Rafters

[Topshock]

Cliff Levingston was also also on the Playboy 1st team All-American team, for what that is worth.

[SHOCKvalue]

I still want a 35-0 banner. That season should not just be looked upon as a round of 32 exit.

The athletic department really swung and missed on that one, but sad to say, that is to be expected these days.

[im4wsu]

Cliff Levingston was also also on the Playboy 1st team All-American team, for what that is worth.

I seem to remember that, but my source was the WSU 2007-08 Media Guide and it was not listed.

[ShockerFever]

The athletic department really swung and missed on that one, but sad to say, that is to be expected these days.

Oh come on. Going undefeated isn't that big of a deal.. 🙄

[Cdizzle]

Now I remember why I come around here less in the off-season.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

We need to pump the brakes on number retirement. The criteria has been that a player must have been named to at least one Postseason First team All-American list. Most of the players with retired numbers were on more than one and were lottery pick type of players.

I may be wrong, but I do not believe the criteria is a FIRST team AA selection, but rather any placement in a reputable All American list.

[Shock Top]

So if Ron or Fred go on to have a solid NBA career, are they going to say "Sorry, but you weren't a 1st-team All-American"

When you change a program forever, (just read the plethora of articles) you get your number retired.

Fred, Ron, Cle should and will be hanging soon. (Warren and Cheese is a more interesting discussion)

[WheatShocker2]

Ron and Fred definitely. No shot for Wessel. Cle was only here 2 years, so that's a tough call. I think Tekele is more deserving than Cle based on being a program staple, but I don't think Kele gets retired either. Just Ron and Fred.

[ShockTalk]

Cleo Littleton was 2nd team Helms Foundation in 1954; 3rd team Helms Foundation and on several magazine teams in 1955
Dave Stallworth 1st team consensus in 1964 and 2nd team AP in 1965
Cliff Levingston was 1st team Sporting News and 3rd team AP
Antoine Carr was 1st team Sporting News and 3rd team AP
Xavier McDaniel was 1st team AP and USBWA, 2nd team UPI and 3rd team NABC
Paul Miller was Honorable Mention AP

I seem to recall discussion that the Sporting News team was not one thought worth to consider for rafter purposes. But those two each had 3rd team AP to get them in.

Pretty sure Cliff was not 3rd team AP. He was honorable mention.

I do not know what WSU considers rafter worthy for All American status, but it is generally considered that the only "real" All American teams are those teams that are used for "consensus" status. Sporting News was not.

[ShockerPrez]

Would love for Cotton to be in the rafters, but we would have to reinforce the steel.

While were talking, and I know it won't happen, but if Im voting, I vote for Perez.

That's a pipedream. That's a complete sentimental hope.

[Play Angry]

Cliff was a 3rd Team All American in Basketball Times, which was somewhat akin to Athlon's current rag. There used to be (maybe it remains?) a typo in the media guide listing him as an AA in one or two of the consensus sources, but that was inaccurate to the extent it showed him as anything beyond honorable mention.

[im4wsu]

Pretty sure Cliff was not 3rd team AP. He was honorable mention.

I do not know what WSU considers rafter worthy for All American status, but it is generally considered that the only "real" All American teams are those teams that are used for "consensus" status. Sporting News was not.

Source page 124 of WSU 2007-08 Media Guide.

[im4wsu]

Cliff was a 3rd Team All American in Basketball Times, which was somewhat akin to Athlon's current rag. There used to be (maybe it remains?) a typo in the media guide listing him as an AA in one or two of the consensus sources, but that was inaccurate to the extent it showed him as anything beyond honorable mention.

Yes, current fact book on line shows Cliff 3rd team Basketball Times and Basketball Weekly, and Honorable Mention in AP.

[ShockTalk]

Source page 124 of WSU 2007-08 Media Guide.

Sorry, the media guide is wrong and has been for some time.

[Topshock]

So if Ron or Fred go on to have a solid NBA career, are they going to say "Sorry, but you weren't a 1st-team All-American"

When you change a program forever, (just read the plethora of articles) you get your number retired.

Fred, Ron, Cle should and will be hanging soon. (Warren and Cheese is a more interesting discussion)

"Change the program forever, you get you number retired" No
If that is the criteria, why not Paul Miller. If not for him and that Sweet 16 run then there is no Greg Marshall, no Van Vleet, and no Baker. In 5 years we will know if a solid NBA career happens.

For the record I don't think Paul Miller is retirement worthy either.