Russia-Ukraine War

[ShockerPrez]

I get it. So you're just saying they should show Sergei in some undisclosed location in some undisclosed city, whoopin ass, and not giving enough info to pinpoint his location?

At the minimum. This is for the world consumption. Ukrainians on the ground already know what's up in their town and what they are planning. That's as good as it's gonna get for them, I'm afraid. Anything being televised further is just for our knowledge and can only be used to alert Russians and put in their minds that everyone is fair game. Whereas if their had been any reservations before, it's gone.

It's easier to show a 19 year old private a video from his propaganda officer of Sergei and say, "See Misha, you need not worry about Ukraine civilian they kill you". As opposed to Misha's humanity hesitating at first, then getting torched.

It's not about justifying Russia. It's Russia using it as well to sway their soldiers to do the bad.

I just don't think it's helping Ukraine in the end.

[wufan]

At the minimum. This is for the world consumption. Ukrainians on the ground already know what's up in their town and what they are planning. That's as good as it's gonna get for them, I'm afraid. Anything being televised further is just for our knowledge and can only be used to alert Russians and put in their minds that everyone is fair game. Whereas if their had been any reservations before, it's gone.

It's easier to show a 19 year old private a video from his propaganda officer of Sergei and say, "See Misha, you need not worry about Ukraine civilian they kill you". As opposed to Misha's humanity hesitating at first, then getting torched.

It's not about justifying Russia. It's Russia using it as well to sway their soldiers to do the bad.

I just don't think it's helping Ukraine in the end.

This is absolutely true. One of my college professors worked as a low level intelligence agent for the NSA as a grad student in Ireland. This was in the mid 80s and his job was to read all news on Northern Ireland and send it to his handler.

He quit when they tried to get him friendly with known terrorists.

Point being, this type of intelligence gathering is still performed by governments all over the world.

[Shockm]

Ukraine actually lost out when they agreed (with Western Europe and President Clinton) to give up their nukes to Russia (in the agreement, the Western powers promised to support Ukraine if necessary) in the 90's so that the West wouldn't have another nuclear country to worry about. The West hasn't lived up to their part of the treaty. The trust doesn't go both ways.

[Shockm]

This is absolutely true. One of my college professors worked as a low level intelligence agent for the NSA as a grad student in Ireland. This was in the mid 80s and his job was to read all news on Northern Ireland and send it to his handler.

He quit when they tried to get him friendly with known terrorists.

Point being, this type of intelligence gathering is still performed by governments all over the world.

I’m not sure what you are saying. Are the Ukrainians (women and children too)the terrorists?

General Keane said that much of the strategy that Russia is trying to accomplish when they aim (and kill) at women, children, and multi-plex apartments/homes is to break the will of Ukrainians to fight back.

These people are grabbing a bag of personal belongings, and trying to get away. That’s all they have, and they are still getting hit by aimed missiles.

[C0|dB|00ded]

Ukraine actually lost out when they agreed (with Western Europe and President Clinton) to give up their nukes to Russia (in the agreement, the Western powers promised to support Ukraine if necessary) in the 90's so that the West wouldn't have another nuclear country to worry about. The West hasn't lived up to their part of the treaty. The trust doesn't go both ways.

Scandalous and disappointing if true. I say if true because your information sources are usually tainted, to put it nicely.

The fact that China is standing idly by while Russia commits these atrocities should leave no doubt that they are our enemy. A united China Russia vs. the world would create a fairly formidable "Axis of Evil". If the powder keg blew, you could have Iran and N. Korea joining in with the festivities. Almost 4 nuclear powers and they're all ****ed in the head.

I'm fairly certain we can protect ourselves from nuclear attack, but we can't protect the rest of the free world which renders our defenses moot. If this all goes tits up, Israel, Japan, and S. Korea are immediate targets by their neighbors.

[wichshock65]

Would Russia shutting off the spigot of the Nord Stream 1 be an act of war?

[pinstripers]

Scandalous and disappointing if true. I say if true because your information sources are usually tainted, to put it nicely.

The fact that China is standing idly by while Russia commits these atrocities should leave no doubt that they are our enemy. A united China Russia vs. the world would create a fairly formidable "Axis of Evil". If the powder keg blew, you could have Iran and N. Korea joining in with the festivities. Almost 4 nuclear powers and they're all ****ed in the head.

I'm fairly certain we can protect ourselves from nuclear attack, but we can't protect the rest of the free world which renders our defenses moot. If this all goes tits up, Israel, Japan, and S. Korea are immediate targets by their neighbors.

