At Large Discussion

[shockmonster]

SD STATE - has the 5th worst impact on WSU RPI

MSU - 8th most positive impact on WSU RPI
LOUISVILLE - 5th most positive impact on WSU RPI

That why scheduling good team even if u don't win is benificial.

I could be wrong but I think that OU's RPI will improve. They will play some conference teams with good RPI's. Ku, ISU, OSU, Baylor all have good teams and will improve them and even KSU, Texas, and TT are pretty good. I don't see them with a 100+ RPI and they may even climb higher at maybe 75 before they are done.

[Cdizzle]

I could be wrong but I think that OU's RPI will improve. They will play some conference teams with good RPI's. Ku, ISU, OSU, Baylor all have good teams and will improve them and even KSU, Texas, and TT are pretty good. I don't see them with a 100+ RPI and they may even climb higher at maybe 75 before they are done.

For comparison, the Big12 has had at least 7 teams in the RPI Top 100 the past 3 years (8 both last year and 2014). You have to be quite a terrible team to end up outside the Top 100 when playing in that league.

[ShockingButTrue]

For comparison, the Big12 has had at least 7 teams in the RPI Top 100 the past 3 years (8 both last year and 2014). You have to be quite a terrible team to end up outside the Top 100 when playing in that league.

Like the Pokes last year.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

For comparison, the Big12 has had at least 7 teams in the RPI Top 100 the past 3 years (8 both last year and 2014). You have to be quite a terrible team to end up outside the Top 100 when playing in that league.

Agreed. If we can steal both Oklahoma school games, that will be what we can hang our NCAA hat on. A team really has to **** the bed in a just-ate-Taco-Pronto kind of way in order to finish with a bad RPI in that conference. I expect both Oklahoma schools to finish in the top 100, and either one has a reasonable chance to do better than that.

[shock]

Agreed. If we can steal both Oklahoma school games, that will be what we can hang our NCAA hat on. A team really has to **** the bed in a just-ate-Taco-Shop kind of way in order to finish with a bad RPI in that conference. I expect both Oklahoma schools to finish in the top 100, and either one has a reasonable chance to do better than that.

fixed

[WSUwatcher]

The 2011-12 Shocker team that started WSU's run of (so far) five straight NCAAs went into Selection Sunday 27-6, the Valley regular season champs, and fresh off their customary semifinal upset loss in St. Louis. They received a #5 seed, albeit an unlucky one.

I realize every year is somewhat different, but it's entirely possible -- KenPom certainly wouldn't be at all surprised -- that this year's Shockers could also stand at 27-6 after two games in St. Louis. And yet we're supposed to believe, at least in the esteemed opinion of some board pundits, that such a record would put them on the bubble, with one more loss knocking them into the NIT? A #5 seed in 2011-12, but a bubble team teetering toward the NIT in 2016-17? Sorry, not buying.

[wufan]

The 2011-12 Shocker team that started WSU's run of (so far) five straight NCAAs went into Selection Sunday 27-6, the Valley regular season champs, and fresh off their customary semifinal upset loss in St. Louis. They received a #5 seed, albeit an unlucky one.

I realize every year is somewhat different, but it's entirely possible -- KenPom certainly wouldn't be at all surprised -- that this year's Shockers could also stand at 27-6 after two games in St. Louis. And yet we're supposed to believe, at least in the esteemed opinion of some board pundits, that such a record would put them on the bubble, with one more loss knocking them into the NIT? A #5 seed in 2011-12, but a bubble team teetering toward the NIT in 2016-17? Sorry, not buying.

The 11-12 team had some signature wins and Creighton on the schedule twice.

[Slalomshocker]

Look around college hoops at the scores. The bubble is going to be HUGE this year. Everyone is getting 'name' wins and taking bad losses. WSU would be safely in with any kind of marquee win and no bad losses. But when you take into account that no bad losses means 17-1 in the MVC.... that's pretty tough to do (at least it should be). For WSU to be 27-6 with 1 of those losses being in the MVC Semis, that means WSU loses 3 more games. If those 3 aren't OU, OSU & @UNI then you are taking bad losses. If the 3 losses are in fact OU, OSU @UNI.... you have no quality wins. Sad reality. 30pt wins over Bradley, Drake, our entire non-con.... aren't going to get WSU in over other teams on the bubble from the Big 10, Big 12, ACC, etc. WSU has a razor thin margin for error. Win STL and they will get a decent seed regardless. Rely on at-large..... it gets dicey. We'll know more Saturday and pretty much know what has to be done after next Saturday.

[ShockerFever]

Look around college hoops at the scores. The bubble is going to be HUGE this year. Everyone is getting 'name' wins and taking bad losses. WSU would be safely in with any kind of marquee win and no bad losses. But when you take into account that no bad losses means 17-1 in the MVC.... that's pretty tough to do (at least it should be). For WSU to be 27-6 with 1 of those losses being in the MVC Semis, that means WSU loses 3 more games. If those 3 aren't OU, OSU & @UNI then you are taking bad losses. If the 3 losses are in fact OU, OSU @UNI.... you have no quality wins. Sad reality. 30pt wins over Bradley, Drake, our entire non-con.... aren't going to get WSU in over other teams on the bubble from the Big 10, Big 12, ACC, etc. WSU has a razor thin margin for error. Win STL and they will get a decent seed regardless. Rely on at-large..... it gets dicey. We'll know more Saturday and pretty much know what has to be done after next Saturday.

