WSU vs. So. Nazarene game thread

[im4wsu]

Guff is 8th in all-time career assists with 383. Shot 45.1% and 43.4% from three. 83.5% FT.
When Guff was recruited, I subscribed to the Naticoke newspaper to track his senior year in high school. I expected Guff to never miss a FT in college. He was a superb shooter.
Overall, I was disappointed in Guff's career here because I expected so much.

Griffin was a very quick point guard. Guff was not quick.
Smith is a very quick point guard. Conner is not quick.
Many seem to be so hot on Conner and so ready to underappreciate Guff. If Conner achieves the statistical record that Guff achieved, I'll be a bit surprised.

[ShockingButTrue]

Eddie Fogler came here from NC. I'm sure everyone in town was excited just at that prospect. He was going to clear up the image of our team and university.He had to have extensive contacts for recruiting. Initially he recruited some (on paper) outstanding height and talent. He said he wanted kids with brains and would graduate. Great. Our AD and President were horrible. Our facilities were horrible. EF was used to walking into a recruits home with NC on his blazer and have him put his name on the dotted line. At WSU all he got was quizzical looks from recruits. He probably shot high and missed out on many of his wanted players. He was probably very good with X's and O's but he did not have the talent to run it. Initially I had no problem with Cohen being named coach. Fogler took the Vandy job and was quoted as saying the ONLY reason he left WSU was because Vandy was an awsome academic institution and he was an academician at heart. He was at Vandy a short time and then left for that academic bastion of SC. I just believe he realized he couldn't or want to succeed here at WSU and decided to cut his losses and leave. I don't have a problem with that if he was in over his head but don't tell me your leaving for a transparent bogus reason. ie "Don't piss on me and tell me its only raining. ' Fogler had to know Cohen had problems before he recommended him for the HC job but maybe he figured we deserved each other. Really, we didn't recruit Johnny Murdock because the HC couldn't find his house? This is all water under the bridge and doesn't diminish what we went through to finally get to where we are now. Maybe it makes it a little sweeter now after being trod on for so long by others and the valley. Makes it a little sweeter to wake up and know that our University and Athletic Department are enjoying unequaled success. It all just makes it sweeter.

Thank you for a rational and substantive contribution to the discussion of Foglers time in Wichita with Gene's recruits, and evidence that points to his lack of loyalty to any part of this City.

[pogo]

The Roundhouse Renovation was during Marks 2nd year I believe. After RS 2nd year I believe Charles was approached about the renovation and his response at the time was "Lets see what the future holds" and implied he wanted to wait a couple more years. RS is gone and MT is hired and the rest is history.

[Play Angry]

Come on now @ShockingButTrue:, you and I both know your trolling skillz diminish when you get visibly frustrated :) Never break character.

Also, this was a poor effort:

Do you think in Foglers Bio he mentions his first-time effort as a consultant? And when he did so at the time, didn't you agree, if you were really there, along with WSU administrators that Fogler was probably a pretty impeccable guy and new who was qualified and who wasn't (if you catch my drift). If you did, you are part of the problem that was the '90's.

Trolls shouldn't play victim for straw men then come over the top with a bigger strawman so transparently. I thought your game was better than KC Shox but I was too eager to give high marks.

[ShockingButTrue]

Guff is 8th in all-time career assists with 383. Shot 45.1% and 43.4% from three. 83.5% FT.
When Guff was recruited, I subscribed to the Naticoke newspaper to track his senior year in high school. I expected Guff to never miss a FT in college. He was a superb shooter.
Overall, I was disappointed in Guff's career here because I expected so much.

Griffin was a very quick point guard. Guff was not quick.
Smith is a very quick point guard. Conner is not quick.
Many seem to be so hot on Conner and so ready to underappreciate Guff. If Conner achieves the statistical record that Guff achieved, I'll be a bit surprised.

Ditto. Who wouldn't want an East Coast player who averaged 30+ points in high school as a senior. Buet he didn't make his teammates better like a Griffin or VanVleet did. That's how I judge points. Did VanVleet ever average more that 12 a game. Who's higher on the scoring list, him of Guff, because I really don't know. But I do know who was the better point.

[ShockingButTrue]

Come on now @ShockingButTrue, you and I both know your trolling skillz diminish when you get visibly frustrated :) Never break char





Trolls shouldn't play victim for straw men then come over the top with a bigger strawman so transparently. I thought your game was better than KC Shox but I was too eager to give high marks.

You did... I didn't even need to go there.

[pie n eye]

It's funny how so many different threads somehow wander to **** talking Frankamp.

[shockmonster]

It's funny how so many different threads somehow wander to **** talking Frankamp.

It seems that it's often the same people who have had a burr in their saddle from the time he came. I sometimes feel the need to add balance to those who have a history of unfairness.

[pie n eye]

It seems that it's often the same people who have had a burr in their saddle from the time he came. I sometimes feel the need to add balance to those who have a history of unfairness.

Agree, it's the same few people but hey, it is what it is at this point. I've given my opinion several times and don't see any use discussing it any further with them. I do think it's ridiculous to defend former Shocker ballers by dragging down current guys but if that's the way they want roll there's no use arguing.

[1972Shocker]

The Roundhouse Renovation was during Marks 2nd year I believe. After RS 2nd year I believe Charles was approached about the renovation and his response at the time was "Lets see what the future holds" and implied he wanted to wait a couple more years. RS is gone and MT is hired and the rest is history.

Mark hired in March 2000 after the end of the 1999-2000 season. Roundhouse Rennaissance fundraising started in 2000 according to this article. Renovation occurred during the 2002-03 season. I don't know this for a fact but I suspect Jim Schaus mentioned his plans for renovating the Roundhouse to Coach Turgeon. Could be Charles told JS, let's see who you can attract as a replacement for RS before I pull the trigger on this. Charles also may have wanted to see how the rest of the Wichita community stepped up as well before sealing the deal. After all Charles only provided 24% of the total RR funding.

The $2,500 I gave toward the effort was a much bigger deal to me than the $6 million the Koch Foundation contrinbuted was to the Koch Family.

[im4wsu]

Ditto. Who wouldn't want an East Coast player who averaged 30+ points in high school as a senior. Buet he didn't make his teammates better like a Griffin or VanVleet did. That's how I judge points. Did VanVleet ever average more that 12 a game. Who's higher on the scoring list, him of Guff, because I really don't know. But I do know who was the better point.

VanVleet had 13.6 as a junior and 12.2 as a senior and 10.2 overall.

[ShockingButTrue]

VanVleet had 13.6 as a junior and 12.2 as a senior and 10.2 overall.

I didn't think he was too high up there in scoring. What is he in career scoring vs. Guffrovich? It's not a loaded question. I've never seen where either stacks up on career points.

[im4wsu]

Fred 1,439
Paul 1,247

[ShockingButTrue]

Fred 1,439
Paul 1,247

I didn't realize he had scored less than VanVleet. That was a bad era.

[im4wsu]

Actually, since Fred palyed in 141 games and Paul 120, Paul leads in ppg 10.39 to 10.21.