Next season outlook.....good, bad or indifferent.

[wusphlash]

2005-06 top three 3-pt shooters:

Ogirri: 91-206 - 44.2%
Wilson: 42-98 - 42.9%
Cooz: 27-77 - 35.1%

Combined: 160-381 - 42%

2010-11:

Kyles: 68-172 - 39.5%
Smith: 32-79 - 40.5%
Hatch: 29-74 - 39.2%

Combined: 129-325 - 39.7%

If you include the 4th and 5th best shooters, Braeuer and Bradley had about the same production as Ragland and Murry.

The biggest differential is that in 2006 we had two guys who were better "makers" than any of our guys this year, which helped that team spread the floor and open up scoring opportunities.

42% versus 40%. That's 2 more makes per 100 shots taken. Hardly a strategy changer. I give more credence to your earlier point that the post men were better at moving the ball and not letting the offense stagnate in their hands.

[RoyalShock]

And I might add that the 2006 guys put those numbers up against better competition.

Those guys also put up those numbers taking better shots, because of post strength.

The comparison of shooting percentages doesn't tell the whole story for me.

My point is that a big reason our posts were so successful is that opposing defenses had to respect our shooters. That opens up passing lanes.

Did this season's team take a lot of 3-point shots, some of them ill-timed? Sure they did. But outside of a few of Kyles' head-scratchers, they were fairly open shots, which good shooters knock down at a 45-50% clip.

I realize this is a chicken/egg argument, but one thing we should be able to agree on is that we need both. And we didn't have the perimeter game to compliment the post (Durley, Stutz) and mid-range (Blair, Ellis) games.

One thing I do think you could argue is that the 3-point line is further back than it was in 2006. Even so, that should have helped spread the floor even more, but that wasn't the case with this group.

[RoyalShock]

2005-06 top three 3-pt shooters:

Ogirri: 91-206 - 44.2%
Wilson: 42-98 - 42.9%
Cooz: 27-77 - 35.1%

Combined: 160-381 - 42%

2010-11:

Kyles: 68-172 - 39.5%
Smith: 32-79 - 40.5%
Hatch: 29-74 - 39.2%

Combined: 129-325 - 39.7%

If you include the 4th and 5th best shooters, Braeuer and Bradley had about the same production as Ragland and Murry.

The biggest differential is that in 2006 we had two guys who were better "makers" than any of our guys this year, which helped that team spread the floor and open up scoring opportunities.

42% versus 40%. That's 2 more makes per 100 shots taken. Hardly a strategy changer. I give more credence to your earlier point that the post men were better at moving the ball and not letting the offense stagnate in their hands.

How many games this year were decided by 3 or fewer points?

Look at these numbers again:

Ogirri: 91-206 - 44.2%
Wilson: 42-98 - 42.9%

133-304 - 43.8%

Kyles: 68-172 - 39.5%
Smith: 32-79 - 40.5%

100-251 - 39.8%

Two or three more well-timed 3-pointers this year could have made the difference between NIT and NCAA.

[ABC]

And after out of conference, I would guess that Kyles was much lower.

[RoyalShock]

And after out of conference, I would guess that Kyles was much lower.

OOC: 35-65 for 53.8% (Through the Tulsa game)
MVC: 33-107 for 30.8% (AFter the Tulsa game - includes VCU where he was 1-4)

[SHOXAAC]

Did anyone else think we didn't have the chemistry of a tourney team? How often did you see players play with the intensity, desire, and passion as Joe plays with, especially late? Just seems like it's never there with anybody else.

I know it'll seem like I'm picking on Toure, but whenever I watch him, his head is always down, he doesn't look like he cares, never shows emotion, rarely high-fives teammates, etc... even in the good times of games.

I dunno, you just don't see those types of attitudes with NCAA caliber teams. Somebody needs to light a fire under these guys. And I think it starts with the boss.

You're not picking on Toure' any more than I pick on DK. And we both are correct. I think the chemistry of any NCAA caliber team needs to start at the guard positions. Toure' entering this year should have been the guy. He was considered the best player on this team and he plays both guard positions. I stayed at the team hotel in STL and observed all the players and how they interacted as a group. I just found it odd that Toure' always was in the outer edge of the group. I'm just not sure he has the vocal leadership qualities that would lead in defining this teams' chemistry. Nothing against him. I understand he is a stand-up, classy young man, which certainly needs to be noted. However in today's college basketball landscape, he just doesn't cut the mustard for being the leader of the ship.

[DaShox]

Last 10 games
2008-2009: 6-4
2009-2010: 6-4
2010-2011: 6-4

80% player problem. 20% coach problem.

No Chedder either.

"Johnson's father, Lynbert "Cheese" Johnson, who was a standout at Wichita State and played briefly in the NBA, knew Barbee and suggested his son look at Auburn."

http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2011/02/auburns_varez_ward_noel_johnso.html

[ShockerFever]

Last 10 games
2008-2009: 6-4
2009-2010: 6-4
2010-2011: 6-4

80% player problem. 20% coach problem. Go get Cheddar Johnson.

Who recruited the players?


By the way, that stat is VERY disturbing.

[Overtime]

Arrow definatley pointing down, at least for next year. At the end of next year would like to feel like we exceeded expectations and have some young , returning players and incoming recruits that turn the arrow up. We have no freshmen and one soph who played....Coach needs to show us why most of us feel he is a good recruiter because it has indeed fallen off of late

[DaShox]

Turgeon's
Durley -- improved 4.3 ppg in four years
Hatch -- improved 2.8ppg in three years. Thnx, Mark. :good:

[shockerfanmas]

Why don't we let this season finish before we start worrying about next season? This team could win the NIT, or they could lose in the first round. A lot of inconsistency, but let's wait and enjoy the rest of this season before we worry about next season.

[ISASO]

How much different would this season have been if these things would have happened?

*Stutz stepping up to be the starting center from Day 1.
*Blair and Durley playing PF and backing up Stutz at Center.
*Ellis and EO as the backup to the backup at both C and PF.
*Murry the SF from Day 1 and split time with Hatch, with a little Smith for fun.
*Kyles and Smith should have owned the SG spot.
*Ragland/Williams fighting for the starting PG spot.

Not to be too harsh, but we had two starters who should have been role players on a sure-fire, Top 25 NCAA Tournament team. Both would have been great situational players when you needed defense or a 3-ball. Someone around here alluded to this potential problem 3-4 years ago.

It seems that Marshall didn’t give Ragland the same pass on screw-ups from Day 1 as he did Murry. The team never hit their stride because maybe the roles weren’t clear enough. Then there’s the hero complex. Because there weren’t clear roles, everyone believes they were Superman from time to time.

It's 2005 all over again. We'll see if 2011-12 equates to 2006. Wouldn't that be sweet?

[DaShox]

1 NCAA Tournament in 23 years. I'm tired of waiting.

[WstateU]

1 NCAA Tournament in 23 years. I'm tired of waiting.

I feel your pain; however there's not much we can do about it. I guess we could always change our wardrobes to 'Crimson and Blue'. :(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ5ob9B9yD4

[jocoshock]

Last 10 games
2008-2009: 6-4
2009-2010: 6-4
2010-2011: 6-4

80% player problem. 20% coach problem. Go get Cheddar Johnson.

Who recruited the players?


By the way, that stat is VERY disturbing.

Seems like Turgeon has a couple of lackluster finishes; what were his records on the last 10 games with the exception of 2006?