"The Shockers are may favorite team"

[pie n eye]

And yet I bet more random casual sports fans can talk about the Lakers in depth than the Warriors right now.

So you get your basketball info from random casual sports fans? That explains a lot.

Edit: besides Kobe I would be surprised if anyone besides a die hard LA could name another player on this years Laker team.

[WstateU]

And yet I bet more random casual sports fans can talk about the Lakers in depth than the Warriors right now.

So you get your basketball info from random casual sports fans? That explains a lot.

Edit: besides Kobe I would be surprised if anyone besides a die hard LA could name another player on this years Laker team.

Speaking of "random"...

[Kung Wu]

I don't know you from Wilt Chamberlin but I imagine you fall into the "average Americans who don't follow the NBA" category I described. If not, I find it hard to believe that you were unaware of Chris Mullins and Chris Weber at the very least.

Yes, I fall into that category as well. I have heard of Chris Weber certainly. Had no idea he played for the Warriors.

[ShockerEngineer]

So you get your basketball info from random casual sports fans? That explains a lot.

Edit: besides Kobe I would be surprised if anyone besides a die hard LA could name another player on this years Laker team.

Carlos Boozer, Jeremy Lin, Julius Randle (of course, injured all year).

That's all I can name, and I am definitely not a Laker fan. :P

[pie n eye]

Carlos Boozer, Jeremy Lin, Julius Randle (of course, injured all year).

That's all I can name, and I am definitely not a Laker fan. :P

Color me surprised! :)

[SirShoxAlot]

I thought you were done with this?

Not a question

[Rlh04d]

So you get your basketball info from random casual sports fans? That explains a lot.

Sigh. I like our ignore feature. Good bye.

[shock]

Swaggy P

[shockerfanmas]

So you get your basketball info from random casual sports fans? That explains a lot.

Edit: besides Kobe I would be surprised if anyone besides a die hard LA could name another player on this years Laker team.

I can give you the whole Lakers roster for this previous season. Oh wait...you meant without looking it up? And does Kobe still play even? I quit following the NBA pretty much once Queen.. I mean King James came into the league

[Rlh04d]

Sports is a what have you done for me lately industry. That's why bandwagon fans run so rampant

The Chicago Cubs are the 5th most valuable franchise in the MLB according to Forbes. They are currently ranked 7th in attendance in the league. They're also 7.5 games out of the lead in their division, haven't made the playoffs in seven years, and haven't won a World Series in 97 years.

The Knicks are the second most valuable franchise in the NBA according to Forbes. They have the 4th highest attendance in the NBA. They won 17 games this year, and haven't won their conference since 1999.

Kobe Bryant has the third highest selling jersey in the NBA. He played 41 games in the last two seasons combined.

The Dallas Cowboys are the most valuable franchise in the NFL according to Forbes. They were #1 in attendance last season. They have two playoffs wins since 1996, won their division four times in those 18 seasons, and just had their first winning season in five years.

The University of Tennessee averaged 99,754 fans in attendance in 2014, good for 7th in the country, had the #4 football recruiting class in 2015, and #7 in 2014. They have won seven games against SEC teams in the last four seasons combined, haven't had a winning record in conference since 2007, and are a combined 17-39 in those seven seasons.

The Wichita State Shockers went a combined 117-169 between the 1990-91 and 1999-00 seasons. They also averaged 7,292.2 fans in attendance for that absolutely putrid stretch, despite not having made the NCAA tournament in 12 years by the end of that stretch, and not winning an NCAA tournament game in nearly 20.

Those same Shockers defeated the University of Kansas by double digits in the 2015 NCAA tournament and finished ahead of them in the final NCAA rankings for the third consecutive year. Yet I cannot find one single early preseason rankings that sets Wichita State in front of Kansas -- despite the fact that Kansas lost two NBA draft picks from a team that lost to a much lower seed in the first weekend for the second year in a row. CBS Sports, SB Nation, CollegeBasketballTalk, BleacherReport, USA Today, SportsIllustrated ... every single set of rankings I can find doesn't just have Kansas ahead of Wichita State, but WELL ahead, often by double digits. Meanwhile Kansas has the #6 2015 recruiting class, and Wichita State is at #58.

I hit every single major sports league in the United States. If you want me to do soccer and rugby as well, I'll give it a shot.

Are sports writers going to predict the Lakers or the Cubs or the Knicks or the Cowboys or Tennessee to win the championships in their leagues? A couple will, but most won't. But I absolutely guarantee you that ESPN showed twice as many Knicks clips on SportsCenter as they showed Washington Wizards' despite the Wizards winning nearly 30 more games, the Cowboys were on national television twice as many times as the Arizona Cardinals were despite similar records, Tennessee got far more TV time than #20 Boise State who have absolutely ANNIHILATED Tenn's success over the last seven seasons, and the Cubs will have ten times as many articles written about them as the Pittsburgh Pirates will despite the Pirates being ahead of them in their division and making the playoffs as many times in the last two seasons as the Cubs have in the last 11.

