Missouri Valley Conference Post Season Honors

[Stickboy46]

	Game1	@UNI		Game2	@wsu:
	WSU	UNI		WSU	UNI
FG%	-10%	+12%		+5%	-1%
3PT%	-16%	+32%		+9%	+1%
FT%	+19%	+1%		+1%	0%
#REB	-10	-5		-4	-5
#TO	2	-1		-6	-1

I had always wanted to compare this, but just for comparison this is WSU and UNI compared to their season average.

Stats are pretty clear: @UNI = WSU shot horribly and UNI shot WAY better than average. @wsu:= WSU Shot slightly better than average, and UNI played pretty much exactly their season average. Actually had less TO than average for them.

Take it for what you will.

[Cdizzle]

Do you believe that coach of the year awards should only go to the team that wins the conference? If not, what would be an example where you would give it to someone else?

Nearly always, yes. I can understand arguments for coaches that clearly do a tremendous job of improving a team throughout the year via their coaching (I think Lansing this year comes close to this, but his team still wasn't remotely close to the top 2 teams), or successfully manages significant hardships outside of his control (Marshall in 2013 is the closest example of this I can find). To illustrate my point, I would be less upset if Lansing had won instead of Jacobson, and I would not have been upset if McDermott had won in 2013.

Beyond those in-season expressions of superior coaching, I generally think that the best coach is the one that built the best team and guided them to a league championship.

[shocka khan]

I don't have a problem with Tuttle as PoY nor Jacobsen as CoY. I did not appreciate the lame trolling attempt by the UNI guy.

Personally, I'm glad the votes went the way they did. Marshall likes to play up the us vs. them thing.

If this isn't us vs. them (the rest of the valley), I'll eat my hat.

PLAY ANGRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!

[WstateU]

Not trying to be an ignoramus, but wasn’t it a foregone conclusion that Jacobson was going to win the award? Maybe it was just me? I honestly don’t know the answer to the following question: Has Bill Self won the Big 12 coach of the year award the past eleven years?

I guess it depends on your point of view:

[1972Shocker]

It was going to be almost impossible for Fred or Ron to beat out Tuttle for the POY year because Fred and Ron split that vote.

Does anyone know if a Wichita State coach has every won COY without winning the Conference. Just curious.

[1972Shocker]

Not trying to be an ignoramus, but wasn’t it a foregone conclusion that Jacobson was going to win the award? Maybe it was just me? I honestly don’t know the answer to the following question: Has Bill Self won the Big 12 coach of the year award the past eleven years?

IMHO it was a pretty much foregone conclusion that Jacobson was going to win the award.

Bill Self has won 4 Big 12 COY awards the past 10 years and one of those he shared with the dancing queen Fred Hoiberg even though KU finished 4 games ahead of Iowa State that year.

[Steeleshocker]

It was going to be almost impossible for Fred or Ron to beat out Tuttle for the POY year because Fred and Ron split that vote.

Does anyone know if a Wichita State coach has every won COY without winning the Conference. Just curious.

Pretty sure 3G won the final year Creighton was in the conference.

[1972Shocker]

Found my answer:

Wichita State COY Winners:
Ralph Miller - 1954
Gary Thompson - 1965
Eddie Fogler - 1987
Mark Turgeon - 2006
Gregg Marshall - 2012, 2013, 2014

Oklahoma State was the regular season champ when Ralph Miller won his only COY in 1954.
Tulsa was the regular season champ when Eddie Fogler won his only COY in 1987
Creighton was the regular season champ when Gregg Marshall won his 2nd COY in 2013

Sources:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_Valley_Conference_Men's_Basketball_Coach_of_the_Year

http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/conferences/mvc/

[The Mad Hatter]

I don't have a huge problem with Jacobson winning COY since he is a very good coach and had a very good season, but to the degree I have a problem it is this:

He didn't win on objective performance, obviously, since his team finished 2nd, so he won on performance relative to expectation (which is fine).

Why was this year's results a vast improvement over expectation? Because of last year's results.

What happened last year? By Jacobson's own accounting, UNI underperformed because he failed to coach defense to his normal standards.

In other words, Jacobson wins coach of the year because by his own admission his previous season of coaching was so bad that he squandered their talent and set a low bar. Marshall, on the other hand, is penalized for out performing Jacobson this year because he did such a good job last year.

On top of all that, Marshall had to replace his top assistant coach this year (whose value is pretty clear with the Bowling Green turnaround), whereas Jacobson's entire staff stayed in tact from the previous season.

[Jhook89]

You act as if the BEST player on the team is the ONLY player on the team. This isn't an individual sport after all.

There is nothing logically wrong with saying:
UNI had the player of the year.
WSU had a better overall team.
Both teams had almost identical seasons.
Conclusion: UNI's coach deserves the award.

We can debate the talent evaluations of Team A and Team B, but the logic of "if this, then this" is very solid.

I feel like you get a lot of flak on here, but I respect your ability to look past the bias of being a fan of one of the teams and look at the facts with an unbiased eye. No one expected UNI to be 27-3 this year. The same exact record as WSU. WSU might have a slightly better year than UNI up to this point, but I bet if you go back and look WSU was expected to win the league by 3+ games. UNI exceeded expectations. Both guys are definitely deserving of the award, but I have no problem with Jacobson getting it this year. He guided UNI to their highest ranking in school history. Would of loved to see Marshall get it, but it makes sense why Jacobson got it.

[FlyingWheat]

It was going to be almost impossible for Fred or Ron to beat out Tuttle for the POY year because Fred and Ron split that vote.

Does anyone know if a Wichita State coach has every won COY without winning the Conference. Just curious.

They may have split the spotlight, but not the vote. Tuttle had more 1st place votes than both Fred and Ron combined by a bunch.

[shocks02]

This has to be rare. ESPN's BPI is showing that both teams best and worst performances we're against each other. A third match must be in order.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/bpi/_/teamId/2724

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/bpi/_/teamId/2460

[Kung Wu]

Does anyone know if a Wichita State coach has every won COY without winning the Conference. Just curious.

Gregg Marshall in 2012-2013?

Edit: nm ... you guys are way ahead of me ... shoulda kept reading the thread.

[Kung Wu]

This has to be rare. ESPN's BPI is showing that both teams best and worst performances we're against each other. A third match must be in order.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/bpi/_/teamId/2724

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-bask.../_/teamId/2460

What the heck is BPI? Don't make me go decipher a dissertation to understand it. LOL

[1972Shocker]

Gregg Marshall in 2012-2013?

Thanks. Also R. Miller and Fogler. See #131 above.

As a corollary 4 Shocker coaches won regular season championships and did not win COY honors:

Ralph Miller - 1964 (Shocks were Co-Champs with Drake and Maury John was the COY)
Harry Miller - 1976
Gene Smithson - 1981 and 1983
Gregg Marshall - 2015

So the Shocks have had 3 COY winners who did not win a championship, 4 championship winners who did not win COY awards and 1 Co-Championship winner who did not win the COY award.