Offseason Thread: 2015 Edition

[forevershockerfan]

Well...yes. What I was getting at was; will Evan average 18, 20, 22, or 24 minutes? What about Zach? How much influence will Zach have on Evans PT? It's a battle for minutes.

Wessel and Bush had nice games and big plays versus UNI here and KU at the Dance. However, not everybody is at the top of their game every game. That is the beauty of having a deeper bench. Case in point was our loss at UNI. In that game we were off some as a team and they were hitting on all cylinders. Their bench actually outscored ours in that game handily if I recall correctly.. Look for much less of our bench getting outscored by any foe this Season. It will be as rare 'we hope' as pulling hens teeth. We now have more shooters and scorers and I hope we approach the Top 10 teams in the Nation in overall rebounding. Since we play such solid defense even if we are off on offense, we still beat teams and win lots of road games as a result.

[WuDrWu]

From Paul:

"This roster appears spectacularly deep." From a man who is careful (and almost always on point) with praise, that's saying a lot.

In reference to Landry, "He's even more athletic than I thought." I am fairly certain he "thought" Landry was pretty darned athletic before that.

And after the 17 straight made 3s comment...."Is that all?" Hahahahahahahaha

[Dave Stalwart]

From Paul:

"This roster appears spectacularly deep." From a man who is careful (and almost always on point) with praise, that's saying a lot.

In reference to Landry, "He's even more athletic than I thought." I am fairly certain he "thought" Landry was pretty darned athletic before that.

And after the 17 straight made 3s comment...."Is that all?" Hahahahahahahaha

I for one am very eager to experience a fully developed Marshall era roster that is spectacularly deep. We have experience and strength and nearly every starting position and we have 3 waves of fantastic quality depth.

[Aargh]

Take WSU out of the Valley and compare the remaining teams to the Horizon League. Even with UNI having an awesome year, the difference between the Vally and the Horizon wasn't that much.

We've got a 5th year Sr post who went for 15 and 7 against competition similar to what we're going to face in league play. That's more than what we had there last year.

We've got Morris (with apparently a new attitude after the Drake game last year), Kelly, and Brown duking it out for another spot. Those guys have some experience. Wamukota doesn't have that much experience, but late in the season, he was easily the best post defender on the team.

I'm not seeing an experience problem anywhere. I'm not seeing PT issues because I'm seeing guys who are here understanding that they're going to be role players for a few years.

Let that sink in. Marshall is signing top-100 and top-150 players who understand they're backups for a couple of years.

[Bluzrover]

I think Tyrone and Eric will RS making Nurger the 12th man.

I'll be shocked if Hamilton is red-shirted. And I really can't see Tyrone getting the shirt either. Both are coming off of post high school prep seasons, which, in effect, is a red shirt season, especially Eric when you consider he is coming out of the Sunrise pipeline. And if we take 3G at his word, he always leaves it up to the player to make that decision. Not sure either would want to miss out on being a contributor this season beyond just practicing with the team.

[Good News]

Well...yes. What I was getting at was; will Evan average 18, 20, 22, or 24 minutes? What about Zach? How much influence will Zach have on Evans PT? It's a battle for minutes.

Fair enough, in this program everybody battles for minutes. I guess I just put Fred, Ron, and Evan on a different level (same as Fred, Ron, and Tekele last year) - they don't have anything to prove and Coach knows how they contribute to what he wants out there so they have their target minutes that they'll get rain or shine. If margin of victory or newcomer development reduce it a little bit, great, otherwise they play X amount to form the cornerstone of the on-court product. Just my opinion.

[WSUwatcher]

I'll be shocked if Hamilton is red-shirted. And I really can't see Tyrone getting the shirt either. Both are coming off of post high school prep seasons, which, in effect, is a red shirt season, especially Eric when you consider he is coming out of the Sunrise pipeline. And if we take 3G at his word, he always leaves it up to the player to make that decision. Not sure either would want to miss out on being a contributor this season beyond just practicing with the team.

This will be interesting to see, and unless somebody comes out with a surprise early declaration, we probably won't know until the Shocks have had one or even two "everybody plays" games -- maybe after Emporia State -- if there will be any redshirts.

On the one hand, you can see how Hamilton would be eager to play at this point instead of waiting any longer; and if Taylor is really a PG as we've been told he is by someone who has actually watched him, we know how much Marshall likes having multiple options at that spot. On the other, WSU only gets the same 200 minutes to divide up that everyone else does, with as many as 13 ways to do so, and even 14 once Frankamp is eligible.

Having redshirts makes it easier for the minutes to go around, and it enables guys who take advantage to play a lot their fifth year, at least if all goes well, instead of a little their first. Plus, WSU could not have a better walking billboard for the value of a redshirt year than Baker. Still, it has to be pretty tough for kids who are used to playing to pull the trigger and commit to sitting if given the chance.

