Wheat Shockers versus Corn Huskers

[shockerfanmas]

unfortunately, you don't question Gene Stephenson and his decision making unless you wanna get chewed out, because he's the coach and he knows more about baseball than all of us combined. That according to some shockernet folks. I agree our batting was terrible tonight, however, where a person is at in the lineup should have absolutely NOTHING to do with how he bats. He should be able to hit no matter if he's in the #1 spot or #9 spot, so I don't see how changing the lineup would have effected that

[shox1989]

It was UNL they are ranked in the top 10 and they almost NEVER lose at home. They are very beatable on the road, but they are almost unbeatable at home.

It was one game. It would have been nice to win but losing to a top 10 team in their yard is not the end of the world.

Nearly everyone is projecting Nebraska as a national seed right now. If that ends up being true our loss to them in their yard should not be that big of a deal.

On the other hand, this also points out how imporant it is to host a regional. Beating top teams on the road is a very huge task.

[SB Shock]

The one positive (actually two) is Tim Kelley and Logan Hoch pitched really well - which are all good signs.

The match up we saw last night may be similiar to the match up WSU might see when they get sent to the Lincoln Regional (assuming they get to game 4).

[7hottamales]

unfortunately, you don't question Gene Stephenson and his decision making unless you wanna get chewed out, because he's the coach and he knows more about baseball than all of us combined. That according to some shockernet folks. I agree our batting was terrible tonight, however, where a person is at in the lineup should have absolutely NOTHING to do with how he bats. He should be able to hit no matter if he's in the #1 spot or #9 spot, so I don't see how changing the lineup would have effected that

I pretty much agree...if switching from 9 to 2 or 2 to 4 makes you a worse hitter, you have some serious issues with your mental approach to the game. No player at this level should be that fragile. The only difference between the different places in the order should be the amount of guys on base when you bat and potentially the quality of pitches you see...and that should be a zero sum game for the team as a whole. Getting the right people in the right places to create the best collective offensive threat should be the goal.

Priority #1 should be getting your best hitters the most possible ABs in a game. Kenny Williams hitting 9th absolutely fails on that. Especially when you consider how horrible 2 spots in our lineup above that have been.

Priority #2 should be finding a way to protect your best hitter, especially if your best hitter is by far and away you most feared. Dusty Coleman has way too many holes in his swing at this point in his career to scare anyone into pitching to CG. Weber is a nice hitter, but prone to being very streaky. Also RHs will avoid CG to pitch to Weber all day.

The biggest issue isn't the order, it's Workman being out. You absolutely can't produce consistent offense with 3 holes in your lineup.

I fear that we will really struggle to score 5 runs against any team that gets ahead in the count (or maybe even just doesn't walk 5 or 6 guys) on a regular basis.

[t7017s]

unfortunately, you don't question Gene Stephenson and his decision making unless you wanna get chewed out, because he's the coach and he knows more about baseball than all of us combined. That according to some shockernet folks. I agree our batting was terrible tonight, however, where a person is at in the lineup should have absolutely NOTHING to do with how he bats. He should be able to hit no matter if he's in the #1 spot or #9 spot, so I don't see how changing the lineup would have effected that

It has everything to do with it. You think the lead off guy, clean up guy, or 8 or 9 hole hitter approach the plate the same? or have the same things to accomplish at the plate...? Are you new to baseball? Bunting a guy over from the 2 hole is different than hitting for power in the 4 hole. Switch the exact same players and all a sudden your asking a guy thats become accustomed to hitting with pop and taking the ball deep to bunt and a bunter and single guy to hit the ball deep. its not rocket science but it isnt easy either. It has dramatic effect on these guys. It also has a lot to do with confidence. One day your in the 4 hole and your "the" guy and next week your all the way down to the 8 hole... Whats that say... Says your coach has lost confidence in you and that doesnt exactly help the kid keep his own confidence. Where a guy hits in the lineup has a huge impact in many many ways.

[SekShocker]

unfortunately, you don't question Gene Stephenson and his decision making unless you wanna get chewed out, because he's the coach and he knows more about baseball than all of us combined. That according to some shockernet folks. I agree our batting was terrible tonight, however, where a person is at in the lineup should have absolutely NOTHING to do with how he bats. He should be able to hit no matter if he's in the #1 spot or #9 spot, so I don't see how changing the lineup would have effected that

It has everything to do with it. You think the lead off guy, clean up guy, or 8 or 9 hole hitter approach the plate the same? or have the same things to accomplish at the plate...? Are you new to baseball? Bunting a guy over from the 2 hole is different than hitting for power in the 4 hole. Switch the exact same players and all a sudden your asking a guy thats become accustomed to hitting with pop and taking the ball deep to bunt and a bunter and single guy to hit the ball deep. its not rocket science but it isnt easy either. It has dramatic effect on these guys. It also has a lot to do with confidence. One day your in the 4 hole and your "the" guy and next week your all the way down to the 8 hole... Whats that say... Says your coach has lost confidence in you and that doesnt exactly help the kid keep his own confidence. Where a guy hits in the lineup has a huge impact in many many ways.

