Exhbition: WSU vs Newman

[SB Shock]

Re: Exhbition: WSU vs Newman

Here is what I will be looking for in tonights game.

1. Win the game in convincing fashion. Winning is attitude. If you can't do it against the Newmans and UMKC of the world, you are going to struggle in the MVC.

I will give WSU the pass last night due mainly to the circumstances of Hannah not being available since someone in the athletic office is spending more time drinking coffee than actually doing their work.

2. Outside shooting - has it gotten better? Shock have to shoot better than 32% from the 3pt.

33% is not going to cut. Again with Hannah not being there clouds the issue. At least Hatch was improved. Nobody else looked like a threat.

3. Defense - is this team more athletic and able to defend the passing lanes and able to create points?

Was very disappointed. Kyles was the only one that really looked like he might cause some problems - he had a lot of almost steals, problem is he had 0 and every time he failed his guy almost always scored.

4. Where is Stutz, Ellis and Kyles in their development. Probably a stretch to make any big judgements from this game beside if they don't show up here they are likely to struggle against the Pittsburgh/Texas/CU type teams.

I thought Stutz looked improved just because he had 3 dunks. He did look bigger and tougher though Newman is not probably a good data point.

Ellis didn't impress. I was somewhat disappointed with Kyles (probably due to expectations created from shocker madness). But he is better than last year.

I'm still not bought in on Hatch. He seems like a good role player who could come off the bench and give a lift, but not look like a great threat.

5. Newcomers - who looks like they are going to emerge to be a contributor.

Blair look alright. Would have liked to see him more of a monster on the boards.

Only Williams of the Freshman looked like he ready to contribute - but he's got to get much better on D. I though Manigualt would be better. I was hoping to see more out of Richardson especially possibly being a person who could provide some instant offense off the bench.

Hamilton played like he wanted to be redshirted. So who else does Marshall redshirt beside Hamilton - Manigault or Richardson? I don't know except the Hannah FUBAR will probably drive this decision.

Unlisted - but FT shooting

I thought the Shockers got off to a good start from the FT line.

[wsushox1]

What did you say about Jason Ault?....hes a friend of a friend of mine.....

[pogo]

I liked the way the game started with the first 5-6 shots coming as layups. You can shoot a damn good per centage like that. Defense was lacking and was a little disappointed we didn't see a little more pressing/trapping but maybe that will be revealed later since I'm sure tape of this game or scouting reports will go to future opponents. Free throw shooting finally met my expectations, if they can keep that pace up it will be great. Stutz looked more physical, Hatch just looks determined, Williams looks like a keeper, Ellis seems to need to play with more purpose his early fouls were of the reaching cheap fouls, Blair needs more intensity, TM and DK need to continue to improve for this team to realize SN expectations, Durley needs to lead (in the absence of CH).

[Ashockalypse]

After sleeping on it, I don't think we really learned much of anything tonight. I have seen KU have bad exhibitions when they went to the final four.

I don't think we redshirt Manigault period. Maybe Tyler but only if we don't think he can provide some 3 firepower this year. There is no law saying we need a second redshirt and if we redshirt one and then have another disappoint, we go from guard rich to guard poor overnight.

We do have a clue that Stutz will be more helpful than last year.

Don't worry about Kyles or Ellis.

Give Blair a chance. He will shake off a little rust.

When back, Clevin will help Murry and Kyles carry a huge load. Shockerfan said it best. Much easier to improve the Defense than the offense.

[shockerfan]

Clerical oversight? Sounds like it is manditory NCAA paperwork. Somebody (maybe several somebodies) gets terminated for this. Unacceptable.

1. Jason Ault was good.

2. For the first time in several years, ate at Carlos O'Kellys, where the food is practically always about average.

3. Stutz leaned to dunk when up close. Very good. Stamina was better.

4. We missed Ramon's intensity.

5. Manigault was 1-4 or 1-3 of those floaters in the lane. They were all ugly, and no one is ever going to guard him. He has far less offensive skills than Adam Liberty or Wendell. Also not enough motor. Richardson is more ready to compete.

