Big 12 is sooooo overrated as BB conference......

[Flip1381]

Here is the deal SN. Although the ongoooooooooooooooooing back and forth between JH4P and Fever is entertaining for the most part, it is getting old. I don't have a dog in the fight, but let me try and explain a reason for the behavior on both sides. For the most part we all fall into the category of one of four personality/communication styles (there are probably 20 different equivalent programs out there). I will use the most recognizable called DiSC. D=Dominance; i=Influencing; S=Steadiness; C=Cautiousness.

JH4P is the ultimate Cautiousness (C). This personality style is totally about being analytical (step-by-step approach, thorough, fact driven, allows questions, system oriented). My guess is if I gave him the test he would be a C without any overlap with the other styles.

Fever qualifies as a (D) Dominance. This personality style is about having an objective of "winning." The object of the process is to win. Winning is everything to this personality style. Many times this person will pursue the objective at any cost. The result of this behavior can be sacrificing other peoples' feelings, which can cause tension.

I am not a complete expert on communication styles, but I have presented on this subject before in my professional life. The Cautiousness and Dominance personality styles are the hardest two styles to coordinate together, I might add. These personalities are DNA encoded and can't be switched to another style, although in a personal or work environment these styles can consciously be adapted if the parties choose for the sake of civility.

Can JH4P and Fever change? Not likely. Can they, if they choose, elect to be more compassionate toward each other? Yes...but not likely.

Now, let me get more popcorn and return to our regularly scheduled program...

C= Conscientiousness

I'm guessing JH4P would likely have some overlap in one of the other categories, most if not everyone does in some aspect of their lives, this board would be no different. The other personalities I bet both of these guys would associate with would be the "I," Influential.
I would add that D personalities tend to be the type that doesn't care about the "details" but more about the end result or goal.

[Cdizzle]

I would classify them both as "D's", but that could just be me.

[ShockBand]

I would classify them both as "D's", but that could just be me.

I saw "D's" on the main page, and was fully expecting to see some of the fine image work of @WstateU: ! Disappointed.

[SHOXAAC]

C= Conscientiousness

I'm guessing JH4P would likely have some overlap in one of the other categories, most if not everyone does in some aspect of their lives, this board would be no different. The other personalities I bet both of these guys would associate with would be the "I," Influential.
I would add that D personalities tend to be the type that doesn't care about the "details" but more about the end result or goal.

I would agree that both are very "expressive."

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

JH4P - Are you an engineer?

Yep.

As a student at WSU, I showed up for the open tryouts that Turgeon’s staff held prior to the 2005-2006 season. I hoped that my status as an engineering student with a good GPA might help me out a bit. I mean seriously, whoever they chose was going to ride the very end of the bench. Why not choose a student who would help out with all those NCAA GPA and graduation metrics, right? As it turned out, they selected a kid who later got kicked off the team mid-season along with scholarship player Jared Young. I do have to give the coaches props though. One of the assistants called each and every guy who tried out just to personally thank them for showing up and let them know that a selection (someone else) had been made. Oh well, full court scrimmages on the floor at Koch with a few of the players still lingering after practice and the assistance coaches acting as refs was quite a blast. You want a good pick up bball game? Stick a dozen random kids in that scenario with a spot on the team on the line and you get the most self-less, team first, no cherry-picking, hustling game of pick up ball you’ve ever seen!

One last story since I’m thinking about my “potential glory days”. The 2nd day of tryouts were scheduled immediately following a team practice. The practice ran a few minutes late, so those of us there for tryouts were sitting and waiting for our turn. Practice ended and we walked out to grab basketballs off the racks and start warming up. I had a ball in hand for about 2 seconds before PJ Couisnard, who was walking off the court, reached over and snagged it from me as he yelled “give me that”, jacked up a 30 foot off-balance 3, only to miss wildly and hit the corner of the backboard. My response… “Is that all it takes to make this team?”

His response… a smile and a look of “don’t make me come dunk on you fool”. Fun times!

[WstateU]

I would classify them both as "D's", but that could just be me.

I saw "D's" on the main page, and was fully expecting to see some of the fine image work of @WstateU: ! Disappointed.

