Jeb Bush or Donald Trump?

[shocka khan]

So straying over to Jeb Bush, I noted he made a statement last week that Americans aren't working hard enough. Personally, I think most Americans are working too hard and was happy to see Ted Cruz take him to task.

[Dave Stalwart]

So straying over to Jeb Bush, I noted he made a statement last week that Americans aren't working hard enough. Personally, I think most Americans are working too hard and was happy to see Ted Cruz take him to task.

I think right now in this country, both opinions are actually true. There is a big part of the U.S. that isn't working hard enough, and another big part of the U.S. that is working too hard. They could debate themselves in circles all day long on that topic.

[MoValley John]

So straying over to Jeb Bush, I noted he made a statement last week that Americans aren't working hard enough. Personally, I think most Americans are working too hard and was happy to see Ted Cruz take him to task.

Keep in mind that I'm not a Bush supporter, that said, the Bush comment was taken completely out of context. Bush made a statement, one in which almost everyone would agree, and it was reduced to a sound bite. Republicans saw blood in the water and even they feed on it. This is a big problem with today's politics.

http://www.businessinsider.com/jeb-bush-work-more-hours-quote-2015-7

[Play Angry]

I hate when quotes like Bush's are so obviously manipulated for a sound byte. It was obvious he wasn't saying full-time employees should work longer weeks, but rather that full-time employment jobs need to be added (as opposed to the many part-time gigs people are stuck in).

You don't even have to take a Biden quote out of context to make him look like an idiot but I guess (i) everyone likes a challenge, or (ii) the media has decided he has Tourette's or a comparable disability, so he gets a free pass for his bi-hourly foot in mouth moments.

[Play Angry]

Keep in mind that I'm not a Bush supporter, that said, the Bush comment was taken completely out of context. Bush made a statement, one in which almost everyone would agree, and it was reduced to a sound bite. Republicans saw blood in the water and even they feed on it. This is a big problem with today's politics.

http://www.businessinsider.com/jeb-b...s-quote-2015-7

Beat me to it - completely agreed.

[shocka khan]

You don't even have to take a Biden quote out of context to make him look like an idiot but I guess (i) everyone likes a challenge, or (ii) the media has decided he has Tourette's or a comparable disability, so he gets a free pass for his bi-hourly foot in mouth moments.

I think it's because of a mental disability. But you're right, Biden sure says a lot of stupid stuff.

[shocka khan]

Keep in mind that I'm not a Bush supporter, that said, the Bush comment was taken completely out of context. Bush made a statement, one in which almost everyone would agree, and it was reduced to a sound bite. Republicans saw blood in the water and even they feed on it. This is a big problem with today's politics.

http://www.businessinsider.com/jeb-b...s-quote-2015-7

This will continue to be a problem as long as the Republican side has 15 to 20 candidates. When you have that many people running, it's very difficult to differentiate yourself from the rest of the crowd. As a result, you get people saying outrageous things (like Trump) and candidates attacking each other so as to appeal to their constituency.

I'm also thinking that with the republican party being so fragmented, it will be exceedingly difficult to rally behind a single candidate.

Americans deserve better than what we're getting out of either party.

[SB Shock]

This will continue to be a problem as long as the Republican side has 15 to 20 candidates. When you have that many people running, it's very difficult to differentiate yourself from the rest of the crowd.

Could this be by design? Maybe the republican mob bosses are afraid that if their was limited choices of only viable candidates, the support might start flow to a candidate they don't like. This way they dilute the support for any candidate from being to great, and then the better funded, organizes candidate (who they want) will emerge in the end.

[shocka khan]

Could this be by design? Maybe the republican mob bosses are afraid that if their was limited choices of only viable candidates, the support might start flow to a candidate they don't like. This way they dilute the support for any candidate from being to great, and then the better funded, organizes candidate (who they want) will emerge in the end.

Very insightful comment that explains a potential strategy. And it would not be surprising, being that we've heard rumblings in the media that the 'party mainstream' (I think this is a code word for the large contributors/party operatives) like Karl Rove were trying to make sure that this happened.

[Rlh04d]

You don't even have to take a Biden quote out of context to make him look like an idiot but I guess (i) everyone likes a challenge, or (ii) the media has decided he has Tourette's or a comparable disability, so he gets a free pass for his bi-hourly foot in mouth moments.

If Biden chooses to run for President, it'll be non-stop. He got a lot more mocking about it early on in his Vice Presidency, but I think in general the media gives him quite a bit of slack due to his personal situation. He makes some ridiculous political gaffes, but he's suffered from so much personal tragedy, and his son Beau Biden seemed to be so universally respect, that he gets more leeway than many.

[Rlh04d]

This will continue to be a problem as long as the Republican side has 15 to 20 candidates. When you have that many people running, it's very difficult to differentiate yourself from the rest of the crowd. As a result, you get people saying outrageous things (like Trump) and candidates attacking each other so as to appeal to their constituency.