No doubt A-Rod has never recovered from being moved down to 7 or 8th in the lineup a few years ago in the playoffs, and Workman has just been awful after starting the season in the three hole and falling to sixth he just hasn't recovered. **Sarcasm**

[t7017s]

I'm not talking about what many consider maybe the greatest baseball player ever. And I'm not talking about josh as he isnt even in the lineup right now and hes a senior and used to moving around the lineup after 4 years of it. But the younger and new guys are different. its hard enough making adjustments to this level and then when your getting jostled around and different things are expected from you after you have finally settled into a "role" its not as simple as you may think. It can really mess with guys. You get pitched differently and you have to approach the plate differently and do so for the better of the team. I'd love it if ever spot in the line up was the same and had the same significance and weight and approach to it and was pitched and handled the same by the opposing team and it was as simple as many on here seem to think it is. But the fact is... its not. I think guys go through mini slumps and the answer isnt always change the lineup. Maybe its best to let the mini slumps pass and not freak out or think a kid cant handle his slot in the line up. I think gene should have left the lineup alone. The offensive woes seem to line up more with these changes in my observation than to the quality of our opponents. Just my .02 cents. Not that they are worth much to anyone but I'm just tossing it out there to talk about.

[KC Shox]

It was UNL they are ranked in the top 10 and they almost NEVER lose at home. They are very beatable on the road, but they are almost unbeatable at home.

It was one game. It would have been nice to win but losing to a top 10 team in their yard is not the end of the world.

Nearly everyone is projecting Nebraska as a national seed right now. If that ends up being true our loss to them in their yard should not be that big of a deal.

On the other hand, this also points out how imporant it is to host a regional. Beating top teams on the road is a very huge task.

I don't have a problem losing to a Top 10 team - especially at their place. What I do have a problem with is this; the offense was horrible and did not compete whatsoever. Hitters know with two strikes you protect the plate at all costs, I watched three guys in the 9th admiring third strike pitches go into the catchers glove. Also, This offense drops off considerably when facing stiffer competition - a certain amount is to be expected - but there have been instances where this offense is a complete no-show and all they are is a body filling up the spot in the batter's box.

Lastly, the Valley sucks and I mean sucks this year. If this team has any hope of hosting a regional then it will have to create it's own arguement because the conference is not going to do this team any favors. This means we cannot afford to lose many if any games against high level competition like last night.

We have a very small window and little to no room for error to convince the committee on granting Wichita as a host site. Our overall schedule is just not very good this year so it is a must to win these mid-week games. If the committee sits down and sees us dominating a weak conference and teams like the non-D1, Binghamton, NDSU, Harvard but go 0-for against Top 25 teams, would you grant Wichita a regional?

[NCAABound]

http://web1.ncaa.org/stats/StatsSrv/ranksummary?sportCode=MBA

I seem to post this every year when this discussion comes up. We haven't been a very good offensive team the past few years, and this year is no different. We seem good this year...because we were so bad last year.

Our highest offensive ranking is 37 (except for "speed" categories). Until we get multiple players who can hit gaps and for power, we will continue to struggle against high-caliber teams with good pitching.

[7hottamales]

http://web1.ncaa.org/stats/StatsSrv/ranksummary

I seem to post this every year when this discussion comes up. We haven't been a very good offensive team the past few years, and this year is no different. We seem good this year...because we were so bad last year.

Our highest offensive ranking is 37 (except for "speed" categories). Until we get multiple players who can hit gaps and for power, we will continue to struggle against high-caliber teams with good pitching.

Our offense ha driven me nuts for years. Outside of 2004, we have been basically incapable of generating consistent offense against teams that don't give us lots of free base runners or extra outs in multiple innings. It has often been masked by facing so much substandard competition throughout the year that constantly struggles to get 2 pitches over for a strike.

[ShockerFever]

It appears our early views of the offense were just blurs. After the first few games of the year, our power numbers have been generally down. Especially after this week, they're really sinking south.

The last homerun I remember that was not aided by the wind as Conor's blast against MSU. Before that, I couldn't tell ya..

[7hottamales]

I'm not talking about what many consider maybe the greatest baseball player ever. And I'm not talking about josh as he isnt even in the lineup right now and hes a senior and used to moving around the lineup after 4 years of it. But the younger and new guys are different. its hard enough making adjustments to this level and then when your getting jostled around and different things are expected from you after you have finally settled into a "role" its not as simple as you may think. It can really mess with guys. You get pitched differently and you have to approach the plate differently and do so for the better of the team. I'd love it if ever spot in the line up was the same and had the same significance and weight and approach to it and was pitched and handled the same by the opposing team and it was as simple as many on here seem to think it is. But the fact is... its not. I think guys go through mini slumps and the answer isnt always change the lineup. Maybe its best to let the mini slumps pass and not freak out or think a kid cant handle his slot in the line up. I think gene should have left the lineup alone. The offensive woes seem to line up more with these changes in my observation than to the quality of our opponents. Just my .02 cents. Not that they are worth much to anyone but I'm just tossing it out there to talk about.

In theory, there might be some validity to what you are saying, but in reality we really don't expect much different from any of our spots in the line up.