IF TRUE? I assumed everybody knew this.............see Budapest Memorandum.

[ShockerPrez]

I’m not sure what you are saying. Are the Ukrainians (women and children too)the terrorists?

General Keane said that much of the strategy that Russia is trying to accomplish when they aim (and kill) at women, children, and multi-plex apartments/homes is to break the will of Ukrainians to fight back.

These people are grabbing a bag of personal belongings, and trying to get away. That’s all they have, and they are still getting hit by aimed missiles.

I think the terrorist line was that the person he knew quit when his employer wanted him to get friendly with terrorists, in an intelligence role related to N Ireland. Not relating to Ukraine. No one is insinuating that Ukraine's are terrorists whatsoever.

[1972Shocker]

IF TRUE? I assumed everybody knew this.............see Budapest Memorandum.

The Budapest Memorandum was a political agreement and not a formal treaty. But if a country gives assurances in writing it shouldn't have to be a formal treaty in order to stand behind. At this point, I think there is very little confidence in the world community that you can count on the United States to stand behind anything it says or does.

Besides it really was just a Memorandum of Assurances and not a formal treaty and it was 27 years ago. Things change. Once Russia finishes taking over Ukraine they will get their nukes back.

[DUShock]

I’m not sure what you are saying. Are the Ukrainians (women and children too)the terrorists?

General Keane said that much of the strategy that Russia is trying to accomplish when they aim (and kill) at women, children, and multi-plex apartments/homes is to break the will of Ukrainians to fight back.

These people are grabbing a bag of personal belongings, and trying to get away. That’s all they have, and they are still getting hit by aimed missiles.

The Budapest Memo, originally included Russia as a guarantor, but the memo was revised in 2014 with the Putin’s invasion of the Crimea. The revised 2014 agreement include Germany and Japan as signers.

[wufan]

Ukraine actually lost out when they agreed (with Western Europe and President Clinton) to give up their nukes to Russia (in the agreement, the Western powers promised to support Ukraine if necessary) in the 90's so that the West wouldn't have another nuclear country to worry about. The West hasn't lived up to their part of the treaty. The trust doesn't go both ways.

While verbal promises were made to both Ukraine and Russia. These were not signed and were over 30 years ago. We broke promises to both of them.

[shoxlax]

Sort of a catch-22. They weren't combatants until they were invaded. The casus belli for the Russians becomes "see how our are troops are being attacked in Ukraine?"

Mother****er, what are they doing in Ukraine?

Wolverines!!!

[atlwsu]

My wife and I saw a film clip of this little boy walking alone, no one with in yards of him we both could not help but cry. We have grandsons his ageScreenshot_20220307-214751_Firefox.jpg

[WstateU]

My wife and I saw a film clip of this little boy walking alone, no one with in yards of him we both could not help but cry. We have grandsons his ageScreenshot_20220307-214751_Firefox.jpg

Heartbreaking.

[N Crestway]

Clearly the world is in a bad place right now and trending to a worse place. And the United States is far from imune to any of it. In fact, we are in the process of committing national suicide.

Also, it is not like Putin doesn't have some significant tools at his disposal including Russia's nuclear weapons in addition to its oil and gas producition and reserves. There are other retaliatory cards that Putin, supported by China, can and will deploy. While Russia is one of the world's largest producers and suppliers of fossil fuels it is the world's largest supplier of fertilizer. The mother's milk of modern, high-yield agriculture. The Russians just announced that they are suspending all exportation of fertilizers. In addition, Ukraine is one of the leading exporters of wheat, corn and other critical food items, the export of which looks to be controlled by Russia.

With a $31 trillion deficit, with more be added daily and more huge spending being promoted by the Biden administration, and double digit inflation already upon us we may very well be heading towards $10 a gallon gasoline and a doubling of food prices. Whether a debiltating recession or depression hits us before that happens remains to be seen.

The most important thing though is that we extinguish systemic racism by classifying everyone by their skin collor and learn everyone's preferred pronouns so as not to offend anyone with a micro-aggression. If we can do that, than we'll solve all our problems.

Russia by itself is now the worlds biggest wheat producer, possibly due in part to global warming. Would expect more wheat land to be opening up in Canada for the same reason. Most of Russia's resources will now be going to China and Asia which was Russia's and especially China's plan all along.

I'm hoping that our sanctions are more than just a multi year hiccup for the Russian economy. Due to my mistrust of economic statistics, I think the West is being a little overly optimistic about the strength and relative importance of its economies and the effects of its sanctions. China and its "friends" in Asia are going to reap the benefits of this war or perhaps series of Putin wars.