I'm also thinking that with the republican party being so fragmented, it will be exceedingly difficult to rally behind a single candidate.

Holy crap. I must not have been paying as much attention as I normally do ... I didn't realize there were already 15 definite Republican candidates. That is ridiculous.

[shocka khan]

The Wall Street Journal published a copy of the OMB IG audit report, and I have it, but it is too large to upload.

It's a pretty interesting read, if you're interested in that kind of stuff.

I found a link to an online copy of the report, which is 66 pages long...........

https://www.opm.gov/our-inspector-general/reports/2014/federal-information-security-management-act-audit-fy-2014-4a-ci-00-14-016.pdf

[MoValley John]

This will continue to be a problem as long as the Republican side has 15 to 20 candidates. When you have that many people running, it's very difficult to differentiate yourself from the rest of the crowd. As a result, you get people saying outrageous things (like Trump) and candidates attacking each other so as to appeal to their constituency.

I'm also thinking that with the republican party being so fragmented, it will be exceedingly difficult to rally behind a single candidate.

Americans deserve better than what we're getting out of either party.

It doesn't matter if there are two or twenty candidates. This has become the standard strategy for everyone.

1. Candidate makes statement.
2. Opponent or opposing special interest group parses statement and declares candidate either "out of touch" or too extreme.
3. Candidate tries to correct comment and apply context.
4. Opponent ignores context and continues to bash candidate for original, out of context statement.
5. Press reports on "fallout" from statement.
6.Opponent continues to drive home out of context statement.
7. Press reports scandal brewing over controversy.
8. American public buys the mistepresentation.
9. Candidate declared unviable.

[Rlh04d]

So I have a serious question about Donald Trump. Does anyone else get the feeling he's intentionally trying to turn the Republican primary into a sham as an elaborate trolling attempt?

The reason I've started to consider this is that I recently stumbled on a quote from him in 2012 regarding Romney's campaign:

“He had a crazy policy of self deportation which was maniacal. It sounded as bad as it was, and he lost all of the Latino vote. He lost the Asian vote. He lost everybody who is inspired to come into this country.”

“Republicans didn’t have anything going for them with respect to Latinos and with respect to Asians."

“The Democrats didn’t have a policy for dealing with illegal immigrants, but what they did have going for them is they weren’t mean-spirited about it. They didn’t know what the policy was, but what they were is they were kind.”

Source: Newsmax Interview

Compare those statements to what he's saying now about immigrants, and there is absolutely zero doubt that Trump either did not believe anything he said in 2012, or does not believe anything he is saying now. If, in fact, he actually believed what he said in 2012, then I don't think you can interpret his current comments as anything other than openly sabotaging the Republican Party. Which, regardless of his intention, is something a recent Washington Post article presented as likely.

On the other hand, fine. Politicians lie all the time, and who knows what any of these people actually believe, so vocalizing two POLAR opposite opinions in just a three year difference isn't that big of a change. But I'm actually struggling to find anything that Trump believed prior to 2011 that comes close to meshing with major conservative values.

Until recently at least he was "very pro-choice," including regarding partial-birth-abortions, and never vocalized a stance against abortion until 2011.

He's donated extensively to Democratic candidates, and helped make sure the Democrats could pass Obamacare, though at least 2010.

He has zero high ground on any statements about the Clinton Foundation, considering he's donated more than $100k to it himself, likely as an attempt to curry political favor.

In past forays into politics he was pro-government health care. In fact his exact statements were: "I'm very liberal when it comes to health care. I believe in universal health care."

In that same foray into politics, he wanted to MASSIVELY tax the rich to pay down the US debt.

He called President Bush evil and "maybe the worst President in the history of this country." In the same interview, he promoted diplomatic outreach with Iran.

And obviously the absolute laughable attempts at promoting the values of "traditional marriage" while on his third marriage himself.

Apparently I'm not the only one wondering this. The comment about Donald Trump almost playing the role of Stephen Colbert's conservative-pundit mock-character actually strikes me as very true here.

I'm not sure at this point if he's just an insane egomaniac with zero true personal beliefs beyond what he can say to get attention for himself, or if he has such a bizarre sense of humor than he's trolling the entire country right now. I almost expect him to get the Republican nomination and then start openly laughing at everyone for giving it to him, before donating his entire campaign chest to Hillary. Or, more likely, not get the nomination, run as an independent, and siphon off as much of the radical conservative base as possible to guarantee a Republican loss.

The funny thing to me is that so many people can see this guy change literally every political opinion he ever had at 66 years old, but because he generally changed them to things they agree with, they immediately accept it as just "correcting" his opinions rather than the obvious fact that he doesn't believe ANYTHING he says.

[Dave Stalwart]

I love a good conspiracy theory. I wonder if he's also behind Fred getting left off the USA team.