Not sure 'bout "D's", but she better shut-off the 'selfie' and watch out for the LLLIIIOONNNNNNNNN!

[ripemupshocks]

JH4P - Are you an engineer?

:courage:

[Kung Wu]

With the exception of WSU in 2014, the 2nd place team in the Big 12 has been ranked higher in KenPom’s rankings than the top ranked MVC team each of the past 10 years. We can argue the likelihood that WSU would have won the conference outright with KU in it this year, and that is why I specifically singled that topic out in a previous post. However, I haven’t seen a single logical reason why KU would be expected to have finished anything other than 1st during the other 9 seasons. Now trolling and illogical gibber jabber…. I’ve seen plenty of that. RoyalShock is right. This board is way too hostile to any viewpoints that don’t praise WSU.

I stack crap on you because you are man enough to take it, and that allows for a little levity. Now back to the two issues at hand.

1) You didn't address penis size.

2) Again, seeding is heavily weighted to RPI, and RPI is heavily skewed toward inbred conferences, therefore you cannot use seeding and RPI as a key argument in determining how KU would perform in the Valley. You generally refuse to address that truth, and so what we get out of you over and over and over and over is that RPI and seeding trumps everything. 75% of a team's RPI is generally out of their control. It turns out for the top 68ish teams in the country that reduces to about 69%, if I remember correctly. (The lower tier teams get to play higher quality opponents).

The most reliable methodology, given enough samples, would be to actually look at how KU has performed in Valley match-ups. In the tournament over the 200x vs 201x (where 0 <= x <= 5) years they are 1 and 2 that I know of. Perhaps they have played more Valley opponents outside of the tournament and it will look less bad that KU has only won 33% of their games negating every argument you have made about their superior seeding meaning a darn thing. What else are we to conclude when you say that their superior seed means they would have won the Valley, yet in actual Valley games they are 1-2 and damn near 0 and 3? That your methodology, which we all know is flawed, is superior to actual results?

[Kung Wu]

You shouldn't have to justify yourself with examples. I am the type of person that wants to hear facts and actual reasons why someone has the opinion they do when engaging in a debate, if not then there is no debate and it becomes a farce. Unfortunately, most of the situations debated on here are about WSU comparing to KU or vice versa which leads to someone (usually you) taking the logical side and asking "why?"

I would say that if you didn't ask "why" or say something debatable, all the threads on here would be 1 page long or 5 pages of everyone agreeing WSU would win anything all the time without reasoning or supporting statements.

The hypothetical has no good, useful path for scientific discovery. All you can do is speculate. You can use seeding, which we know to be severely skewed, so that's not reasonable. We can use actual results, which we know to be too small of data points. There's really nothing reasonable left other than taking some crazy confabulation of kenpom or modifying RPI to be reasonable and that's just not going to happen. So in the absence of any reasonable way to say if KU could have run the gauntlet in the MVC all you have left is speculation. That means the entire exercise is futile and so you may as well have fun with it. ....... of course ... there IS one way left .... and that's to compare penis size.

[Kung Wu]

Here is the deal SN. Although the ongoooooooooooooooooing back and forth between JH4P and Fever is entertaining for the most part, it is getting old. I don't have a dog in the fight, but let me try and explain a reason for the behavior on both sides. For the most part we all fall into the category of one of four personality/communication styles (there are probably 20 different equivalent programs out there). I will use the most recognizable called DiSC. D=Dominance; i=Influencing; S=Steadiness; C=Cautiousness.

JH4P is the ultimate Cautiousness (C). This personality style is totally about being analytical (step-by-step approach, thorough, fact driven, allows questions, system oriented). My guess is if I gave him the test he would be a C without any overlap with the other styles.

Fever qualifies as a (D) Dominance. This personality style is about having an objective of "winning." The object of the process is to win. Winning is everything to this personality style. Many times this person will pursue the objective at any cost. The result of this behavior can be sacrificing other peoples' feelings, which can cause tension.

