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  • Originally posted by shox1989 View Post
    All of this kind of talk has been upsetting to me but I was very surpised by my wife's reaction to the Eagle article. She is very upset about it and said there is no way they can fire Gene. She said if they fire Gene she wants us to not only cancel our season baseball tickets but our SASO membership and basketball tickets too. I told her I have been very upset by all of this talk for some time, but I am not sure we should go that far.

    I hope everything gets worked out and whatever happens Gene is not fired because my wife usually wins.
    That's too bad. Always hate to lose good fans. But it happens all the time for many different and varied reasons. I would hope that at a minimum you and your wife communicate your feelings to ADES so he can at least weigh the amount of support for Gene staying vs the support for Gene going.

    Who knows how this is going to shake out, but it is not looking too good at this point. Gene could certainly complicate matters if was able to get his team to make a strong post-season run, althouhg some posters seem to think it is a done deal.

    There is not doubt Gene's first 28 years tenure as Shocker coach was outstanding. Then he quit and accepted the job as OU coach in 2005. Gene then found some things about OU he did not like and asked to be rehired. One can argue about whether rehiring Gene was a good idea or not, especially with no contract concessions from Gene was a good idea or not but that is what was done. Now after 8 years in his 2nd round on the job a cost/benefit evaluation of the baseall program has to be made and at this point the costs we are incurring simply seem excessive for the product being produced. One way or the other that has to be corrected, or at the very least WSU has to try to correct that.

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    • Originally posted by 1972Shocker View Post
      That's too bad. Always hate to lose good fans. But it happens all the time for many different and varied reasons. I would hope that at a minimum you and your wife communicate your feelings to ADES so he can at least weigh the amount of support for Gene staying vs the support for Gene going.

      Who knows how this is going to shake out, but it is not looking too good at this point. Gene could certainly complicate matters if was able to get his team to make a strong post-season run, althouhg some posters seem to think it is a done deal.

      There is not doubt Gene's first 28 years tenure as Shocker coach was outstanding. Then he quit and accepted the job as OU coach in 2005. Gene then found some things about OU he did not like and asked to be rehired. One can argue about whether rehiring Gene was a good idea or not, especially with no contract concessions from Gene was a good idea or not but that is what was done. Now after 8 years in his 2nd round on the job a cost/benefit evaluation of the baseall program has to be made and at this point the costs we are incurring simply seem excessive for the product being produced. One way or the other that has to be corrected, or at the very least WSU has to try to correct that.
      I like how you make the distinction between pre-OU vs post OU by calling it a rehire and his second round. Basically, when Krusty and Krew left, they said they could not do in the future for WSU what they had for it in the past. They were done with WSU, the books were square, and they were off to OU.

      Upon his rehire, it was just as if WSU was hiring a new coach. Not only did WSU not re-work his contract using performance bonuses and a lower base salary (as they probably would have done a new individual), they ignored his warning of our "fate" and continued the old contract with future increases years in advance. If the books were not square before, they surely were then. Nope, we even forgave a scandel that could have been cause for firing.

      Now, Gene has become the highest paid, mediocre performing coach in D-I baseball. At least Soggy has been to a couple of NCAAs since us. I just don't get how people can still say we owe him more. Just where's our damn return on our investment over the last 5 years?

      We have been played like the weak little stooges we are ever since we showed our hand upon his rehiring. Frankly, where's our dignity?

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      • I think we need to be fair, some of the best teams Gene has had over the last 15 years were some of his squads that immediately followed the ou debacle. With that said, it is time for a change

        Edit: my point? Gene 2.0 wasn't a total failure...but was far from a smashing success.
        Last edited by Shockerman; May 18, 2013, 08:59 PM.

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        • Originally posted by Shockerman View Post
          I think we need to be fair, some of the best teams we have had over the last 15 years were some of his squads that immediately followed the ou debacle. With that said, it is time for a change.
          Yeah, lets forget the 80's and 90's - please, he had a couple good teams, but they don't rate as one of the "best".

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          • Originally posted by SB Shock View Post
            Yeah, lets forget the 80's and 90's - please, he had a couple good teams, but they don't rate as one of the "best".
            You are forgetting that we live in a what have you done lately for me society. And Gene hasn't done much but wreck the program.

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            • Originally posted by SB Shock View Post
              Yeah, lets forget the 80's and 90's - please, he had a couple good teams, but they don't rate as one of the "best".
              reading is fundamental as we are talking about Gene's second stint at the WSU helm. My whole point is that some on here are convinced we have been mediocre since his return, which is not the case. Now, the last 4 or 5 seasons, yep, no argument here.

