Keep the Faith

[shox1989]

While the pitching isn't as good as we're used to, if you look at our pitching stats vs. opponents, it's virtually even, and that's with 27 more walks issued by Shocker hurlers.

It's the offense that is lagging behind opponents:

WSU - .270/.358/.375
OPP - .278/.373/.385

If an MLB team loses their top two starters early in the season, for the season, and replaces them with #5-level starters, they are toast unless they have the Tigers' lineup. I can't help but believe we would be around .500 and leading the Valley right now without those injuries.

This team has two seniors. I don't know if any of our juniors are draft-worthy in the top 15 rounds, perhaps Tinkham. There's no reason to think we won't be markedly better next year. If Butler can bring in another couple of contributing freshmen next year, and the year after, then the ball should be rolling in the right direction.

The only reason this team only has 2 seniors is because the coaching staff ran all of the others off. The lack of experience argument does't hold any water with me when it is self-inflicted.

[1972Shocker]

The only reason this team only has 2 seniors is because the coaching staff ran all of the others off. The lack of experience argument does't hold any water with me when it is self-inflicted.

Okay so we had 12 juniors on last year's team Including Mikel Mucha would get to repeat his Junior year with a medical redshirt and Brandon Kimbrel who also is listed on this year's roster as RJr. He has 5 AB's this year. Ray Ashford and Bob Arens are the only 2 seniors on this year's team.

Casey Gillaspie, A.J. Ladwig, Tyler Baker and Chase Simpson were all drafted and signed pro contracts.

So that leaves Cody Bobbit, Zair Koeiman, T.J. Looney and Kris Gardner as the Juniors who presumably were "run off". Which of those players are you pining for and why do you think those players would have made a significant difference this year?

[RoyalShock]

Reason != Excuse

Besides, my point isn't that the disappointing season is due to a lack of senior experience, it's that there is hope next year will be better.

[1972Shocker]

Reason != Excuse

Besides, my point isn't that the disappointing season is due to a lack of senior experience, it's that there is hope next year will be better.

It is not that we lack senior experience. You really would prefer not to have a lot of seniors. Hopefully, most of your juniors are good enough to attract interest from the pros. The experience problem this year is that we have very precious little D-1 experience period throughout the roster. Now will getting experience make that much difference. Only time will tell.

[RoyalShock]

It is not that we lack senior experience. You really would prefer not to have a lot of seniors. Hopefully, most of your juniors are good enough to attract interest from the pros. The experience problem this year is that we have very precious little D-1 experience period throughout the roster. Now will getting experience make that much difference. Only time will tell.

Just so there's no confusion (my mistake if there is), I was replying to shox1989's post.

[shockfan89_]

Okay so we had 12 juniors on last year's team Including Mikel Mucha would get to repeat his Junior year with a medical redshirt and Brandon Kimbrel who also is listed on this year's roster as RJr. He has 5 AB's this year. Ray Ashford and Bob Arens are the only 2 seniors on this year's team.

Casey Gillaspie, A.J. Ladwig, Tyler Baker and Chase Simpson were all drafted and signed pro contracts.

So that leaves Cody Bobbit, Zair Koeiman, T.J. Looney and Kris Gardner as the Juniors who presumably were "run off". Which of those players are you pining for and why do you think those players would have made a significant difference this year?

You forgot Garrett Brummett (Freshman All-American Gene's last year) that was told he didn't have a spot on the roster this year. I think Kris Gardner's arm would be pretty welcomed on this staff right now. I heard that Baker and Simpson were "encouraged" to sign regardless of the offer because we had players coming in with much superior talent and needed to make room on the roster.

[1972Shocker]

You forgot Garrett Brummett (Freshman All-American Gene's last year) that was told he didn't have a spot on the roster this year. I think Kris Gardner's arm would be pretty welcomed on this staff right now. I heard that Baker and Simpson were "encouraged" to sign regardless of the offer because we had players coming in with much superior talent and needed to make room on the roster.

I did not forget Garrett Brummett. He would have been a Junior this year. I was replying specifically to the assertion by shox1989 that we have only 2 seniors this year because all our juniors were run off. Since Garrett was not one of last year's Juniors I did not consider him relevant to the point being discussed. However, I will concede he was run off as well.

Kris has a 3.78 ERA at a D-II school this season. Not bad but not world beating either considering the lower level of competition. However, I am sure Kris could at least find the plate more consistently than some of guys on this year's pitching staff.

