Wichita State vs Cincinnati Game Thread

[Good News]

5:18 left in the 2nd half if you’re looking for it in a recording.

[Good News]

The sequence I’m referring to occurred literally at and in the 1-3 seconds after the play and the whistle. There was no time for talk, shoving, anything. Play was on, ES took a good swipe (no issue with that), and then took two steps toward the baseline and got in his face. The guy could have been saying something to him, but if he did he was doing it while not looking him in the eye. And he then did a good job of drawing the refs attention with a “somebody get this guy away from me” move with arms outstretched. If you recorded the game, they showed the replay with the angle I’m talking about during the technical foul shots.

[wusphlash]

Cincinnati Redbirds?

[Good News]

That was definitely one of the blatant blown calls. Burton was the other - and it looked like a goaltend too.

[WuDrWu]

Security now talking down Shocker fans in the row BEHIND the out of control Cincy fans.

Not sure when you posted this, but security was all over the thing well after the arena was mostly empty when a row of Cincy fans (NOT ALL MIND YOU, just about 8 or so) were about half a second from a full on brawl. I'm guessing they would have pummeled the few Shocker fans that were "in it" with them, and then it would have been a bloody rock fight with the remaining 500 or so Shocker fans still in the area. Thank goodness Security was able to break up that very unfortunate exchange.

[Good News]

Couldn’t agree more. In fact, I’ve got a nice crisp twenty dollar bill for anybody that wants to wear a t-shirt that says “1.9” on it and gives the refs in Memphis a 5 dollar handshake and the old Al Czervik “keep it fair, keep it fair” line.

[ShockerFever]

1. I welcome correction or modification from someone at the game, particularly sitting on that baseline because the TV coverage was pretty poor on the ES technical. They were cutting away to other highlights or switched cameras right at the moment that would have explained the tech. However, later in the game they did show a wide angle replay where ES gave a nice solid foul on the player and then took two steps directly toward him to chest up and get in the face of a player that appeared to be minding his own business. That to me was what earned the tech, because it was a move that you can’t allow players to do and still control the game as a ref. It appeared that he wasn’t T’d until a few seconds after that, but that’s what I thought earned it. Some people are saying things about a push, words, etc. that I couldn’t see and may change it. But the foul and immediate move to face up looked like a red flag to me.

I wasn't there but I'm pretty sure Cumblerland initiated the verbal engagement after the ES foul. It was the classic case of ES then reacting that comment with one of his own. ES didn't just chest up the guy and get into his face unprovoked.

[WuDrWu]

Bigly spot on. Especially #1.

[Jhook89]

IMO 3G was over the top all afternoon with his behavior. As a 50 year old man you should have more control of your emotions than that. Getting a T, which 3G deserved, severely hurt the team. There was no where near enough time left for a T to fire up his team and make a difference at that point. This game had more to do with our players making stupid plays and their players making big shots down the stretch than the refs.

All that being said, I believe it all stems from how much 3G cares and wants to win. He wanted to beat Cinci sooooo bad. I love him for that. We just went toe to toe with an extremely good team and looked them straight in the eyes for 37 min of that game. We are close my friends.

[WuDrWu]

Man, is there a lot to say about this game.....I want to address the Stevenson T first.

Cumberland was in fact fouled going baseline by JB. Erik was looking to help and aggressively took a swipe at Cumberland after the foul call. Mistake 1. Erik then somewhat got in Cumberland's face. Mistake 2. At this point I was glued in to the action but bodies came together and I couldn't really tell what happened. And I couldn't hear what was said from across the court. I think Erik deserved the T. He was in the wrong twice and clearly was frustrated about being beat on a play just a bit earlier.

He acted like a freshman and got T'd up. That being said, Gregg's T was hugely wrong. He was lucky he didn't get tossed, he should have been. And it ended the game. We have to be better than that.

[Stickboy46]

[SHOCKvalue]

Parson’s throwing support behind a WSU position? Is that a sign of the end times?