Maybe sports isn't as much of a "what have you done for me lately?" industry as you think it is. Because we have UNQUESTIONABLY done more lately than Kansas, and we are nowhere NEAR their perception ... not with fans, not with industry executives, not with sports writers, not with recruits. Bandwagon fans exist, but sports prestige is far more complicated than bandwagon fans and looking at the results of the last few years. Otherwise we would be stomping on UCLA on the recruiting trail, and they would be BEGGING to play us. The first time UCLA puts a team even close to as talented as Wichita State on the court, they'll be ranked seven spots higher than us in preseason polls, and given the benefit of the doubt over us all year, because we don't have the national perception they do. This isn't a hard concept to understand. Wichita State is a top 10 team with at LEAST a top 10 coach in every way ... yet journalists don't write about us like we are or predict us to be, recruits don't commit to us like we are, ESPN doesn't air our games like we are, and even educated sports fans don't think about us like we are for the most part. Perception. It's not changed in five years.

[shockerofandover0943]

haven't won a World Series in 97 years.

107 years, I'm a Cubs fan. I'll go quietly weep now, thanks.

[Ricardo del Rio]

The Chicago Cubs are the 5th most valuable franchise in the MLB according to Forbes. They are currently ranked 7th in attendance in the league. They're also 7.5 games out of the lead in their division, haven't made the playoffs in seven years, and haven't won a World Series in 97 years.

The Knicks are the second most valuable franchise in the NBA according to Forbes. They have the 4th highest attendance in the NBA. They won 17 games this year, and haven't won their conference since 1999.

Kobe Bryant has the third highest selling jersey in the NBA. He played 41 games in the last two seasons combined.

The Dallas Cowboys are the most valuable franchise in the NFL according to Forbes. They were #1 in attendance last season. They have two playoffs wins since 1996, won their division four times in those 18 seasons, and just had their first winning season in five years.

The University of Tennessee averaged 99,754 fans in attendance in 2014, good for 7th in the country, had the #4 football recruiting class in 2015, and #7 in 2014. They have won seven games against SEC teams in the last four seasons combined, haven't had a winning record in conference since 2007, and are a combined 17-39 in those seven seasons.

The Wichita State Shockers went a combined 117-169 between the 1990-91 and 1999-00 seasons. They also averaged 7,292.2 fans in attendance for that absolutely putrid stretch, despite not having made the NCAA tournament in 12 years by the end of that stretch, and not winning an NCAA tournament game in nearly 20.

Those same Shockers defeated the University of Kansas by double digits in the 2015 NCAA tournament and finished ahead of them in the final NCAA rankings for the third consecutive year. Yet I cannot find one single early preseason rankings that sets Wichita State in front of Kansas -- despite the fact that Kansas lost two NBA draft picks from a team that lost to a much lower seed in the first weekend for the second year in a row. CBS Sports, SB Nation, CollegeBasketballTalk, BleacherReport, USA Today, SportsIllustrated ... every single set of rankings I can find doesn't just have Kansas ahead of Wichita State, but WELL ahead, often by double digits. Meanwhile Kansas has the #6 2015 recruiting class, and Wichita State is at #58.

I hit every single major sports league in the United States. If you want me to do soccer and rugby as well, I'll give it a shot.

Are sports writers going to predict the Lakers or the Cubs or the Knicks or the Cowboys or Tennessee to win the championships in their leagues? A couple will, but most won't. But I absolutely guarantee you that ESPN showed twice as many Knicks clips on SportsCenter as they showed Washington Wizards' despite the Wizards winning nearly 30 more games, the Cowboys were on national television twice as many times as the Arizona Cardinals were despite similar records, Tennessee got far more TV time than #20 Boise State who have absolutely ANNIHILATED Tenn's success over the last seven seasons, and the Cubs will have ten times as many articles written about them as the Pittsburgh Pirates will despite the Pirates being ahead of them in their division and making the playoffs as many times in the last two seasons as the Cubs have in the last 11.

Maybe sports isn't as much of a "what have you done for me lately?" industry as you think it is. Because we have UNQUESTIONABLY done more lately than Kansas, and we are nowhere NEAR their perception ... not with fans, not with industry executives, not with sports writers, not with recruits. Bandwagon fans exist, but sports prestige is far more complicated than bandwagon fans and looking at the results of the last few years. Otherwise we would be stomping on UCLA on the recruiting trail, and they would be BEGGING to play us. The first time UCLA puts a team even close to as talented as Wichita State on the court, they'll be ranked seven spots higher than us in preseason polls, and given the benefit of the doubt over us all year, because we don't have the national perception they do. This isn't a hard concept to understand. Wichita State is a top 10 team with at LEAST a top 10 coach in every way ... yet journalists don't write about us like we are or predict us to be, recruits don't commit to us like we are, ESPN doesn't air our games like we are, and even educated sports fans don't think about us like we are for the most part. Perception. It's not changed in five years.