You're on quite a roll this morning.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

The 2011-12 Shocker team that started WSU's run of (so far) five straight NCAAs went into Selection Sunday 27-6, the Valley regular season champs, and fresh off their customary semifinal upset loss in St. Louis. They received a #5 seed, albeit an unlucky one.

I realize every year is somewhat different, but it's entirely possible -- KenPom certainly wouldn't be at all surprised -- that this year's Shockers could also stand at 27-6 after two games in St. Louis. And yet we're supposed to believe, at least in the esteemed opinion of some board pundits, that such a record would put them on the bubble, with one more loss knocking them into the NIT? A #5 seed in 2011-12, but a bubble team teetering toward the NIT in 2016-17? Sorry, not buying.

You don't have to like it, but facing reality is important, like it or not.

On Selection Sunday, the 2012 team was 27-5, not 27-6. Their RPI was 12. Their KenPom rank was 8. Their SOS was ranked 47th.
This year, 5 losses on Selection Sunday will likely lead to an RPI in the 30s. 6 losses, an RPI in the 40s. Projected SOS is ranked 145th.

2011-2012... 4 other MVC teams were top 100, including Creighton, who earned an 8 seed.
2016-2017... there is a decent chance only 1 other MVC team finishes top 100, and that they merely make the NIT.

Even if WSU beats both OU and OSU, they will have fewer non-con top 100 wins than the 2012 squad did. Even if they run the table in MVC play, they will have fewer top 100 wins in conference play. Of course, if they do that, 5-6 losses on Selection Sunday is no longer an issue, is it?

Beating teams like Drake (the 2017 edition of Drake, who hasn't yet beaten a D1 team) just doesn't mean much. In 2012, Drake went out and won some non-con games (even beat #28 Iowa State!) The schedule this year is what it is, and 2017's is way easier than 2012's was. To finish with the same record as 2012 would be wildly less impressive.

[Slalomshocker]

I'm still feeling slightly cheated that I paid roughly $180 to watch the equivalent of 7th grade girls basketball team last night in the first half.

[ShockerFever]

I'm still feeling slightly cheated that I paid roughly $180 to watch the equivalent of 7th grade girls basketball team last night in the first half.

A lot of these games were created years in advance... the Tulsa series, the SLU series. Long Beach was supposed to be good. South Dakota State was supposed to be good. It's not like Marshall boeheim'ed up the schedule.

So whose fault is this? If you wanna stop coming to games because WSU is too good that they're beating up on the competition put in front of them, then go for it. If you're more interested in watching the other teams, then pick somebody else to spend your money on. Maybe you can make some extra money on the side by being Marshall's schedule maker. As an added bonus, you can also predict how teams are going to project in the future to lessen your desired cream puff count.

[Cdizzle]

I don't think too many people are blaming the schedule-makers for this year's schedule. As Fever mentions, a lot of these teams are traditionally solid games. I was very excited about this schedule when it was put together.

But you also can't deny that it's turned out to be a steady diet of sh!t sandwiches and we're paying steakhouse prices. Now, I freaking love every minute of it. And I don't understand the low attendance. But I do understand the low energy levels.

[molly jabali]

A lot of these games were created years in advance... the Tulsa series, the SLU series. Long Beach was supposed to be good. South Dakota State was supposed to be good. It's not like Marshall boeheim'ed up the schedule.

So whose fault is this? If you wanna stop coming to games because WSU is too good that they're beating up on the competition put in front of them, then go for it. If you're more interested in watching the other teams, then pick somebody else to spend your money on. Maybe you can make some extra money on the side by being Marshall's schedule maker. As an added bonus, you can also predict how teams are going to project in the future to lessen your desired cream puff count.

I don't say this often but I 100% agree with this.

[Slalomshocker]

A lot of these games were created years in advance... the Tulsa series, the SLU series. Long Beach was supposed to be good. South Dakota State was supposed to be good. It's not like Marshall boeheim'ed up the schedule.

So whose fault is this? If you wanna stop coming to games because WSU is too good that they're beating up on the competition put in front of them, then go for it. If you're more interested in watching the other teams, then pick somebody else to spend your money on. Maybe you can make some extra money on the side by being Marshall's schedule maker. As an added bonus, you can also predict how teams are going to project in the future to lessen your desired cream puff count.

I completely agree that the schedule 'appeared' decent at its release. I completely understand scheduling is difficult. I also completely understand that my season tickets have gone up almost 50% the last 3 years..... I'm not upset that WSU is beating the crap out of teams. I simply personally feel like I am not getting a return of value on my ever increasing season tickets. I'm sorry that Southern Nazarene doesn't get me excited. Its my choice. I'm allowed to be a fan however I choose to be. I graduated from WSU, have had season tickets since before I graduated, I bleed black and yellow. But when you start talking about increasingly large chunks of dollars, I do expect to at least get thrown a decent game once in a while.