6. If Hatch was to average 30 minutes a game and average 12-14 ppg; he could acually get some mention for All Valley. Who would have ever projected that?

7. Blair and Ellis are going to foul. We will be forced to play small at times.

8. I expected more transition baskets.

9. Murry and Kyles needed to be more dominant, yes?

10. Crowd was not into the game much, and neither were the players.

11. Newman was pretty good, and we need to defend the perimeter better.

For an exhibition game...the crowd (and especially the students) were into the game VERY well as a whole. Best I've been to in the 13 years I've been attending for an exhibition game.

Also disagree 100% about Richardson. Manigualt is much better on defense at this point and I felt looked better handling the ball. Other than his shooting he didn't make tons of mistakes....for a freshman. They both made their share of mistakes...I just felt Manigualt looked more comfortable out of the two.

[WuDrWu]

It is easy to look at the offensive capabilities of 2 players and declare one superior to the other.

Kenny is ready for D1 ball, right now. True, he isn't going to go 6-8 from 3 anytime soon, but I promise you he's going to dominate some folks with his defense that will turn into multiple easy baskets.

Both Kenny and Demetric will be big parts of the team's success (or lack thereof) this season.


But let me repeat one statement...Demetric is a BALLA!

[shockerfan]

Re: Exhbition: WSU vs Newman

Here is what I will be looking for in tonights game.

1. Win the game in convincing fashion. Winning is attitude. If you can't do it against the Newmans and UMKC of the world, you are going to struggle in the MVC.

I will give WSU the pass last night due mainly to the circumstances of Hannah not being available since someone in the athletic office is spending more time drinking coffee than actually doing their work.

2. Outside shooting - has it gotten better? Shock have to shoot better than 32% from the 3pt.

33% is not going to cut. Again with Hannah not being there clouds the issue. At least Hatch was improved. Nobody else looked like a threat.

3. Defense - is this team more athletic and able to defend the passing lanes and able to create points?

Was very disappointed. Kyles was the only one that really looked like he might cause some problems - he had a lot of almost steals, problem is he had 0 and every time he failed his guy almost always scored.

4. Where is Stutz, Ellis and Kyles in their development. Probably a stretch to make any big judgements from this game beside if they don't show up here they are likely to struggle against the Pittsburgh/Texas/CU type teams.

I thought Stutz looked improved just because he had 3 dunks. He did look bigger and tougher though Newman is not probably a good data point.

Ellis didn't impress. I was somewhat disappointed with Kyles (probably due to expectations created from shocker madness). But he is better than last year.

I'm still not bought in on Hatch. He seems like a good role player who could come off the bench and give a lift, but not look like a great threat.

5. Newcomers - who looks like they are going to emerge to be a contributor.

Blair look alright. Would have liked to see him more of a monster on the boards.

Only Williams of the Freshman looked like he ready to contribute - but he's got to get much better on D. I though Manigualt would be better. I was hoping to see more out of Richardson especially possibly being a person who could provide some instant offense off the bench.

Hamilton played like he wanted to be redshirted. So who else does Marshall redshirt beside Hamilton - Manigault or Richardson? I don't know except the Hannah FUBAR will probably drive this decision.

Unlisted - but FT shooting

I thought the Shockers got off to a good start from the FT line.

I agree about the 3pt shooting, however I'm going to wait and see. I still think it will be improved. We started out the first half shooting only 25%, but in the 2nd half the Shox made 3-7 for a more respectable 42.9%. I am sure in the 1st half there was some excitement and probably took some shots they shouldn't have taken. I remember one shot by Williams that made me think...wow that was a bad shot...he'll redshirt. Well in the 2nd half that feeling changed.

Granted Hatch was the main reason why we shot even 33% from the 3....but I'm going to wait for a couple more games before I worry about the 3 pt shooting. I think it'll be ok. My guess is the team will average about 40%.