Ow!

[shock]

The Chicago Cubs are the 5th most valuable franchise in the MLB according to Forbes. They are currently ranked 7th in attendance in the league. They're also 7.5 games out of the lead in their division, haven't made the playoffs in seven years, and haven't won a World Series in 97 years.

The Knicks are the second most valuable franchise in the NBA according to Forbes. They have the 4th highest attendance in the NBA. They won 17 games this year, and haven't won their conference since 1999.

Kobe Bryant has the third highest selling jersey in the NBA. He played 41 games in the last two seasons combined.

The Dallas Cowboys are the most valuable franchise in the NFL according to Forbes. They were #1 in attendance last season. They have two playoffs wins since 1996, won their division four times in those 18 seasons, and just had their first winning season in five years.

The University of Tennessee averaged 99,754 fans in attendance in 2014, good for 7th in the country, had the #4 football recruiting class in 2015, and #7 in 2014. They have won seven games against SEC teams in the last four seasons combined, haven't had a winning record in conference since 2007, and are a combined 17-39 in those seven seasons.

The Wichita State Shockers went a combined 117-169 between the 1990-91 and 1999-00 seasons. They also averaged 7,292.2 fans in attendance for that absolutely putrid stretch, despite not having made the NCAA tournament in 12 years by the end of that stretch, and not winning an NCAA tournament game in nearly 20.

Those same Shockers defeated the University of Kansas by double digits in the 2015 NCAA tournament and finished ahead of them in the final NCAA rankings for the third consecutive year. Yet I cannot find one single early preseason rankings that sets Wichita State in front of Kansas -- despite the fact that Kansas lost two NBA draft picks from a team that lost to a much lower seed in the first weekend for the second year in a row. CBS Sports, SB Nation, CollegeBasketballTalk, BleacherReport, USA Today, SportsIllustrated ... every single set of rankings I can find doesn't just have Kansas ahead of Wichita State, but WELL ahead, often by double digits. Meanwhile Kansas has the #6 2015 recruiting class, and Wichita State is at #58.

I hit every single major sports league in the United States. If you want me to do soccer and rugby as well, I'll give it a shot.

Are sports writers going to predict the Lakers or the Cubs or the Knicks or the Cowboys or Tennessee to win the championships in their leagues? A couple will, but most won't. But I absolutely guarantee you that ESPN showed twice as many Knicks clips on SportsCenter as they showed Washington Wizards' despite the Wizards winning nearly 30 more games, the Cowboys were on national television twice as many times as the Arizona Cardinals were despite similar records, Tennessee got far more TV time than #20 Boise State who have absolutely ANNIHILATED Tenn's success over the last seven seasons, and the Cubs will have ten times as many articles written about them as the Pittsburgh Pirates will despite the Pirates being ahead of them in their division and making the playoffs as many times in the last two seasons as the Cubs have in the last 11.

Maybe sports isn't as much of a "what have you done for me lately?" industry as you think it is. Because we have UNQUESTIONABLY done more lately than Kansas, and we are nowhere NEAR their perception ... not with fans, not with industry executives, not with sports writers, not with recruits. Bandwagon fans exist, but sports prestige is far more complicated than bandwagon fans and looking at the results of the last few years. Otherwise we would be stomping on UCLA on the recruiting trail, and they would be BEGGING to play us. The first time UCLA puts a team even close to as talented as Wichita State on the court, they'll be ranked seven spots higher than us in preseason polls, and given the benefit of the doubt over us all year, because we don't have the national perception they do. This isn't a hard concept to understand. Wichita State is a top 10 team with at LEAST a top 10 coach in every way ... yet journalists don't write about us like we are or predict us to be, recruits don't commit to us like we are, ESPN doesn't air our games like we are, and even educated sports fans don't think about us like we are for the most part. Perception. It's not changed in five years.

Fan-damn-tastic. It's not about what have you done for me lately. It's media. It's about selling advertising. It's about clicks and page views, not anything else.

[shoxtop]

The Chicago Cubs are the 5th most valuable franchise in the MLB according to Forbes. They are currently ranked 7th in attendance in the league. They're also 7.5 games out of the lead in their division, haven't made the playoffs in seven years, and haven't won a World Series in 97 years.

The Knicks are the second most valuable franchise in the NBA according to Forbes. They have the 4th highest attendance in the NBA. They won 17 games this year, and haven't won their conference since 1999.

Kobe Bryant has the third highest selling jersey in the NBA. He played 41 games in the last two seasons combined.

