NFL Kneeling

[wufan]

One last thing I'll add to this discussion before finally admitting that it's Monday morning and I have to do real work:

All I heard last weekend during the protests in St. Louis was "why can't everybody just protest peacefully?" This was the primary complaint even though 99.9% of the protesting was completely peaceful.

And now we have individuals who stand for the same causes and are using their platform of fame to peacefully protest and what is the reaction? "Boycott these sons of b******."

Regardless of the rest of the argument, a boycott IS a peaceful protest.

[pinstripers]

http://www.breitbart.com/sports/2017/09/20/report-nfl-ratings-crash-new-lows-cbs-week-2/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social

[jdshock]

Regardless of the rest of the argument, a boycott IS a peaceful protest.

I never said it wasn't. I just meant maybe at some point people should admit the problem is with the intent of the protest rather than acting like the the type of protest is the problem. If you're constantly calling for peaceful protests on race-issues, but then once one happens you say "c'mon, that's terrible!" then you maybe just don't want that protest to happen. Which, I guess, is fine. Just don't mask that belief by acting like every other protest is violent.

[pinstripers]

This will spill over into college athletics, I fear.

[ShockCrazy]

Many of the people upset about players kneeling and "disrespecting" our country and flag do much worse to disrespect our flag regularly. Things that people do that genuinely violate the flag code, wear as clothing, put it on something disposable such as paper plates and napkins, and here's the one that really gets me, use it to profit, like say putting it on a beer can. Anheuser-Busch aren't some noble patriots, they stuck the flag on there to sell cans, and fools gobble that up. Also kneeling isn't considered disrespectful, standing is only recommended. But even still I don't believe anyone who has done ANY of the above things is disrespecting those who have fought for our country. They didn't fight for some piece of cloth, or some song, they fought for the ideals, values, and rights they represent. You know what I think would be disrespectful to them? Not standing up for what you believe in, not speaking out when you see something wrong, not protesting against injustice, the things they explicitly fought for. Now that would be disrespectful.

[Kung Wu]

If I were a manager or owner of a Walmart, I wouldn't allow an employee to engage in a personal protest at my store or while clocked in -- even if I agreed with the purpose of the protest.

[pinstripers]

Many of the people upset about players kneeling and "disrespecting" our country and flag do much worse to disrespect our flag regularly. Things that people do that genuinely violate the flag code, wear as clothing, put it on something disposable such as paper plates and napkins, and here's the one that really gets me, use it to profit, like say putting it on a beer can. Anheuser-Busch aren't some noble patriots, they stuck the flag on there to sell cans, and fools gobble that up. Also kneeling isn't considered disrespectful, standing is only recommended. But even still I don't believe anyone who has done ANY of the above things is disrespecting those who have fought for our country. They didn't fight for some piece of cloth, or some song, they fought for the ideals, values, and rights they represent. You know what I think would be disrespectful to them? Not standing up for what you believe in, not speaking out when you see something wrong, not protesting against injustice, the things they explicitly fought for. Now that would be disrespectful.

what does that even matter?

[ShockCrazy]

If I were a manager or owner of a Walmart, I wouldn't allow an employee to engage in a personal protest at my store or while clocked in -- even if I agreed with the purpose of the protest.

You also as an employer wouldn't waste time on something unnecessary based on nationalism either.

[WuShock16]

Food for thought...

The major part of this issue lies within the NFL...but since LeBron and Steph have spoken out, let me divert to the NBA for a second. It's convenient to say that pro athletes are "spoiled pricks" because their profession pays them sums of money that most of us will only dream of having.

I'll put an actual face to this...one that we all know and revere immensely. What if Fred VanVleet used his platform for some sort of protest? Looking at his Twitter feed, it wouldn't surprise me if he did. Would any of us here call him a "spoiled *****?" As far as I'm concerned, those would probably be the last two words I would use to describe him. Anyone who knows his story and has heard him speak for more than five seconds knows that he is very thoughtful and articulate.

It's easy to generalize and demean what we don't know...but much harder to do when we place actual familiar human beings in those places.

Thoughts?

[Play Angry]

Generally disagree with the chosen avenue of some players to advocate for their position from a political standpoint, however, am also fine with the players' exercise of their right to protest and some fans' reaction in the form of a boycott.

If you dislike the NFL's stance on this (believing it to be too lenient), just wait for the NBA's approach this season. There are plenty of articles out there for the inquisitive. Also, as of this weekend, the first MLB player has taken a similar approach during the national anthem and I anticipate he will not be alone for very long.

Despite complaints about the divisions in our country, I think many people on both sides do not really want unity, they just want the other side to shut up.

[pinstripers]

Are you talking about refusing to stand?

[Kung Wu]

You also as an employer wouldn't waste time on something unnecessary based on nationalism either.

Huh?

[shockfan89_]

Huh?

You likely wouldn't take the time to play the national anthem or recite the pledge of allegiance before the start of your work day.

While I agree this is true, the point is still valid. Most employers have very little tolerance for protest at work regardless of whether it is silent and peaceful. Next time your boss has a staff meeting try sitting in the corner, facing the wall, and refusing to participate because you don't support every decision your company makes. Even better, next time you have a customer facing event, stand in the corner of the room and let your customers see your actions. Chances are you won't have a job very long.

The NFL (and each team) can choose what rules they have for their employees/players. The players do not have a constitutional right to kneel during the national anthem (while they are at work), they have been given permission by their employer (NFL/team) to do this. The NFL/teams also must accept the fact that their viewership is down and will likely continue to decrease as a result of allowing their employees to kneel.

[ShockCrazy]

Huh?

You also wouldn't play the national anthem as an employer.

[WuDrWu]

One last thing I'll add to this discussion before finally admitting that it's Monday morning and I have to do real work:

All I heard last weekend during the protests in St. Louis was "why can't everybody just protest peacefully?" This was the primary complaint even though 99.9% of the protesting was completely peaceful.

And now we have individuals who stand for the same causes and are using their platform of fame to peacefully protest and what is the reaction? "Boycott these sons of b******."

Isn't boycotting peaceful? The black community and their leaders ROUTINELY play the boycott card. I don't see any violence there.