Elephant in the Room

[WuDrWu]

I really don't mind paying rent, but as long as it's free............

And I thought some people suffered from TDS, but wowzers.

[Shockm]

Is Nostradamus going retro?

Did you copy and paste your post from one of your past frequent nauseating posts supporting Todd Butler?
Keep supporting the student athletes but stop giving a participation trophy for losing coaches.

Didn’t you learn anything during your blind support of the Butler fiasco?
Back to school for WuducWu.

So Chris and Shannon Lamb (they come as a package deal you know) now equal Todd Butler?
Please give a statistical, factual basis of how this is true.

[Veritas]

So Chris and Shannon Lamb (they come as a package deal you know) now equal Todd Butler?
Please give a statistical, factual basis of how this is true.

Are they a “coaching” package again? They used to when the program was good, but didn’t she move onto a more administrative role?

Take a look at the record the last 4 years. Both are losing programs.

[WuDrWu]

I'm guessing you don't know much about Shannon and what she deals with nowadays. If you did, you would likely take a different stance. Why don't you just stop while you're behind.


I never said any coach was immune from scrutiny. There's no doubt the volleyball program was more successful 6 years ago than it is today. Anyone has the right to question if the direction is right or wrong, and we can have that debate and should have that debate. Clearly I will value some things differently than you. I'm also certain we'll both have our supporters and detractors.

And as I've told you before, many many times, my support for Coach Butler was far more supporting the program, which was very much needed at the time. And I'm guessing that a few things that I said to him in private were more harsh than what you said on your keyboard. But when you are someone who actually supports the program, not a keyboard warrior who likely doesn't even buy tickets, the latter takes a bit of a back seat. Maybe you don't think it should, I suppose that's your right. My view differs.


I'm not sure what you mean by "both are losing programs".

Last 4 seasons volleyball is 61-49. 2 winning seasons, 2 losing seasons. Last 3 seasons net losing.....32-45. 2 losing 1 winning. Yes, they've had a hard time rebuilding from a senior class that was arguably the best ever at the school. There's not much doubt about it. This is an important season to see progress.


Still doesn't change my stance on the value that the Lambs have added, and continue to add, to WSU, Volleyball and the fabric of our community.

Have you ever been to a Fast Four? It's amazing what he's done for young girls with that program alone.

[WuDrWu]

https://volleyballmag.com/vbm-coy-122117/ 2017 National Coach of the Year by Volleyball Magazine. AVCA North Region Coach of the Year.

4 years ago, there were people that know a lot more than you and I together that thought Lambo was pretty damned good. Maybe he has lost it all in 4 seasons. I would argue no, but I suppose it's possible I'm dead wrong. It's also possible that you are a complete douchenozzle. Like I said, anything is possible.

[Veritas]

I'm guessing you don't know much about Shannon and what she deals with nowadays. If you did, you would likely take a different stance. Why don't you just stop while you're behind.


I never said any coach was immune from scrutiny. There's no doubt the volleyball program was more successful 6 years ago than it is today. Anyone has the right to question if the direction is right or wrong, and we can have that debate and should have that debate. Clearly I will value some things differently than you. I'm also certain we'll both have our supporters and detractors.

And as I've told you before, many many times, my support for Coach Butler was far more supporting the program, which was very much needed at the time. And I'm guessing that a few things that I said to him in private were more harsh than what you said on your keyboard. But when you are someone who actually supports the program, not a keyboard warrior who likely doesn't even buy tickets, the latter takes a bit of a back seat. Maybe you don't think it should, I suppose that's your right. My view differs.


I'm not sure what you mean by "both are losing programs".

Last 4 seasons volleyball is 61-49. 2 winning seasons, 2 losing seasons. Last 3 seasons net losing.....32-45. 2 losing 1 winning. Yes, they've had a hard time rebuilding from a senior class that was arguably the best ever at the school. There's not much doubt about it. This is an important season to see progress.


