Wichita State vs Tarleton Game Thread 11-16-21

[ShockerLurker]

My main take away from this game is that we are probably a top 75ish team WITHOUT our NBA guy. So, we should be better with Etienne. I know he was sick last game, but he was throwing up trash the last two games.

If Etienne is supposed to play point guard in the NBA he needs to use all the attention he gets to create for other players. I have seen very little of that so far.

[Singeril]

Then maybe they should cool the rhetoric and just play the game.

I can remember multiple examples…..here’s two.
3 years ago, some of us realized there were issues within the team chemistry…we Called it out early. We were told we didn’t know what we were talking about. Turns out that, at the end of the season, that all came out as true. That bad chemistry hurt the team badly.
Last year, the “negative Nancy’s” were spot on (despite the condemnation by the Rainbow Connection) concerning the team’s deficiencies…It was a apparent all season (and the Shocks were fortunate to not have to play so many of the games). Come the post season, the results of those deficiencies showed up right on schedule. There was no surprises as it was seen by so many throughout the year. I want the Shockers to win, win, win. I want to see good fundamental basketball. I applaud their defense, for the most part, tonight. I deplore the mistakes that are truly high school mistakes and that college basketball players shouldn’t be making in their senior years. MTXE is more than a slogan…it is something that the team badly needs.

[asiseeit]

Ya, you wouldn't want to waste a scholarship on a 7'0 270 pound center (AM) who only led
the nation in FG%. All he needed was PT and although Photo isn't quite as large he has
even more potential than AM did as a freshman. Give him minutes ! I only noticed one
defensive lapse which he got pulled for. That is okay but explain it to him and get him
back in.

[WuTheOne]

* whoever said Ricky has a bit of TP in him is an idiot…. Such an insult to Ricky

Council calls his own number at times when he shouldn't. He celebrates his successes. His guy beat him down the court while Council was flexing after a make. He didn't look good driving to the hoop more often than he looked good doing it. When there are 3 guys packing the lane, driving to the hoop for an ESPN highlight dunk is not likely to be successful. It's more likely to result in the 4 TO's Council had tonight.

Council is still learning how his game works at the D1 level instead of at the HS level.

There's always the danger that if anybody gets on his butt hard enough to correct the weaker areas of his game, he enters the portal. Council is an incredible talent. He needs to be incredibly coachable as well as talented. In my opinion he's got some "hero ball" in him and that doesn't tend to work out at this level.

[pie n eye]

I can remember multiple examples…..here’s two.
3 years ago, some of us realized there were issues within the team chemistry…we Called it out early. We were told we didn’t know what we were talking about. Turns out that, at the end of the season, that all came out as true. That bad chemistry hurt the team badly.
Last year, the “negative Nancy’s” were spot on (despite the condemnation by the Rainbow Connection) concerning the team’s deficiencies…It was a apparent all season (and the Shocks were fortunate to not have to play so many of the games). Come the post season, the results of those deficiencies showed up right on schedule. There was no surprises as it was seen by so many throughout the year. I want the Shockers to win, win, win. I want to see good fundamental basketball. I applaud their defense, for the most part, tonight. I deplore the mistakes that are truly high school mistakes and that college basketball players shouldn’t be making in their senior years. MTXE is more than a slogan…it is something that the team badly needs.

I’ll assume you meant to quote me on this post.

20-21: AAC regular season champs, NCAA birth
19-20: N/A due to COVID
18-19: NIT semifinals in a rebuilding year

Gosh, how terrible.

[ShockerExpress]

My main take away from this game is that we are probably a top 75ish team WITHOUT our NBA guy. So, we should be better with Etienne. I know he was sick last game, but he was throwing up trash the last two games.

If Etienne is supposed to play point guard in the NBA he needs to use all the attention he gets to create for other players. I have seen very little of that so far.

Yeah I have to agree with some of this. Need more from Tyson. That’s going to kind of decide how things go I think.

Seems like an NIT team without him. But, with him clicking, I think the ceiling is high. But they have to work some things out. Still very early.

[Stickboy46]

Council calls his own number at times when he shouldn't. He celebrates his successes. His guy beat him down the court while Council was flexing after a make. He didn't look good driving to the hoop more often than he looked good doing it. When there are 3 guys packing the lane, driving to the hoop for an ESPN highlight dunk is not likely to be successful. It's more likely to result in the 4 TO's Council had tonight.

Council is still learning how his game works at the D1 level instead of at the HS level.

There's always the danger that if anybody gets on his butt hard enough to correct the weaker areas of his game, he enters the portal. Council is an incredible talent. He needs to be incredibly coachable as well as talented. In my opinion he's got some "hero ball" in him and that doesn't tend to work out at this level.

Council feels like a ... No no no no no YES!!!! type of guy more often than not on his drives. They often look out of control and sometimes end up with misses or turnovers but it sure feels like he makes more than he doesn't.