[Good News]

Several comments and thoughts on the game, but the biggest are all related:

1. I welcome correction or modification from someone at the game, particularly sitting on that baseline because the TV coverage was pretty poor on the ES technical. They were cutting away to other highlights or switched cameras right at the moment that would have explained the tech. However, later in the game they did show a wide angle replay where ES gave a nice solid foul on the player and then took two steps directly toward him to chest up and get in the face of a player that appeared to be minding his own business. That to me was what earned the tech, because it was a move that you can’t allow players to do and still control the game as a ref. It appeared that he wasn’t T’d until a few seconds after that, but that’s what I thought earned it. Some people are saying things about a push, words, etc. that I couldn’t see and may change it. But the foul and immediate move to face up looked like a red flag to me.

2. I could make a case either way with both pros and cons as to why Gregg should have kept himself in check or stuck up for his player and gone after the ref. I would probably lean toward get your money’s worth but don’t give up another 2 points in a close game down the stretch. But what I will say is that he was up the crew’s ass from the beginning (legitimately in the case of the no call on JE and then immediate bad call on JE that I think worked to get one or two more borderline calls in our favor). In the first two minutes of a game where you’re yelling in the refs ear very clearly about how a call was “b***s***”, you probably have to assume that you’re going to fatigue the crew (along with other complaining) and eventually put yourself in a position where they ring you up or screw you more. I wouldn’t mind ShockRef opinion here. I love Marshall’s passion and whatever he wants to do is fine with me, but I can’t say I was suprised when he got T’d. I was however, pleasantly surprised that he didn’t get the second one (I was in Montreal and his reaction looked similar).

3. Another one I would like a referee’s opinion on is how crews tend to react when they’re getting it from all sides. I understand that there is a legitimate dynamic where a coach needs to agitate for makeup calls. I also understand there is a legitimate dynamic where players are fighting to stay on the floor - especially when playing for a coach that subs for anyone that makes a mistake. However... when you’ve got a bunch of guys in their first season of D1 ball walking around with an air of incredulity and their arms outstretched in the “worst call of all time” pose... at some point you’re not doing yourself any favors. I don’t remember Fred and Ron demonstrating to anywhere near that degree, and I’m pretty sure they were a little better at guarding without fouling. And a guy named Tim Duncan had to listen to feedback in mid-career about how his wide-eyed complaining and incredulity about his fouls was damaging his legacy and making him more of a target for refs. He listened.

4. The free throw differential was pretty striking, but are we honestly expecting a 50/50 split with the number of possessions that end with a missed contested 3 or a MM fallaway? You have to play the hand you’re dealt, and unfortunately we don’t have a slasher like Landry or Fred and meal ticket big men like Carl/Shaq/etc to feed inside (yet). Go to the rim, go to the line. I think we were probably at a minus 2 or 3 on the blown calls today on a net basis, which is enough to decide a game, but not enough to make me think the fix was in or that the reffing had more to do with the L than the questionable shot selection on 10-15 possessions.

5. I still see a lot to be positive about. If you would have told me that we could turn the ball over 5 possessions in a row, have the other assorted turnovers we did, and revert to multiple bad shots early in the clock (which mostly disappeared against UCF) and we’d battle back and forth the entire game with a chance to win down the stretch I’d take it in a second. Everybody is learning out there at the same time, with no real anchor. There’s a lot to be optimistic about, even for the rest of this season. I just wish they could break down the film, show the 10-15 possessions that ended with poor shot selection too early in the clock, and do whatever it took to eliminate that decision making. At 1 point whatever points per possession, that could turn a few Ls into Ws.

GO SHOCKS!

[WuDrWu]

Only Jenifer and Broome are seniors. Lots of Juniors and So though. Cumberland is a handful.

[Stickboy46]

i disagree...if they were allowed to push, then they took advantage...I've seen Cronin teams play enough to know they begin with a strong defensive focus. Had it been called tighter on them, they still would have stuck to the effort...

But they wouldn't have been playing. Because they would have fouled out. I didn't see any effort issue on our end. Just some dumb play and getting punished for too much effort at times