not close to the action who then scores). More than one commentator in the last 60 days has described Shocker defense as a unit moving together. It fills the lanes, makes passing difficult, digs at the post down low, but adjusts to cover the arc (most of the time).

we'd all love to have a Bill Russell protecting the rim and controlling blocked shots. Blocked shots are not a bad thing, but defense, real defense, is team generated, putting the other team in position to have to take tough shots every time down the floor and the Shockers under Marshall do that superbly.

[proshox]

Blocking shots is not the only measure of defense, and not even close to the best measure. Neither is steals, although a steal if more valuable to the team than a block because not only is an opposition opportunity to score eliminated, but the steal actually gains possession for an opportunity to score. The important measure on defense isn't in the individual statistics records. A player may have a bunch of steals, but may also give up a lot of scores by attempting a steal and failing. A blocked shot may result from allowing a player a shot opportunity due to lack of good defense and then "recovering" and saving the day. But what percentage of those situations result in a blocked shot? 10%, 50%, 75%? Those would be "statistics" more revealing to me.

Gregg wants 45 (it may be 35, I cannot specifically recall) deflections a game on defense. That can be a block or a steal, or simply deflecting the ball out of bounds or making the opponent chase the ball down at mid court. Most deflections result in offensive inefficiency for the opponent (unfortunately, some deflections go right to a wide open three-point shooter not close to the action who then scores). More than one commentator in the last 60 days has described Shocker defense as a unit moving together. It fills the lanes, makes passing difficult, digs at the post down low, but adjusts to cover the arc (most of the time).

we'd all love to have a Bill Russell protecting the rim and controlling blocked shots. Blocked shots are not a bad thing, but defense, real defense, is team generated, putting the other team in position to have to take tough shots every time down the floor and the Shockers under Marshall do that superbly.

I never equated blocked shots with good defense. I was noting that Mr. Obvious was being disingenuous when he implied that CF had blocks was because he was beating by his man off the dribble – his blocks came straight up or as the help defender.

On defense, CF did a fine job of keeping guards in front of him. With that said, he couldn't harass guards like TC, RB, of FV do (which is the current Shocker Standard) and it seemed like players made a number of “guarded” shots. I saw a positive trend from him throughout the year and I expect it to continue into next year.

Bottom line – CF can get us into our offense, he sets teammates up in every game he played this year (sometimes it was the hockey assist), he can handle the ball, he can shoot it off the dribble, he will be better off without the constraints that came with this year’s offense and he is adequate on defense. Landry can do all of the above, but I think he provides more relative value at the two or three versus any other current shocker who can play the two or three (including CF).

[asiseeit]

1. Assist to turnover ratio not good at all and against unknown level of competition
2. 41% FG not that great - again against questionable competition
3. Didn't say he would suck but he would have to beat out CF, LS, TT, and a bigger
more athletic CJK.......let's just say he has his work cut out for him
4. Hope he is the real deal but has to leap frog some good talent at both guard positions
5. Good luck to him ! I hope he is that good that he can be an outstanding player for us

[GreatWhiteBuffalo]

Do we think there is a chance Kelly leaves? That guy was more detriment than benefit in the Dance. I would hope Hamilton could figure it out and take Kelly's minutes.

[im4wsu]

I never made the statement that CF blocking shots meant he was good at defense. I was noting that Mr. Obvious was full of crap when he stated the only reason CF had blocks was because he was beating by his man off the dribble. CF did a fine job of keeping guards in front of him. With that said, he couldn't harass a guard in the TC, RB, of FV fashion.

I wasn't necessarily addressing your comment, but did not go back and quote all of the previous comments on shot blocking to give the full context. I use the quote feature on the latest post in a discussion just so there is some context and not a comment appearing out of nowhere, so sometimes that is misunderstood by the person who was "quoted."

CF, like anyone and everyone else on the squad, has had his fine defensive moments and then the other moments. The trend is encouraging in that the scale is tipping more toward the fine recently. Still, IMHO, a long way to go, though.

[choida]

Do we think there is a chance Kelly leaves? That guy was more detriment than benefit in the Dance. I would hope Hamilton could figure it out and take Kelly's minutes.

Dude did some questionable things in the Miami game, not just once but several occasions... Times where he should have kicked the ball back out

[ShockerExpress]

Dude did some questionable things in the Miami game, not just once but several occasions... Times where he should have kicked the ball back out

Can I get a whiff of whatever you two are smoking?

Sweet Lord..

[WstateU]

Can I get a whiff of whatever you two are smoking?

Sweet Lord..

[GreatWhiteBuffalo]

Can I get a whiff of whatever you two are smoking?

Sweet Lord..

What are you implying? You saying that I am an idiot for not liking what Kelly brings to the floor?

[choida]

What are you implying? You saying that I am an idiot for not liking what Kelly brings to the floor?

I think he's ass hurt for having to hear the truth... He stole the ball and tried taking it up soft... He rebounded it and took it soft, another time he tried to thunder dunk it in instead of just making the shot

[Dan]

Kelly has problems finishing for sure. He either takes it up soft and gets blocked or he goes up and throws a line drive pass at the backboard from 3 feet out. The guy is a good athlete but he needs to put in some serious work.

[ShoxRoxMySox]

In general I'm optimistic and excited for next year. But, I hope Shaq has finally figured it out once and for all. It seems each of the past two years he's almost fallen apart 1/3 of the way into the season before getting it together. Without knowledge behind the scenes, I wonder what finally made him take the necessary steps? Was it the seniors, coaching staff or just having "it" click within his head? With this year's seniors no longer able to push him everyday, I hope he's finally got it ready to roll from Day 1 next year, cause we're going to need him.