[ShockerExpress]

I’ll assume you meant to quote me on this post.

20-21: AAC regular season champs, NCAA birth
19-20: N/A due to COVID
18-19: NIT semifinals in a rebuilding year

Gosh, how terrible.

Agree. I also don’t understand this “we’re lucky we didn’t play all the games last year” BS.

What?

We played Houston twice. Didn’t even get a shot at Memphis or SMU at home. Split with Houston.

It is truly mind numbing.

Many people on here really having to twist themselves into knots because they don’t like IB yet.

[Kel Varnsen]

I am not gonna form a hard opinion until I see us this weekend.

I don't like the offense most of the time. Defense and rebounding (generally....not necessarily tonight) seems improved.

But I want to see us against known, expected, good teams. It could be that these 3 teams are better than we think they are. Or maybe we play to the level of competition. Or maybe we truly aren't that good right now.

I feel like I will have a better feel after this weekend. Although November basketball isn't always pretty.

Anyway, I am still in a wait and see approach for the most part.

Very measured approach. I think that’s the best way to go at this point. So much to be proven and so many wild cards.

[pie n eye]

Not knocking MU's game tonight especially the 2nd half, but we were going to win this game
with or without him. If we are going to be a dance team we are going to need Pohto and he
won't get better on the bench. Opportunity missed tonight. In addition, he is the only
center so far for next season and we have not had this level of freshman center in awhile so
keep him happy. Can't afford to lose him so more PT please !

Kenny is averaging 14 min in his first three games as a freshman. That’s a lot.

He’s already better than any back up center we’ve had in years but tonight wasn’t his best game so he didn’t play as many minutes. He still got 10.

Kenny will he just fine.

[Shockm]

Council feels like a ... No no no no no YES!!!! type of guy more often than not on his drives. They often look out of control and sometimes end up with misses or turnovers but it sure feels like he makes more than he doesn't.

The thing about Ricky is that 90% of the time he makes the decision to shoot before he makes a move. There are no decisions to be made depending on what happens afterward with assists rare.

[Singeril]

I’ll assume you meant to quote me on this post.

20-21: AAC regular season champs, NCAA birth
19-20: N/A due to COVID
18-19: NIT semifinals in a rebuilding year

Gosh, how terrible.

Never said there weren’t some good things….and those have been praised as well. But I don’t hide and blow puff pastries into the air when the team isn’t playing well and has had issues. And, just think, how much better they could have been instead of stinking up the joint at the end of last season if they had played with MTXE. Think how much better they could have been in the bad chemistry year if ego hadn’t been the driving factor. These results were good…they could have been better. And last season, without having to play some meaty games, didn’t really mean quite what some may think it did…the post season proved that. And 16 turnovers tonight shows that the team has a lot of work to do.

[Singeril]

Agree. I also don’t understand this “we’re lucky we didn’t play all the games last year” BS.

What?

We played Houston twice. Didn’t even get a shot at Memphis or SMU at home. Split with Houston.

It is truly mind numbing.

Many people on here really having to twist themselves into knots because they don’t like IB yet.

Nothing to do with liking IB (I do) or not. And, indeed, we were fortunate to not have to play all those games. I don’t think we would have been conference champs. And, the post season told us a lot as well.

[Arizona Shocker]

Isaac Brown with the best 25 game start for a MBB coach in WSU history (19-6). Pretty good for a guy who just "rolls the balls out" and "let's the dawgs be dawgs" lmao

This…100%. And he calls a f***** timeout when appropriate. Recruiting class was decent too with Pohto, Abide, Qua, Pleasant. Healed a hurting program that it’s own NBA stars weren’t even truly backing until he took over. Won ACC coach of the year. Won the damn ACC in his first season (3G never did that). We’re 3-0. No one on this board could have done that. Thanks IB for giving a s***.

Now if you could just stomp around with a fierce scowl and flick your wristwatch incessantly while drinking half Gatorade - half water mix, that would be ideal.

[pie n eye]

Never said there weren’t some good things….and those have been praised as well. But I don’t hide and blow puff pastries into the air when the team isn’t playing well and has had issues. And, just think, how much better they could have been instead of stinking up the joint at the end of last season if they had played with MTXE. Think how much better they could have been in the bad chemistry year if ego hadn’t been the driving factor. These results were good…they could have been better. And last season, without having to play some meaty games, didn’t really mean quite what some may think it did…the post season proved that. And 16 turnovers tonight shows that the team has a lot of work to do.

It’s your choice to ignore a seasons worth of games last year because you were unhappy with the way the last one turned out. Or to downplay the conference championship.

You can assume you know how 19-20 would’ve finished even though no one does.

And you can refuse to acknowledge the incredible accomplishment that was making the NIT run in that gigantic rebuilding year.

None of it proves that the “negative Nancy’s” were right.