Still doesn't change my stance on the value that the Lambs have added, and continue to add, to WSU, Volleyball and the fabric of our community.

Have you ever been to a Fast Four? It's amazing what he's done for young girls with that program alone.

You’re creeping me out with your numerous posts about being behind. Past references about “bending over coeds” etc. Creepy.

Fast Four is a fund raiser. It’s not altruistic.

A better walked back response WuducWu after 4 hours of thought from your initial response but still lacking justification on holding coaches responsible for losing season-after- season-after season. You’ve tempered your message somewhat after the initial Butleresque post from yesterday though.

Maybe you are learning after all grasshopper (your generation, correct?) and that is all one can hope.
Be careful on the revisionist history though. It can come back to bite.

[Veritas]

https://volleyballmag.com/vbm-coy-122117/ 2017 National Coach of the Year by Volleyball Magazine. AVCA North Region Coach of the Year.

4 years ago, there were people that know a lot more than you and I together that thought Lambo was pretty damned good. Maybe he has lost it all in 4 seasons. I would argue no, but I suppose it's possible I'm dead wrong. It's also possible that you are a complete douchenozzle. Like I said, anything is possible.

Yes, he was good back then (or was that his wife?)
Just not lately.

Keep trying to grab the pebbles from my hand.

[WuDrWu]

Fast Four is a fund raiser??! Ok Slick.

[boyshocker]

Been plenty of transfers but has anyone looked into how those kids did at new schools? Did any of them make it at the D1 level? I know Gio did but I've heard she enjoyed the good years then had to play with a team that wasn't as committed and had a great opportunity to transfer. By the way VB 101 was a lot of fun, thought this looked like one of the tallest teams they have had in a while.

[1972Shocker]

Kora Kauling seems to have found a home and a system that suits her game at Bradley. She had a decent year as the starting setter for the Braves this past season. Happy for her.

I expect that Mariah Buss will do well at Omaha.

[Veritas]

Fast Four is a fund raiser??! Ok Slick.

Well if it is a completely selfless act (which I doubt) then perhaps you and Lamb0 have THAT to hang your hat on. Forget wins and championships. I recall you using the same argument with Butler as “such a nice guy.”

Why do you think he is struggling so badly? After his undefeated AAC inaugural season and his lecturing the other AAC coaches on how to schedule, his downward trend is concerning.

What is going on?

[jimshocker]

Well if it is a completely selfless act (which I doubt) then perhaps you and Lamb0 have THAT to hang your hat on. Forget wins and championships. I recall you using the same argument with Butler as “such a nice guy.”

Why do you think he is struggling so badly? After his undefeated AAC inaugural season and his lecturing the other AAC coaches on how to schedule, his downward trend is concerning.

What is going on?

Fast Fours is a fundraiser. The money goes to either No Coast Volleyball or WSU volleyball depending on the time of year. No Coast Coaches are Chris Lamb disciples. Either way you shake it, after the courts are paid for, the money goes to Chris Lamb 'guys".

[WuDrWu]

Fast Fours is a fundraiser. The money goes to either No Coast Volleyball or WSU volleyball depending on the time of year. No Coast Coaches are Chris Lamb disciples. Either way you shake it, after the courts are paid for, the money goes to Chris Lamb 'guys".

So disingenuous. By your definition then literally every business venture is a fund raiser.


Fast Fours are mostly young girls being active and having fun playing volleyball, dancing and listening to music. It's a wonderful activity for kids to be active. How anyone can besmirch something like that is freaking beyond me. You would be hard pressed to see more kids smiling and having fun doing something anywhere, anytime. SMH

Why has WSU volleyball trended down in the wins and losses category the last 3 years?

Ok, let's look.

I say this a lot, but it's worth repeating. The other guys try. WSU joined the ACC with a loaded team, and Lambo ran over everyone. Other programs made changes and good hires and started taking Volleyball more seriously. In volleyball, as with life, the harder the other guy tries, the more difficult your job becomes. Every match has a winner and a loser. Everyone can't win.

