Marshall's defining player

[1972Shocker]

I have not really followed this thread but IMO Marshall is defined more by his teams than he is by any on player and it has been the progression of his teams from one year to the next.

If this point has already been made then I agree with it.

[shock]

This is my point. There are many like it, but this one is mine.

[Cdizzle]

Allow myself to agree with..... myself.

[RoyalShock]

I would like to add that I first came into this topic expecting to find Gregg Marshall's definition of a player.

Hence, I expected to see nothing more than one photo each of Fred VanVleet, Ron Baker and Evan Wessel.

I was disappointed.

[ShocktheHawks]

I would like to add that I first came into this topic expecting to find Gregg Marshall's definition of a player.

Hence, I expected to see nothing more than one photo each of Fred VanVleet, Ron Baker and Evan Wessel.

I was disappointed.

Dang it. We forgot Wessel.

[WstateU]

[Brook72]

I think a strong argument can be made that Garrett Stutz was Marshall's defining player. Beat our several other schools for his services, one being Kentucky, and slowly developed him until his senior year when he became a very crucial piece to one of our more talented teams. Marshall has said that he wished he would've redshirted him, but was too worried about job security around that time. LOL thats funny to think about. Would have been nice to have Stutz on that Final Four team!!

I still think that we would be nowhere near where we are today if it were not for Cleanthony. RETIRE #11 !!!!

[ShocktheHawks]

I think a strong argument can be made that Garrett Stutz was Marshall's defining player. Beat our several other schools for his services, one being Kentucky, and slowly developed him until his senior year when he became a very crucial piece to one of our more talented teams. Marshall has said that he wished he would've redshirted him, but was too worried about job security around that time. LOL thats funny to think about. Would have been nice to have Stutz on that Final Four team!!

I still think that we would be nowhere near where we are today if it were not for Cleanthony. RETIRE #11 !!!!

I don't remember his name right now but there was a player who was a walk-on who now plays at Friends. He would have been an excellent peice, but he wanted to be scholarized more than he wanted to play. He would have been a valuable assett to our FF team. I am biased though, he played in my city league.

It was Joe MItchell and he is graduated now.

[Aargh]

Cotton has no chance at all in the NBA. He might be able to hang with NBA players and be competitive on an NBA squad, but he will not get that chance. He'll get some looks in the D-League if he chooses to go that direction, but 6'2" utility players don't get NBA contracts.

He can make a small fortune in Europe. Those ESPN SC Top-10 dunks will make him VERY popular in Europe.

A "Marshall player" is pretty much a blue-collar guy with some athleticisim. Wessel, VanVleet, Baker, and Cotton are all true blue collar type players. Cotton had great athleticism...the rest, not so much.

It's hard to find top-100 guys who are also blue-collar, lunch-box-carrying workers. VanVleet is one. Baker would be one if the scouting services had found him. Never underestimate what those 2 guys brought to the program. They were probably "actual" top-50 players in their classes.

Then there's Wessel. If someone were to suggest that a D1 team could get to the S16 with a 6'5" PF who only averaged a few points a game, you'd think they were crazy. I remember a thread about who would be the 5th starter last year. One of the comments was that if Wessel was still starting at PF by the time we played Memphis, we were in real trouble. Wessel, surrounded by a bunch of blue collar guys, beat Ellis, who was surrounded by a bunch of future NBA guys.

The difference was that WSU's blue collar guys were underrated or unrated out of HS. KU's blue chippers were overrated out of HS. Marshall knew the difference.

[wufan]

Cotton has no chance at all in the NBA. He might be able to hang with NBA players and be competitive on an NBA squad, but he will not get that chance. He'll get some looks in the D-League if he chooses to go that direction, but 6'2" utility players don't get NBA contracts.

He can make a small fortune in Europe. Those ESPN SC Top-10 dunks will make him VERY popular in Europe.

A "Marshall player" is pretty much a blue-collar guy with some athleticisim. Wessel, VanVleet, Baker, and Cotton are all true blue collar type players. Cotton had great athleticism...the rest, not so much.

It's hard to find top-100 guys who are also blue-collar, lunch-box-carrying workers. VanVleet is one. Baker would be one if the scouting services had found him. Never underestimate what those 2 guys brought to the program. They were probably "actual" top-50 players in their classes.

Then there's Wessel. If someone were to suggest that a D1 team could get to the S16 with a 6'5" PF who only averaged a few points a game, you'd think they were crazy. I remember a thread about who would be the 5th starter last year. One of the comments was that if Wessel was still starting at PF by the time we played Memphis, we were in real trouble. Wessel, surrounded by a bunch of blue collar guys, beat Ellis, who was surrounded by a bunch of future NBA guys.

The difference was that WSU's blue collar guys were underrated or unrated out of HS. KU's blue chippers were overrated out of HS. Marshall knew the difference.

I think I was the one that said if Wessel was the starting PF when we played Memphis we would be in trouble. If it wasn't me, then I was thinking it.

[Dan]

I think the "Marshall player" is evolving. He will always value guys that are humble, work hard and put team first, but the further he elevates this program, the higher the talent will get. Guys he recruited the first few years wouldn't play on the current team. Guys on this team may not play on teams he has 4-5 years from now. I see the new "Marshall player" in guys like Zach Brown and Markis McDuffie. Ron and Fred are as defining as it gets right now.

[im4wsu]

Marshall doesn't need or even have a "defining" player, he simply "defines" the player. That is what he does.

[Shocker_for_a_long_time]

I'm going to go with a different pick than most: Carl Hall.

Why Carl Hall, over the current players? He was one of the first, I feel with the same attitude, and put in the hard work, even with a major handicap. He was just as tough as Wessel and hard working. (Also was a bit larger which helped in the game.) He had something more than pretty much every other player who he played against, even bigger stronger players. I see that same spark reflected in several of today's players.

Please note that I'm not disparaging any other players, because frankly, I could also make arguments for Cotton, Murry, Stutz, Wessel, Baker, Van Vleet, and others off the top of my head.