Simpson and Baker may have been "encouraged" to sign for the reasons you state I have no idea. However, Simpson was taken in the 14th round and Baker in the 15th round and I thought those were pretty favorable drafts for those two guys based on their performance last year. I'm not at all sure that their prospects of improving their draft status by returning for their senior years was that good and it certainly could have a down side as well. I suspect that probably came into play in their thinking as well.

Chase had a decent year in low A ball last summer hitting 0.286 in 189 AB's with 7 homers but his 10 errors in 109 chances left a lot to be desired. He is starting out in A ball again this summer.

Baker had a decent summer also last year in Rookie League and low A ball hitting 0.271 in 187 AB's with 4 home runs. He threw out 38% of opponents attempted steals which I think is pretty good. He is starting out in high A ball this summer.

Garrett Brummett is 3-2 with a 4.57 ERA at Emporia State this year. Again okay but not world beating at the D-II level.

[shockfan89_]

My bad on Brummett. I was confused on junior last year vs this year...

[Aargh]

Right now my confidence in Butler winning the Valley is at the same level of my confidence that Greg McDermott will win a championship in the Big East.

[SB Shock]

While the pitching isn't as good as we're used to, if you look at our pitching stats vs. opponents, it's virtually even, and that's with 27 more walks issued by Shocker hurlers.

It's the offense that is lagging behind opponents:

WSU - .270/.358/.375
OPP - .278/.373/.385

If an MLB team loses their top two starters early in the season, for the season, and replaces them with #5-level starters, they are toast unless they have the Tigers' lineup. I can't help but believe we would be around .500 and leading the Valley right now without those injuries.

This team has two seniors. I don't know if any of our juniors are draft-worthy in the top 15 rounds, perhaps Tinkham. There's no reason to think we won't be markedly better next year. If Butler can bring in another couple of contributing freshmen next year, and the year after, then the ball should be rolling in the right direction.

WSU offense this year is scoring 5.86 runs per game compared to 4.98 from 2014, and is slightly better than 2013 which was 5.6 runs per game.

Had the pitching (and fielding) this year had been at least on par with last year or 2013 or 2014 WSU record would project out to be: 24-12

FWIW,

2015 SOS is 99 so far,
2014 SOS was 59
2013 SOS was 125

[RoyalShock]

WSU offense this year is scoring 5.86 runs per game compared to 4.98 from 2014, and is slightly better than 2013 which was 5.6 runs per game.

Had the pitching (and fielding) this year had been at least on par with last year or 2013 or 2014 WSU record would project out to be: 24-12

FWIW,

2015 SOS is 99 so far,
2014 SOS was 59
2013 SOS was 125

My takeaway from that is that our offense has performed relative to the competition. But you're right, if we were getting the pitching we're used to, things would be very different.

[SB Shock]

My takeaway from that is that our offense has performed relative to the competition. But you're right, if we were getting the pitching we're used to, things would be very different.

That could be very true and why I posted SOS. We will see if WSU hitting is better or not as their SOS will be ramping up for the rest of the way.

[strongisbeautiful17]

Okay so we had 12 juniors on last year's team Including Mikel Mucha would get to repeat his Junior year with a medical redshirt and Brandon Kimbrel who also is listed on this year's roster as RJr. He has 5 AB's this year. Ray Ashford and Bob Arens are the only 2 seniors on this year's team.

Casey Gillaspie, A.J. Ladwig, Tyler Baker and Chase Simpson were all drafted and signed pro contracts.

So that leaves Cody Bobbit, Zair Koeiman, T.J. Looney and Kris Gardner as the Juniors who presumably were "run off". Which of those players are you pining for and why do you think those players would have made a significant difference this year?

I think we could have used Looney and Gardner this year for sure as well as Mitch McIntyre and Austin Gardner. Both Mitch and Austin are pitching in the low to mid 90's at the Jucos they transfered to. Mitch has signed to play baseball next year with Indiana State and Austin at the University of Texas Arlington. Along with Brummett that would have given us (5) experienced pitchers to look to for depth. I heard today our freshmen SS Wes Phillips who left in January has signed to play short stop next year for East Carolina University. I think if we would have been able to retain these experienced players for this year our W/L record might look a little more promising. I hope we will see more retention and less "recruiting to replace" in the years ahead

[KansasShocker]

I heard looney is not eligible to play this year, so he may not be a guy that was run off (Not sure if that is true or not). I can see mitch m. Being in the low 90's, not sure I believe austin g. Is low to mid 90's though as he was low 80's last year when I saw him throw. I was a big fan of Wes p. I thought he would be do well in a wsu uniform, I liked his actions at ss.