Is the Creighton Program a bit over-rated?

[Carolina_Shock]

You guys hate CU? Try living in Omaha... Anyway program is over rated, might average top 10 in attendance but the CBB environment isn't there. People show up to drink the beer and be seen/social not to watch BB. Koch >>> Century Link (and I've been to both, several times). Heard from a few Jay boosters the team has been recently out of synch because Doug McD broke up with his girl and is "getting with" Wragge's girl....

[Ricardo del Rio]

But they are headed for the big time with their new friends...

The Blue Birds are headed to big time trouble with their new friends, given their graduation losses and the potential loss of Dougie to pro ball.

Coach McDermott had better have a couple of McDonald's All Americans lined up in his next recruiting class and a couple of juco All Americans would not hurt.

[Ricardo del Rio]

You guys hate CU? Try living in Omaha... Anyway program is over rated, might average top 10 in attendance but the CBB environment isn't there. People show up to drink the beer and be seen/social not to watch BB. Koch >>> Century Link (and I've been to both, several times). Heard from a few Jay boosters the team has been recently out of synch because Doug McD broke up with his girl and is "getting with" Wragge's girl....

<giggles> Now that revolving girl friend situation will cause problems.

[Rlh04d]

Add up the NCAA tournament wins in the same time frame between the two respective programs and you'll find your answer.

3-2 in favor of Creighton. Not a massive number but meaningful none the less, but when one looks at NCAA Tournament appearances in the same time frame you get.

8-2 in favor of Creighton. 'Nuff said.

Everyone on here would take 8 NCAA appearances in 14 years.

When I discuss the MVC with basketball fans not familiar with the conference, it's usually Creighton's name that gets the most attention.

I've always found that interesting. So I'll usually ask them why they're familiar with Creighton, and it usually comes down to "they're always in the tournament, and always have some good success in it."

But only one of those is even partly true. Creighton is USUALLY in the tournament, and that's actually worked to create the sense that because they're always in it, they must be having success in it. But since 1999, they've had 8 appearances, 3 first round wins, and 0 second round wins.

And it's more interesting than that. Creighton has never won back to back games in the NCAA tournament. Ever. They made the Sweet 16 back in '71 I believe, and they had some success earlier on (with I believe their first NCAA win in the '40s), but those were all when the tournament was smaller. At that point even making the tournament was clearly an accomplishment ... but they never, ever won back to back games. Not in the NCAA tournament, and not even in the NIT. I think they've gotten to the finals in the CBI, but in the two biggest tournaments in the sport, Creighton has NEVER won two straight games. Wichita State has done it three times since 2005.

They receive a lot of respect, deservedly so, for making the tournament so consistently. I would love to say WSU has made the tournament 8 times since 1999. But, at the end of the day, the failure to ever even once capitalize on all of those appearances is kind of staggering. WSU, UNI, SIU, and Bradley have all had more tournament success in the last few years than Creighton has had since the early 70s, and all won more games in one tournament (not counting games between two losers to determine who was in third/fourth place from a regional) than Creighton has in their entire major tournament history.

Just interesting how seeing a name so often leaves an impression of success on people, even when the facts don't really support it.

Which isn't to say that Creighton is a bad program ... they've clearly been the most consistent in the Valley over this time period. Obviously SIU had a far more dominant run than Creighton, but Creighton's success has been very consistent. It's just that I don't think they are the nationally relevant team they get recognized as. They're a good MVC team ... they've never shown themselves to be a good national team, however. SIU was far more successful in that arena, and if they were to go on and have another 10 straight losing seasons, I still don't think Creighton would catch their NCAA success.

Gregg Marshall lead Winthrop to 7 NCAA appearances from 1999-2007, and had one NCAA first round win over that period ... 1 less appearance and 2 less wins, but 5 less years, and their one win was (I believe) over a higher seed than Creighton beat during that period. Winthrop under Marshall was as relevant nationally as Creighton is.

[DwShock]

You guys hate CU? Try living in Omaha...

I feel your pain. And your right it's more a social gathering than a basketball game.

[60Shock]

Nothing I'd like to see better than the Shockers and 3 or more Valley teams consistently making the NCAA tournament and doing well. And that includes CU.

The better the MVC does, the better our chances are possibly for attracting higher quality schools back into our conference.

[I_Vector_Wu]

REMEMBER: THEY STILL LIVE IN 2ND PLACE !!

[SubGod22]

Nothing I'd like to see better than the Shockers and 3 or more Valley teams consistently making the NCAA tournament and doing well. And that includes CU.

The better the MVC does, the better our chances are possibly for attracting higher quality schools back into our conference.

I believe that Geno Ford will get Bradley there.

[GoShockers89]

I believe that Geno Ford will get Bradley there.

Agreed- I think Bradley is on the rise. Creighton should remain a solid program (though stormclouds are gathering) if they can maintain their current commitment to spending. ISUr always seems like it has potential, but Muller is a terrible coach and squandered a huge amount of talent this season. UNI will probably always be at least decent (occasionally good) under Jacobsen. Heaven help the Panthers if he ever leaves though.

Everyone else is capable of a flash-in-the-pan run at best. The spending gap between MVC schools is growing and teams like MSU, Indiana State and Evansville just don't stand a chance longterm versus those of us who double or triple them up budget-wise. Sure, they may occasionally stockpile enough talent to have a good year or two, but then they will lose their coach and be forced to roll the dice on another unproven replacement making $350k. That's not a sustainable model for success in a league where teams like us can shovel out $1.6+ million for our guy.

[ShockerPrez]

I can just imagine Gibbs sitting at his piano in the locker room singing to the rest of the team...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wZPNvzNnzo

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

I believe that Geno Ford will get Bradley there.

Add SIU to that list. Lots of potential there to be a contender within a couple of years or so.

[WstateU]

I can just imagine Gibbs sitting at his piano in the locker room singing to the rest of the team...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wZPNvzNnzo

"Allentown"

[SubGod22]

Add SIU to that list. Lots of potential there to be a contender within a couple of years or so.

I have faith that Hinson will improve SIU, but I'm not ready to say they'll be contenders in the near future. If Bradley can keep Ford around, I see them contending for the top spot consistently starting in '14-'15

[EB 22]

You guys hate CU? Try living in Omaha... Anyway program is over rated, might average top 10 in attendance but the CBB environment isn't there. People show up to drink the beer and be seen/social not to watch BB. Koch >>> Century Link (and I've been to both, several times). Heard from a few Jay boosters the team has been recently out of synch because Doug McD broke up with his girl and is "getting with" Wragge's girl....

Not sure what's worse? Having to deal with Creighton fans in Omaha all the time or having to deal with KU fans in Wichita all the time. Both are extremely annoying.

[ABC]

I was rooting for CU to win.

But . . . it needs to be pointed out that Creighton and WSU have the same number of NCAA wins in the last 15 years: four.