[WuDrWu]

If this team shoots 40% from 3, you're looking at the Valley Champs.



Demetric Williams is a "maker".


After reviewing the shot chart, we took a lot of good shots. I had kind of forgotten after the game was over, but there were very few times during the game I said to myself "bad shot"......2 times I remembered saying that, we made them (JT's 3 and DW's spinning baseline fallaway).

Take away the 3 point shooting and the Shocks were 25/44 or 57%. That wins a lot of games....and a lot of those were layups or dunks, which means we are getting really good shots.


Good teams take good shots. Good teams out rebound their opponents. Good teams make free throws. Good teams share the ball. Good teams limit turnovers.

Last night, I have us 3.5 out of 5.

[SpanglerFan316]

Re: Exhbition: WSU vs Newman

I'm still not bought in on Hatch. He seems like a good role player who could come off the bench and give a lift, but not look like a great threat.

I'm just glad you're not the one "buying" because Hatch brings a lot to the table and the most important contribution might be maturity. He is a role model out there and the 2006-7 team showed how important this can be. Effort on the court, shooting, moral support, determination, hard work off the court, etc. can rub off on other players and make them all better.

Need I bring up Jared Young and mention the fact that athletic ability does not always overcome the disruptive effects a player can have on a team? What about Sean Ogirri?

http://www.accessmylibrary.com:80/article-1G1-141219346/shockers-turgeon-dismisses-young.html

[forevershockerfan]

FSF agrees with the good Doc on Kenny. He is a serious keeper. What about Williams last night? Wow!!! He likes to take it to the rack. Too many turnovers last night. We really missed Hannah who will be a key leader. I would match our group of guards against any other team in the Valley. It was great to see Hatch draining 3's. I thought we could have exploited Newman inside last night more than we did. I do like Toure' and Kyles in the game at the same time. Stutz, JT, Gabe, and Ellis all had their moments and I like what I see thus far. Our defense was not near as good last night that it will be this very Season. I still think Gabe will be solid and a starter this Season. Actually, we have 8-9 key players that could start and or finish for us very well this Season. We have match up opportunities and capabilities like I have not seen for a spell. So far, so good.

[BostonWu]

Don't worry about Kyles or Ellis.

I agree on Kyles (assuming he continues to take care of things off the court).

I've given up worrying about Ellis. Granted it was opening exhibition game but it looked like more of the same. I REALLY hope to be proven wrong but my gut says he'll leave here with nothing more than the "P" word attached to his name. Something tells me if he were listed at 6'6" or 6'7" people wouldn't be so enamored with him. He needs a heavy does of MTXE (original formula not the deuce) shoved down his throat. Now prove me wrong AE.

[SubGod22]

Aarons biggest problem is foul trouble. Most of his fouls are stupid ones. When he stays out of foul trouble he gets into a flow and plays better. If he has to take a seat early he never gets into it and plays poorly. If he'll stop committing stupid fouls this wouldn't be such an issue.

[wsushox1]

Happy Birthday to Toure!

[jocoshock]

I give the Shocks a B- on offense, a D on defense and a C- overall.

I have to give the team closer to a D on both offense and defense, but I'm not saying that is a bad thing. I realize that this is early, and that not having Clevin to solidify the offense (and the defense to a smaller extent) made a big difference. If the team has to go without Clevin for 3 regular season games, that will certainly hurt for those games. However, it will force Toure' and the two freshmen point guards to hone their skills at the point a little more early and could end up as a blessing in disquise. No, I don't want to go without Clevin at all, especially against Pitt. But, if Toure' gets more work at the point and Kenny and Demetric get more playing time early, that could easily prove to be beneficial in February and March. I prefer to look at the positives and while the Clevin Hannah situation is certainly a negative, positives could result.

Good thing it was a practice test.... 8)

[shockball]

WSU vs Newman. The Day After.

http://blogs.kansas.com/shockwaves/