Coach Turgeon

[JVShocker]

That said, Turgeon isn't even in the same galaxy as Gregg.

[MikeKennedyRulZ]

[Shockm]

I've said it before, I'll say it again. Wichita State's natural position is a winning program. It takes incompetence for WSU to be a losing program. Mark Turgeon and Jim Schauss were competent people and thus Wichita State became a winner.

Maybe you didn't intend this but what it sounds like you said is that incompetence equals losing, therefore competence equals winning. I disagree. Harry Miller was a competent coach imo, and we won some years and lost in other years. We even had a few very good or even great players like Calvin Bruton, Vince Smith, Robert Elmore, and Cheese Johnson. Turgeon was a good coach imo, and although one could maybe say without Jim Schaus, he wouldn't have done as well as he did, but we will never know.

Ralph and Gregg however, brought our program to Excellence during their eras.

[Kel Varnsen]

Ned Ryerson!

[ShockingButTrue]

Even with the lack of success the Shocks had prior to turgeon's arrival, I was not happy with NIT appearance's, which was the bar during his time here.

The MVC whipped his a**.

[Kel Varnsen]

Even with the lack of success the Shocks had prior to turgeon's arrival, I was not happy with NIT appearance's, which was the bar during his time here.

The MVC whipped his a**.

Mark Turgeon's finishes in the Valley his last four seasons:

2, 2, 1, 6

Average finish: 2.75

I'd hardly say the Valley "whipped his a**".

[ShockingButTrue]

Mark Turgeon's finishes in the Valley his last four seasons:

2, 2, 1, 6

Average finish: 2.75

I'd hardly say the Valley "whipped his a**".

How about all 7 seasons, when you get the chance? And then submit a conclusive aggregate which would then illustrate his success "at this level."* He couldn't even win a post-season championship while he was in the Valley.

Wouldn't you yourself consider the Valley a "lower level" D1 conference? Turgeon did. He didn't come close to ever dominating that lower level conference.


* Average finish is 4th during turg's career, in a conference "he" considered "lower level." These are both facts.

[JVShocker]

There was a noticeable drop off in his last year at WSU, in terms of record, personnel, and I guess what you might call "upkeep" (or recruiting). He clearly lost interest. He was too busy fishing for a better position. I don't miss Turgeon, nor do I miss the style of play. If I had to guess, based on numbers above, he has performed at an equal level between the three schools/conferences. I'm guessing if someone were to research it, he would "average" a 4th-5th place in each conference.

[Topshock]

The best thing that happened during the Turg era was the facilities upgrade. That was gonna happen whether Turg was there or not so he shouldn’t take credit for that. His big class with Burns, Howard, Kampman and Miller was probably one of the most well rounded classes we’ve had as a group, will give him credit for that one.

Actually, let's give Tad Boyle a lot of the credit for that one.

[Shockm]

How about all 7 seasons, when you get the chance? And then submit a conclusive aggregate which would then illustrate his success "at this level."* He couldn't even win a post-season championship while he was in the Valley.

Wouldn't you yourself consider the Valley a "lower level" D1 conference? Turgeon did. He didn't come close to ever dominating that lower level conference.


* Average finish is 4th during turg's career, in a conference "he" considered "lower level." These are both facts.

The last year in 2007 is on Turgeon. He didn’t leave Gregg a great or even good team. They were a poor team. However, he ( and Tad Boyle too) deserves his credit for bringing us up from the abyss.

Let’s take an honest at WSU prior to Turgeon. Remember there are 10 MVC teams

Cohen- 5.1
89-90. MVC 2nd place ( didn’t remember Cohen being that high)
90-91 6th
91-92 8

Thompson 7.1
93 7
94 7
95 8

Randy 7.1
96 10
97 7
98 3
99 8
2000 8

Turgeon 4.0
01 9
02 5
03 3
04 2
05 2
06 1 Sweet 16 and Top 20 Ranking
07 6

Turgeon brought the program up from the abyss even with his 2007 year plunge. Cohen was my surprise but no one thinks he was a good coach. Turgeon and Boyle brought the program up to where Schaus could get a Gregg Marshall and then become a High Major.

Now add GM
08 9
09 5
10 2
11 2 NIT Championship/Top 20 Ranking
12 1 Top 20
13 2 F4, E 8, Sw. 16 Top 10
14 1. 35-1, #1 Seed, Top 10
15 1
16 1
17 1
Ave 2.5
No doubt about Gregg’s legacy

[ShockerPrez]

Maybe you didn't intend this but what it sounds like you said is that incompetence equals losing, therefore competence equals winning. I disagree. Harry Miller was a competent coach imo, and we won some years and lost in other years. We even had a few very good or even great players like Calvin Bruton, Vince Smith, Robert Elmore, and Cheese Johnson. Turgeon was a good coach imo, and although one could maybe say without Jim Schaus, he wouldn't have done as well as he did, but we will never know.

Ralph and Gregg however, brought our program to Excellence during their eras.

I'm saying if the AD and coach are competent, WSU should always be a winning program. Perhaps a .500 season every few years, but never an extended period of suck. We know what it looks like.

[ABC]

Turg was a good hire and did great things here. The MVC was also generally tougher than the tail end of WSU's time in the MVC. Some of the dislike of Turgeon is simply petty and irrational. "At this level" was a terrible quote and I am sure he regrets. I think it is a bit silly to hold a signle quote as if that represents his tenure. It does not.

I have some good info that he inquired about coming back if for some reason Marshall left.

[ShockTalk]

Turg was a good hire and did great things here. The MVC was also generally tougher than the tail end of WSU's time in the MVC. Some of the dislike of Turgeon is simply petty and irrational. "At this level" was a terrible quote and I am sure he regrets. I think it is a bit silly to hold a signle quote as if that represents his tenure. It does not.

I have some good info that he inquired about coming back if for some reason Marshall left.

And the heat got too high at Maryland??

Since you might know, I understand that MT pretty much "shielded" himself from players, particularly in the later years here. Once Boyle left and Spinelli was hired, the players did not connect with Spin. Thus, this disconnect may have lead to some of the player problems the last year.

Last, I was surprised that Spin left MT as top assistant at Maryland for the same position at Boston College. Anybody know if this was MT's doing or a split between Mark and Spin.
PS. For whatever reason, I did not care for Spinelli.

[Shockm]

Turg was a good hire and did great things here. The MVC was also generally tougher than the tail end of WSU's time in the MVC.

I agree with everything you said. Turgeon came following years of losing and he turned it around quickly, considering. However, Marshall’s first two years were bad years too and directly tied to what Mark left him. Additionally, Marshall’s final MVC years were with less competition ( although UNI was really good during that time), however, GM more than earned his money for the national recognition, NCAA banners, and big time wins WSU had during that time.

[ABC]

My understanding is that MT had an interest in coming back during his time at Texas A&M, not Maryland.