I am not a complete expert on communication styles, but I have presented on this subject before in my professional life. The Cautiousness and Dominance personality styles are the hardest two styles to coordinate together, I might add. These personalities are DNA encoded and can't be switched to another style, although in a personal or work environment these styles can consciously be adapted if the parties choose for the sake of civility.

Can JH4P and Fever change? Not likely. Can they, if they choose, elect to be more compassionate toward each other? Yes...but not likely.

Now, let me get more popcorn and return to our regularly scheduled program...

Please tell me what quadrant I reside in!!!

[Shock Therapy]

Yep.

As a student at WSU, I showed up for the open tryouts that Turgeon’s staff held prior to the 2005-2006 season.

Bahahahaha, awesome. And you dated yourself too. Give it another 5-10 years and you will be so jaded that you won't want to argue like this anymore. It will help speed things up if you do a stint over at Beechcraft or what ever the hell they want to call that shithole now.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

because you are man enough to take it

Thank you

1) You didn't address penis size.

Nope, and I don't plan to.

2) Again, seeding is heavily weighted to RPI

I did not use RPI. I used KenPom which is measured completely differently.

You generally refuse to address that truth

I have addressed your RPI concerns before and shown why I think your conclusions are wrong. We simply don't agree on this issue. Your "truth" is true about how the formula is calculated, but your conclusions are not "facts" but are what I would call wrongly formed conclusions.

The most reliable methodology, given enough samples, would be to actually look at how KU has performed in Valley match-ups.

We do not have enough samples to pass the threshold where this actually becomes the "most reliable methodology".

[WuDrWu]

No that it matters, and I am completely staying out of this, but anyone that's been around here very long would know that JH4P is one of the best Shocker fans there is....if nothing else, his fandom shouldn't be questioned.

Carry on.

[Kung Wu]

I did not use RPI. I used KenPom which is measured completely differently.



I have addressed your RPI concerns before and shown why I think your conclusions are wrong. We simply don't agree on this issue. Your "truth" is true about how the formula is calculated, but your conclusions are not "facts" but are what I woulat call wrongly formed conclusions.



We do not have enough samples to pass the threshold where this actually becomes the "most reliable methodology".

I am on my phone so quoting is painful, please forgive.

a) Ahha! By replying to my not addressing penis size challenge and saying that you would not address the penis size argument you have indirectly agreed with me that MVC students have larger penises because you have no valid basis for argument otherwise! BAM! I knew it was true! Now if that fact stands then my initial argument still looks solid that KU would not have won 10 straight in the MVC.

b) You didn't use kenpom, you used seeding. Seeding is heavily skewed toward RPI. Therefore a very large basis for your argument was indirectly on RPI.

c) You have addressed the RPI concerns before. That does not mean you proved your case. My fact is indisputable and so is the conclusion. In 201x (whatever year it was) the top 68 (or possibly 64 I don't remember) teams' RPI was based 69ish percent on SOS alone (don't recall the exact percent). The conclusion is absolutely true that for those teams in that group outside of the power conference, 69% of their RPI is entirely out of their control. There is really no arguing those points.

You went into a variance argument, but the argument is irrelevant to the assertion.

There is a bias toward teams in power conferences who are fortunate to have heavy hitters in their league. There is a clear scheduling blockade by those teams to "keep it in the family" and to not risk losses in road games or to strong non-power conference teams. Why shouldn't there be? It's built into the formula to make it correct to behave that way (unless you are Maryland -- that's a joke please don't address it).

d) No kidding. But there's enough data to indicate that your seeding argument is weak.

[SHOXAAC]

Please tell me what quadrant I reside in!!!

There is a new personality style equivalent called "3rd Rock From the Sun (made possible with cow patties and hot Texas sun)." People in this category are famous for hurling their thoughts through space on a molten rock at 67000 miles an hour and the only thing that keeps them from flying out of their shoes is their misplaced faith in gravity.

If your looking for a serious answer, your personality/communication style is clearly Steadiness, which I like to characterize more as amiable. This is a person who is friendly and caring, someone who is casual and relaxed. Someone who dislikes confrontation and likes harmony among all.

SN is just like society in general...it takes all four personality/communication styles to make the world go around.