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              • Originally posted by rrshock View Post
                You are forgetting that we live in a what have you done lately for me society. And Gene hasn't done much but wreck the program.
                I believe the program has underperformed since the last SR of 2008, but I don't believe he has "wrecked" the program. Overall, Gene's WSU baseball program has exceeded any and all expectations, and only recently has there been restless reactionary disappointment.

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                • I would have to say that I am a supporter of the current staff. I would also support reducing their current salary structure. Changing coaches, especially from a coach that basically built the program, is dangerous. You may not be satisfied with the last few years but it can get far worse. There are far too many examples of coaches getting let go and the team taking a nose dive for years and years. Our own basketball program is an example of what can happen without the right coach.

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                  • Originally posted by engrshock View Post
                    I would have to say that I am a supporter of the current staff. I would also support reducing their current salary structure. Changing coaches, especially from a coach that basically built the program, is dangerous. You may not be satisfied with the last few years but it can get far worse. There are far too many examples of coaches getting let go and the team taking a nose dive for years and years. Our own basketball program is an example of what can happen without the right coach.
                    If that was going to happen, I would have thought that would already be in place. Maybe if this year's team makes a strong run deep into the post season might change some minds. If that were to happen I think replacing JT would be part of the deal. Whether or not that would be with a Head Coach in Waiting I don't know. If it was with a HCIW then the time period for when Gene would agree to step down would have to be specified and I can't see that extending beyond 3 more years.

                    On Sports Daily this mornining Bruce Heartl reported that he was chatting with a long time assistant coach of another program recently. Bruce said this Coach had a great deal of respect for what Gene, Brent and JT have done at Wichita State. However, he said over the last few years he has not encountered the WSU coaching staff out on the recruiting trail like he used to. Sounds like a Coaching staff that knows the writing is on the wall and is just playing out the string.

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                    • Originally posted by engrshock View Post
                      I would have to say that I am a supporter of the current staff. I would also support reducing their current salary structure. Changing coaches, especially from a coach that basically built the program, is dangerous. You may not be satisfied with the last few years but it can get far worse. There are far too many examples of coaches getting let go and the team taking a nose dive for years and years. Our own basketball program is an example of what can happen without the right coach.
                      What is not known, and probably never will be, is that changes and/or a restructuring of contracts most likely was tried, and rejected, back before the automatic extention was taken off the table. Just a guess, but a guess that would make sense. It would appear that Krusty and Krew knew things would be coming to an end at WSU several years ago if they didn't accept some changes, so they have been collecting their paychecks and waiting to see if they would have to continue to show up or not to get them. Just an opinion.

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                      • Originally posted by 1972Shocker View Post
                        If that was going to happen, I would have thought that would already be in place. Maybe if this year's team makes a strong run deep into the post season might change some minds. If that were to happen I think replacing JT would be part of the deal. Whether or not that would be with a Head Coach in Waiting I don't know. If it was with a HCIW then the time period for when Gene would agree to step down would have to be specified and I can't see that extending beyond 3 more years.

                        On Sports Daily this mornining Bruce Heartl reported that he was chatting with a long time assistant coach of another program recently. Bruce said this Coach had a great deal of respect for what Gene, Brent and JT have done at Wichita State. However, he said over the last few years he has not encountered the WSU coaching staff out on the recruiting trail like he used to. Sounds like a Coaching staff that knows the writing is on the wall and is just playing out the string.
                        There was a story going around at saturday game that ADES went to Gene in August of this school year and told him he needed to replace JT. The story goes that Gene stormed out and has not talked to ADES since.

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                        • Originally posted by SB Shock View Post
                          There was a story going around at saturday game that ADES went to Gene in August of this school year and told him he needed to replace JT. The story goes that Gene stormed out and has not talked to ADES since.
                          if true, it is unfortunate that loyalty cost him his job. Of course it might just be stubbornness.

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                          • Another good read from Omaha.

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                            • Bump
                              “Losers Average Losers.” ― Paul Tudor Jones

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                              • Originally posted by 1972Shocker View Post
                                The outfied hill has its pros and cons. Mostly pros. But one problem with the outfiled hill is that it does not create the environment that a half-full grandstand can and does. A crowd of 1,500 (actual attendance) with 800 on the outfield hill, 200 in the aluminum bench seats and 500 spread around the various chairback areas just is not very impressive or imposing in terms of atmosphere.

                                However, not sure there is a good solution for that. Maybe they need to review the ticket pricing schemes and even close off the aluminum bench seats until the chairback seating is 80% sold out.

                                I don't think there is a lot you can do to entice the hill people to come into the stadium. For one thing it is out in the sun and most of those folks simply prefer that location. If they can't be on the hill they probably would just stay home.
                                The chair back seats are terrible for most of the spring - it is a shaded wind tunnel. I honestly wish the stadium was a more in line with OSU set-up. Sometimes simpler is better. They have also made the hill much less fun over the past ten years which hurts attendance to some degree.

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