Defunding/Abolishing Police

[ShockTalk]

Again, why are our military who are knowingly surrounded by those who mean them hard held to such stricter standards that police against American citizens?

There are some cities that have absolutely **** on police and made their jobs more difficult. The increase in crime there is on the politicians, though in some cases, the police force isn't completely devoid of blame as their actions and protection of bad officers lead to the distrust and unrest as well. Pretending police are infallible and do no wrong is just as harmful as those who think they do no right.

Police are also trained, or should be, to keep their cool in chaotic situations. Hell, they expect the average citizen to do that with zero training. Why aren't they held to the same standards?

I also sincerely doubt she gets 25 years for this and she shouldn't. But she should spend some time behind bars for her actions. Just because she feels bad for what she did doesn't mean she gets to avoid the consequences of her actions. That would be a real shitty way for justice to work. And why is it so controversial to believe law enforcement should face the same consequences as an average Joe when the break the law or infringe upon someone else's rights? They're not above the law or any more important than you or me. They also go into a profession they know could potentially be dangerous and it's a risk the sign up for. Much like our military, who's jobs are far more dangerous in combat regions but have much more accountability and rules than police.

Again, some of these poor decisions and whatnot wouldn't be viewed so harshly by so many if police were found more accountable for their actions, especially the blatant misconduct that is often protected and I gave a few examples of previously. You get those shitheads off the force and stop protecting them and their ilk and you will definitely have less backlash for more minor things and misunderstanding that get blown out of proportion now because their is nearly no accountability far too often.

And if you're worried about crime, you should convince more police departments to focus on crime prevention or actually solving cases and less on revenue generation for petty ****. Reallocate some of those officers and actually solve cases. The rate of successfully solving crimes has gone way the **** down over the years and it's not because there aren't enough officers. It's more to do with departments focusing their efforts elsewhere. And in a few rare cases, it's on DAs who won't prosecute, but that's more recent and in very few select cities.

Another important factor in this case was that there was no imminent danger (I don't believe) to any officer. I thought I even read that the department may have considered the situation as one where even a taser should not have been used.

[Shockm]

You sound anti-police or at least dismissive of the difficulty of their job.

What is your job?

Did you grow up with your father leaving home each day, and you never knew whether he would return home? I know children of law enforcement who have talked about the fears their mother faced when a shooting of a police officer went out over the air waves. Their mothers often listened on scanners during a dangerous shift. They often feared the worse. Not an easy family existence.

Why would crime ever go back down, now that criminals are making a decision on the risk vs. reward of crimes. Some of the “smash and grab” criminals make $1,000 a day.

[MikeKennedyRulZ]

Another important factor in this case was that there was no imminent danger (I don't believe) to any officer. I thought I even read that the department may have considered the situation as one where even a taser should not have been used.

Shouldn't have been a factor at all. That has nothing to do with whether she was guilty of manslaughter.

[WuDrWu]

I appreciate everyone's input and the discussion on this topic. It's tough for sure. Certainly has me thinking, and for that I'm grateful.

[ShockTalk]

Shouldn't have been a factor at all. That has nothing to do with whether she was guilty of manslaughter.

"For a conviction, the state had to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Potter handled her firearm “recklessly” and showed culpable negligence in her actions that resulted in Wright’s death."

If she shouldn't have had even a taser in her hand, having a gun in her hand was reckless handling. Had the victim had a gun or weapon or there been imminent danger, there would have been no reckless use of a firearm.

[Shockm]

The definition of culpable negligence (without a reasonable doubt of C. N. ) in a chaotic situation is what I have a problem with. It almost (not quite) means that she intentionally was negligent. That’s hard when a policeman is fighting with a criminal (he was only a criminal because he was not obeying police orders).

Potter’s black training partner wanted to make a unnecessary stop (looking back it was unnecessary anyway. Potter had no history of police use of excessive force. Her partner wasn’t charged with anything, and it appears like he made a mistake because he didn’t move Wright to the back seat with cuffs, which allowed Wright to struggle later. Did Potter make a mistake amidst chaos or intentionally shoot Wright?

Even 10 years seems excessive to me for a mistake, even though it took someone else’s life. No one wants to defend “bad seed” cops, but from all accounts, Potter wasn’t a bad seed.