That 17 team was special, and we had local area studs. It's quite possible that Newton, Cheney and surrounding areas won't have All America type players ever again in his lifetime. There was going to be a rebuild for sure (remember Emily and Abby's freshman year they didn't make the tournament finishing a mundane 20-10).

I would argue that the top of the Valley is similar to the AAC but after UNI and CU (at the time) there is a VAST chasm between the rest, for the most part.

So, tougher conference top to bottom, and a rebuild. BUT he's responsible for recruiting enough to talent to be successful. And he has to wear that to an extent. Lambo has rarely recruited a national ranked stud, very very few, and has relied on developing those with lots of potential. Everyone has an opinion on recruiting, but the facts are the best just aren't available to WSU.

So, let's look at some of the young ladies that didn't work out, where they went and what happened, if we can.

Disclaimer: The following is not intended to be a belittling on any student athlete. I'm attempting to point out what has worked and what hasn't worked. I will make a general statement on student athletes somewhere along the way.

I think if we're being honest, we have to start with Kora Kualing. Clearly the plan was to hand Kora the keys after Hiebert's graduation. She redshirted the 17 season and they hoped she'd be the setter, and a physical tall setter at that, in the 5-1 for the next 4 years. But Kora just didn't develop like Emily did and was often banged up. Now, you can blame whomever you want, but sometimes kids just don't want to put in the work or don't develop physically as you might hope (for volleyball) and can't reach the potential you thought they had. Kora is wonderful student and as pleasant a young women you'd ever hope to meet, but she just wasn't that good. She's found a spot at Bradley, and in her 4th year of college, was the setter for a 12-7 Valley team. That's about where she belongs I think, and nothing like what we need here to win. That hurt (again, NOT blaming Kora) because you count on your setter. Especially a 6'2" setter you expect to run a 5-1 with for years. And you aren't exactly going to get say a Chelsea Feekin to come in right behind her if she thinks she's not going to play for 2, 3 or even maybe 4 years. So now you're at least a year behind, maybe 2 and changing your plan. Side note...Feekin was SO close to leaving WSU it's not even funny because she wasn't playing. We were LUCKY she stayed to say the least. And it's because of the Lambs that she did.

I'll miss some but I'll try to be somewhat brief.

We lost Chinelo Ogogor to Louisiana Lafeyette. She hasn't played there yet. I don't think we lost a big piece there.

We lost an AA to injury. Who's to blame for that? Yes Gio transferred after that, and yes it's because she wanted to win on a high level. I mean that's the college world today. It won't be the last time. Were there issues here that led to the transfer? She wasn't going to win a Natty here.....not sure how you overcome something like that. If she was healthy in 2019 we would have been better (maybe a lot better) and she'd have been out of eligibility and not transferred.

Not sure what happened to Megan Taflinger. She could have graduated. I can't see where's she is playing elsewhere.


I guess this is as good a spot as any to insert these general comments. Basically none of the volleyball players will make a living playing volleyball. It's not like basketball or baseball or really any guys sports. The young ladies do what they love, they go to school to get an education and they go do real world things. And often times, perhaps most of the time, volleyball isn't at the top of the priority list. Things that happen....change in majors like with Jacqui Mostrom, the highest regarded of the sisters, who decided she wanted to follow a different study that WSU didn't offer at the last minute and transferred to KU who did offer that study. Is that someone's fault? Occasionally a young lady will have a child as did Amanda Moore in 200something. Nothing wrong with that, but it puts a damper on competitive athletics for sure. Can't blame Lambo for that (you can blame baseball though I think lol). And without getting into physiology, young ladies do go through a variety of changes that don't always make them better athletes. Things happen. Plans change. Sports often, maybe even mostly, isn't the most important thing they are doing, might not even be the 3rd or 4th most important thing they are doing. However, in WSU's case, almost always academics is at or near the top for Volleyball.

Okay, back to players.

Makenna Miller decided to be a model. Excellent choice imho.