[Aargh]

I don't see a RS this year. If Hamilton or Taylor see what's in front of them and choose to be 24 years old when they graduate and start earning some spending money, they might ask for a RS. Advanced age (for college class) seems to be a negative in the NBA draft. Delaying having spending money a year is seen as a disadvantage by a lot of people in their late teens.

Both Taylor and Hamilton are going to be deep in the depth chart (we assume). Baker is likely to get minutes at PG to help him in the NBA draft. Taylor could be a 5-minute player getting on-court experience in game situations. That and being a playing member of a potential F4 team as a Fr would seem to limit the desirability of a RS.

[RoyalShock]

I think Evan will get plenty of bench minutes. But it will be due to 1. Not needing his skills on the floor all the time, 2. Keeping him fresh for the post-season, and 3. Getting Brown as many minutes as possible to continue his development for the next two years.

I would be surprised if one or both of Hamilton and Taylor don't redshirt. After Fred, Ron, Connor and Landry are capable of playing PG. If Marshall finds he's not comfortable with Connor and Landry handling the ball 5-ish minutes per game, then Taylor may play. Hamilton is likely to be behind at least five other guys at the 4/5 spot. Why waste a year of eligibility for a few minutes per game (if that) for the 13th and 14th players on the depth chart?

[wufan]

I think Evan will get plenty of bench minutes. But it will be due to 1. Not needing his skills on the floor all the time, 2. Keeping him fresh for the post-season, and 3. Getting Brown as many minutes as possible to continue his development for the next two years.

I would be surprised if one or both of Hamilton and Taylor don't redshirt. After Fred, Ron, Connor and Landry are capable of playing PG. If Marshall finds he's not comfortable with Connor and Landry handling the ball 5-ish minutes per game, then Taylor may play. Hamilton is likely to be behind at least five other guys at the 4/5 spot. Why waste a year of eligibility for a few minutes per game (if that) for the 13th and 14th players on the depth chart?

That's the way I see it. If Conner or Landry are capable of 5 mpg at PG, then why not give them 12-15 per game rather than giving Tyrone 5 and one of Conner or Landry 7-10 mpg?

As for Eric, if Anton can play 20, Rashard can play 15, Shaq can play 15, Bush and Nurger can each play 10 (very minimal minutes for those 5) then why not play Markis 10 per game rather than Eric 5 and Markis 5?

The numbers don't add up for a 13th freshman guard and a 14th freshman forward to get PT when the 10th, 11th and 12th players are already getting 10 minutes or less.

[Steeleshocker]

I'm just going to say that many didn't think much of Tekele having a regular role his freshman year. While I agree the 13th and 14th player are not likely to play much, to assume Taylor and Hamilton don't expect to come in and prove themselves as regular contributors this season is a bit silly. Defense and rebounding will get a freshman on the floor, and the ones who do that best while avoiding turnovers and comprehending the offense will get the most time.

[ShockerPrez]

I thought Taylor was the odds on favorite to assume the lion-share of PG duties after this year. If that is the case, then he is going to need to log a few minutes at PG this year similar to how FVV did when Malcolm was a senior. I think Taylor is going to be a stud, and RS him would be a detriment to his PG development. He's going to need game action and get used to abusing these Valley scrubs early on.

[wufan]

I'm just going to say that many didn't think much of Tekele having a regular role his freshman year.

That wasn't me.

While I agree the 13th and 14th player are not likely to play much, to assume Taylor and Hamilton don't expect to come in and prove themselves as regular contributors this season is a bit silly. Defense and rebounding will get a freshman on the floor, and the ones who do that best while avoiding turnovers and comprehending the offense will get the most time.

I don't think anyone disagrees with that.

[wufan]

I thought Taylor was the odds on favorite to assume the lion-share of PG duties after this year.

Taylor came in as the only PG, and he's damn good! Thus the assumption, but is he so much better than Conner or Landry at that position (whom are both combo guards) that he is going to take minutes from them? Is he better than them at all?

If that is the case, then he is going to need to log a few minutes at PG this year similar to how FVV did when Malcolm was a senior. I think Taylor is going to be a stud, and RS him would be a detriment to his PG development. He's going to need game action and get used to abusing these Valley scrubs early on.

Not necessarily. If Landry and/or Conner are capable of playing the point then they can play next year and Tyrone can learn from Fred this year and back-up CF or LS next.

It's not about whether or not Eric and Tyrone are capable of contributing, it's about whether or not they are capable of contributing more than Markis/Rashard and Conner/Landry respectively. One of those three in each group isn't going to see PT this year.

[another shocker]

here we go again.

taylor, starting pg next year, isn't going to redshirt this year.