The Dallas Cowboys are the most valuable franchise in the NFL according to Forbes. They were #1 in attendance last season. They have two playoffs wins since 1996, won their division four times in those 18 seasons, and just had their first winning season in five years.

The University of Tennessee averaged 99,754 fans in attendance in 2014, good for 7th in the country, had the #4 football recruiting class in 2015, and #7 in 2014. They have won seven games against SEC teams in the last four seasons combined, haven't had a winning record in conference since 2007, and are a combined 17-39 in those seven seasons.

The Wichita State Shockers went a combined 117-169 between the 1990-91 and 1999-00 seasons. They also averaged 7,292.2 fans in attendance for that absolutely putrid stretch, despite not having made the NCAA tournament in 12 years by the end of that stretch, and not winning an NCAA tournament game in nearly 20.

Those same Shockers defeated the University of Kansas by double digits in the 2015 NCAA tournament and finished ahead of them in the final NCAA rankings for the third consecutive year. Yet I cannot find one single early preseason rankings that sets Wichita State in front of Kansas -- despite the fact that Kansas lost two NBA draft picks from a team that lost to a much lower seed in the first weekend for the second year in a row. CBS Sports, SB Nation, CollegeBasketballTalk, BleacherReport, USA Today, SportsIllustrated ... every single set of rankings I can find doesn't just have Kansas ahead of Wichita State, but WELL ahead, often by double digits. Meanwhile Kansas has the #6 2015 recruiting class, and Wichita State is at #58.

I hit every single major sports league in the United States. If you want me to do soccer and rugby as well, I'll give it a shot.

Are sports writers going to predict the Lakers or the Cubs or the Knicks or the Cowboys or Tennessee to win the championships in their leagues? A couple will, but most won't. But I absolutely guarantee you that ESPN showed twice as many Knicks clips on SportsCenter as they showed Washington Wizards' despite the Wizards winning nearly 30 more games, the Cowboys were on national television twice as many times as the Arizona Cardinals were despite similar records, Tennessee got far more TV time than #20 Boise State who have absolutely ANNIHILATED Tenn's success over the last seven seasons, and the Cubs will have ten times as many articles written about them as the Pittsburgh Pirates will despite the Pirates being ahead of them in their division and making the playoffs as many times in the last two seasons as the Cubs have in the last 11.

Maybe sports isn't as much of a "what have you done for me lately?" industry as you think it is. Because we have UNQUESTIONABLY done more lately than Kansas, and we are nowhere NEAR their perception ... not with fans, not with industry executives, not with sports writers, not with recruits. Bandwagon fans exist, but sports prestige is far more complicated than bandwagon fans and looking at the results of the last few years. Otherwise we would be stomping on UCLA on the recruiting trail, and they would be BEGGING to play us. The first time UCLA puts a team even close to as talented as Wichita State on the court, they'll be ranked seven spots higher than us in preseason polls, and given the benefit of the doubt over us all year, because we don't have the national perception they do. This isn't a hard concept to understand. Wichita State is a top 10 team with at LEAST a top 10 coach in every way ... yet journalists don't write about us like we are or predict us to be, recruits don't commit to us like we are, ESPN doesn't air our games like we are, and even educated sports fans don't think about us like we are for the most part. Perception. It's not changed in five years.

You are absolutely right with every bit of what you posted. If you define casual sports fans as those that regurgitate what they see on sports center and define perception as how much media coverage a team gets then I completely agree with you. I am obviously not the casual sports fan you are defining as I hardly ever watch sports media coverage and my perception of a program tends to be based on their results the current year. I shall move on now.

[Rlh04d]

You are absolutely right with every bit of what you posted. If you define casual sports fans as those that regurgitate what they see on sports center and define perception as how much media coverage a team gets then I completely agree with you. I am obviously not the casual sports fan you are defining as I hardly ever watch sports media coverage and my perception of a program tends to be based on their results the current year. I shall move on now.

Gotcha :)

I think you have to define "national perception" as something far greater than the handful of rational, unbiased, educated fans that look at college programs and professional teams on their own merits without any baggage associated with previous seasons. It only takes a cursory look at any preseason poll to show that even the people PAID to care deeply about sports can't divorce themselves from perception long enough to look at things on their own merits.

It's like politics ... there are people out there who deeply care about the issues and have a strong determination to vote into power the people most willing and able to enact what they care deeply about (regardless of what that is; I don't care about anyone's politics). But most people are just sheep, including most journalists, so it's not like the maybe 1% of the electorate that is deeply informed really matters on a national scale. It's why most politicians refuse to talk about anything of substance. The people that truly care about being informed aren't the people moving the needle.

Granted, perception can probably be defined multiple ways. We might be hearing the word differently. Popular perception is accepted fact, not actual fact, IMO.