Abby Pugh transferred to SDSU and was essentially a non factor for 2 seasons.

Best I can tell, Grace Burken transferred back to Iowa, Iowa State, and never played another point.

Kali Eakin our setter in 2018 destroyed her knee and missed the last part of the season.

Alex Koon was injured and limited at the end of her career.

Chase Jackson transferred to Incarnate Word, didn't play in 19 and was the SLC Newcomer of the year in 20. In a league 15 spots down from the AAC.

Regan Stiawalt left for reasons having nothing to do with volleyball, landed at McNeese State and had a couple of productive years.

Tabitha Brown transferred to her 3rd school, Rice for her last season, and while her position changed to mostly defensive (she only had 44 kills on the season) she played every set and was clearly an integral part of their team that went to the 2nd round of the tourney and finished 27-4. I know her parents were not happy with things at WSU, for whatever reason.

Maddy Fruend stopped playing volleyball and married Asbjorn.

Jenna Mak stopped playing volleyball, graduated and joined the working world.

Alayna Maslinski transferred to Christian Brothers University and had a couple of productive if not abbreviated seasons. She may still be playing.

Ashley Warehime ended up on the track team.

I have no idea where Nicole Anderson is.

Arianna Arjomand transferred back home to Florida and is at UCF. From all accounts, she was homesick. I could be wrong.

Sina Uluave landed at Toledo. No idea why.

Shea Lauria I don't know what happened to her.


If I've missed anyone let me know, with details if you can.

In my opinion, we've lost very little that were ever going to help us win other than to injury. I'm not sure how Brown got a 5th year (played at Bama in 15, and here 16, 17, 18 and Rice 19) and maybe couldn't have played here in 19? IDK. Ari is someone that hurt, and time will tell about Nicole and Sina, but I think at best they are lost roll players.

I think the answer is, mostly, we haven't recruited as well. Some of the things I mentioned above, yes, have an impact, but we just haven't recruited as well as in previous years. Is that on the staff? You bet. There's no covering that.

I'm not sure we're going to be a lot better this season either. Maybe we will but the setter position is still an issue. I think we're good enough to compete for the top of the conference with our hitting, but we have to get the ball to them. We're not deep, but between Kelly, Foster, McMahon, Rowling and Weber I think that group is good enough to score on any AAC program. I honestly think you would have a time finding 5 as a more talented group at WSU going back a long ways. The question is how do we get the ball to them?

Completely unproven at the DS and Libero. Do we have a gal there? Lily had some work there in the spring. Kylie seems to have an attitude I like about playing. Maybe there are some freshmen, redshirt or otherwise, that will surprise and help. Not sure Kayce is ready to be full time and let's face it, setter is the driver for everything.

I guess I just don't see any underlying problem that others keep referring to .......if there were a half dozen players at decent programs getting reps for good teams, then okay, let's dig. But that's just not the case.

We need better players. And whether you want to admit it or not, there are aspects of the University that we all love that make recruiting a little more difficult than at other AAC schools. Not impossible, but difficult.

Look, I understand you have to win. It's sports. I want if not demand the attitude that if we're going to put WSU across our chest, then it's going to matter. I completely disagree with Golden about it being mostly about the student experience.

Should now be the time to increase salaries and extend contracts? Probably not. I certainly think you want to see progress this season. But I also don't think it's anywhere near as bad as a couple of you are making it out to be.


And I'm not addressing the disaster with an assistant coach. Let's not even go there.

[Veritas]

Oh, now it’s a business venture rather than a fund raiser!?!?
Talk about the Curly Shuffle

WuCurlyWu

[boyshocker]

Thanks for the post Wu! I have heard Tafflinger went into the portal but had trouble with credits transferring and not losing a year, there might be a boyfriend involved with this one. Gio must be in here 7th or 8th season? I think 2017 was a special year with some stars in the right place, the league had a couple of stars take a medical redshirt that year and others were down. I think the 2016 team was better and MSU and N.Iowa teams that year would have battled for 2nd and 3rd.