Basically, we don't do a whole lot of manufacturing runs and we have virtually no one with distinguishable power. We hope for and expect every spot to get on base and try to get balls into the gaps with runners on. I don't see much different coming from the 2 hole to the clean up spot...or from the 9 to the 2.

Would you not agree that our team cannot function optimally with one of our 3 most consistent hitters (thus far) hitting one less time every game and hitting with the 2 spots immediately preceding him batting .240?

Would you not agree that CG getting intentionally walked every time first base is open with two outs or pitched around with one out and consistently not being able to make the other team pay will prevent us from reaching our potential?

Even if you are right and there are some growing pains to making the changes, we need to get the right pieces in the right places for the long run.

[Hill Sitter]

Win or lose, last night will prove to have little if any bearing on regional hosting. Last year's mid week losses to OU, ORU, OSU, So Alabama, KSU, and Arkansas back that claim up.

When we beat Nebraska last year I remember going to their boards after the game and reading their fans being upset because our good pitching made their batters look really bad at times. I recall Noah Booth striking out several hitters in the late innings i.e.., just the reverse of last night. If I recall right , conference affiliation, schedule strength etc was not a factor in the discussion that night as things went our way.

I have no real point here, other than don't over analyze every pitch, every AB and yes, every game in a 60 game season or you'll go crazy.

[SFL]

I'm not talking about what many consider maybe the greatest baseball player ever. And I'm not talking about josh as he isnt even in the lineup right now and hes a senior and used to moving around the lineup after 4 years of it. But the younger and new guys are different. its hard enough making adjustments to this level and then when your getting jostled around and different things are expected from you after you have finally settled into a "role" its not as simple as you may think. It can really mess with guys. You get pitched differently and you have to approach the plate differently and do so for the better of the team. I'd love it if ever spot in the line up was the same and had the same significance and weight and approach to it and was pitched and handled the same by the opposing team and it was as simple as many on here seem to think it is. But the fact is... its not. I think guys go through mini slumps and the answer isnt always change the lineup. Maybe its best to let the mini slumps pass and not freak out or think a kid cant handle his slot in the line up. I think gene should have left the lineup alone. The offensive woes seem to line up more with these changes in my observation than to the quality of our opponents. Just my .02 cents. Not that they are worth much to anyone but I'm just tossing it out there to talk about.

In theory, there might be some validity to what you are saying, but in reality we really don't expect much different from any of our spots in the line up.

Basically, we don't do a whole lot of manufacturing runs and we have virtually no one with distinguishable power. We hope for and expect every spot to get on base and try to get balls into the gaps with runners on. I don't see much different coming from the 2 hole to the clean up spot...or from the 9 to the 2.

Would you not agree that our team cannot function optimally with one of our 3 most consistent hitters (thus far) hitting one less time every game and hitting with the 2 spots immediately preceding him batting .240?

Would you not agree that CG getting intentionally walked every time first base is open with two outs or pitched around with one out and consistently not being able to make the other team pay will prevent us from reaching our potential?

Even if you are right and there are some growing pains to making the changes, we need to get the right pieces in the right places for the long run.

7hot... thanks for using paragraphs... it's so much easier to read your posts. :good:

[t7017s]

I'm not talking about what many consider maybe the greatest baseball player ever. And I'm not talking about josh as he isnt even in the lineup right now and hes a senior and used to moving around the lineup after 4 years of it. But the younger and new guys are different. its hard enough making adjustments to this level and then when your getting jostled around and different things are expected from you after you have finally settled into a "role" its not as simple as you may think. It can really mess with guys. You get pitched differently and you have to approach the plate differently and do so for the better of the team. I'd love it if ever spot in the line up was the same and had the same significance and weight and approach to it and was pitched and handled the same by the opposing team and it was as simple as many on here seem to think it is. But the fact is... its not. I think guys go through mini slumps and the answer isnt always change the lineup. Maybe its best to let the mini slumps pass and not freak out or think a kid cant handle his slot in the line up. I think gene should have left the lineup alone. The offensive woes seem to line up more with these changes in my observation than to the quality of our opponents. Just my .02 cents. Not that they are worth much to anyone but I'm just tossing it out there to talk about.

In theory, there might be some validity to what you are saying, but in reality we really don't expect much different from any of our spots in the line up.

Basically, we don't do a whole lot of manufacturing runs and we have virtually no one with distinguishable power. We hope for and expect every spot to get on base and try to get balls into the gaps with runners on. I don't see much different coming from the 2 hole to the clean up spot...or from the 9 to the 2.

Would you not agree that our team cannot function optimally with one of our 3 most consistent hitters (thus far) hitting one less time every game and hitting with the 2 spots immediately preceding him batting .240?

Would you not agree that CG getting intentionally walked every time first base is open with two outs or pitched around with one out and consistently not being able to make the other team pay will prevent us from reaching our potential?

Even if you are right and there are some growing pains to making the changes, we need to get the right pieces in the right places for the long run.

7hot... thanks for using paragraphs... it's so much easier to read your posts. :good:

My bad. I'll do better next time.