[Shockm]

We spend a lot of time talking about protecting police officers who are “bad seeds” (although I reject that Kim Potter was a bad seed), but here is an officer who got little national press for saving a life. It’s a couple of months old but still an encouraging story.

https://wset.com/news/nation-world/video-rookie-police-officer-saves-baby-from-choking

[WuDrWu]

We're going to see this play out again in Los Angeles where a 14 year old girl was apparently caught in the fire of a police officer at a store and has died. This appears to be beyond horrible.

[wufan]

Another important factor in this case was that there was no imminent danger (I don't believe) to any officer. I thought I even read that the department may have considered the situation as one where even a taser should not have been used.

My understanding was the opposite. I could be wrong, but legal insurrection stated that had she not yelled, “taser, taser, taser” and just fired her gun, it would have been a good shoot. Perhaps I’m mistaken though.

[wufan]

You sound anti-police or at least dismissive of the difficulty of their job.

What is your job?

Did you grow up with your father leaving home each day, and you never knew whether he would return home? I know children of law enforcement who have talked about the fears their mother faced when a shooting of a police officer went out over the air waves. Their mothers often listened on scanners during a dangerous shift. They often feared the worse. Not an easy family existence.

Why would crime ever go back down, now that criminals are making a decision on the risk vs. reward of crimes. Some of the “smash and grab” criminals make $1,000 a day.

I’m not a fan of the police as an institution. They rarely protect, and usually only make arrests “in the act” when the crime is victimless.

Policeman as individuals, I have no issues.

[Shockm]

I’m not a fan of the police as an institution. They rarely protect, and usually only make arrests “in the act” when the crime is victimless.

Policeman as individuals, I have no issues.

Interesting. So if you are being carjacked, or robbed, your wife or daughter is being raped, or your house if being invaded by gun point, do you call up the institution or the police as individuals? Most police run toward danger either way without regard to their safety and to help keep you more safe.

I'll ask some that I know to see if they feel supported by your differentiation.

[wufan]

Interesting. So if you are being carjacked, or robbed, your wife or daughter is being raped, or your house if being invaded by gun point, do you call up the institution or the police as individuals? Most police run toward danger either way without regard to their safety and to help keep you more safe.

I'll ask some that I know to see if they feel supported by your differentiation.

This is nonsensical and totally misses my point.

If I am being carjacked or robbed, I will likely lose my car or my possessions. If I survive the encounter I will call the police. They will take my statement and if it was my car, it will likely be recovered in an unrepairable state. My wallet will statistically not be returned. What good have the police done in this case that couldn’t be handled by my insurance or credit card company?

In the case of rape or home invasion, somebody is going to die…either the criminal or me and my family. What good do the police do me in that instance? They will investigate and maybe the next person is spared via an arrest if I didn’t get the job done myself. Even if no one dies…they got the jump on me or I’m not home, the damage is done, they leave and I’m still a victim.

The police do not protect you. It’s time to stop pretending they do.

[C0|dB|00ded]

This is nonsensical and totally misses my point.

If I am being carjacked or robbed, I will likely lose my car or my possessions. If I survive the encounter I will call the police. They will take my statement and if it was my car, it will likely be recovered in an unrepairable state. My wallet will statistically not be returned. What good have the police done in this case that couldn’t be handled by my insurance or credit card company?

In the case of rape or home invasion, somebody is going to die…either the criminal or me and my family. What good do the police do me in that instance? They will investigate and maybe the next person is spared via an arrest if I didn’t get the job done myself. Even if no one dies…they got the jump on me or I’m not home, the damage is done, they leave and I’m still a victim.

The police do not protect you. It’s time to stop pretending they do.

The presence of a police force has an immeasurable influence on society. In fact, the psychological effect is so great, some cities park empty police cars in random locations because of it.

WTF did they put in your eggnog? You sound crazier than normal!

And Merry Christmas!

[wufan]

The presence of a police force has an immeasurable influence on society. In fact, the psychological effect is so great, some cities park empty police cars in random locations because of it.

WTF did they put in your eggnog? You sound crazier than normal!

And Merry Christmas!

Merry Christmas!

This, again, has nothing to do with what I said.

[C0|dB|00ded]

The sound of a siren - the mere knowledge that "I've just called the cops", has stopped more assaults/burglaries than could ever be counted. To judge the effectiveness of law enforcement based on their response time is child-like thinking.

If you want to mitigate the response time risk, then sharpen up your situational awareness skills, pick up a potent stun gun, and go over scenarios in your head on how and when you will use it.