March Madness: FFRF challenges Wichita State’s basketball chaplain

[Kung Wu]

I get what you're trying to say, extreme beliefs, but there is a wide chasm between simply being annoying and the atrocities and murder of ISIS.

Initially.

[shocka khan]

I think that this lletter is pretty silly. I don't always agree with these freedom from religion people.

I also think that the article belongs in the politics thread. I don't think it's appropriate here.

I disagree with the 'get a real job' and 'go to Saudi Arabia' comments, as they reflect a certain level of ignorance.

Not everyone believes in God and not everyone who goes to church and professes to be Christians behaves in a Christian-like, dignified manner, some of this is shown on these blogs.

[ShockerDropOut]

Definately needs to be moved to the politics board. This has nothing to do with basketball.

[Kung Wu]

The organization is directly attacking a staff member involved with the WSU basketball team. It's completely relevant in this forum whether it's a political issue or not.

[SHOXAAC]

Steve Dickie spoke at one of the pep rallies in STL last year. Call him what you want. For the five minutes he spoke I was ready to run through a wall for him. He was inspirational, motivational, passionate and loved him some Shockers. Not once did I feel religion was being forced. Our players have another great role model at a crucial point in their development as human beings. Go Steve and GO SHOX!!!

[_kai_]

And I'm pretty sure their point is moot, because I read he's a volunteer, he doesn't get paid.

[DUShock]

This isn't a religion issue. This is a quality of life issue for our student athletes of faith. It is provided to those who desire to seek this opportunity for spiritual counseling during their hectic schedules during the season at no cost to the taxpayers I am a proud Anglican/Episcopalian but I was ever so thankful for the evangelical chaplains assigned to our parent battalion when my Det was assigned to 5th & 10th groups respectively. They went above and beyond to incorporate the Eucharist into their services because they understood it to be an integeral part of my faith. These men were not of my denomination but played a vital role in my spiritual experience while I was down range. Regardless of what the WSU/VCU war chant says, I am not equating the college basketball experience to combat, far from it. These kids are away from home and if having a spiritual conduit in place assists them in their time here in Wichita I am all for it.

Absent a complaint from a player or a family member of the team, these godless folks need to practice what they preach and respect others.

Go Shocks!

[shockmonster]

not everyone who goes to church and professes to be Christians behaves in a Christian-like, dignified manner, some of this is shown on these blogs.

I agree with your entire post. Respect should be shown to everyone. However, your statement above proves either a lack of knowledge of the message of the gospel or an act of ignoring the true message of the gospel to to make a biased point.

[shocka khan]

The organization is directly attacking a staff member involved with the WSU basketball team. It's completely relevant in this forum whether it's a political issue or not.

I think you've had a little too much caffeine and you're spinning this one a little too much.

First, I don't think he was being 'directly attacked'. A letter was sent. Their position was stated. A Freedom of Information request was made. Last I remember we have this thing called a 2nd amendment to the constitution, which guarantees freedom of speech, no matter how wacky it is. I was once at Venice Beach and saw a guy walking around with a butcher's apron smeared in blood and a sign 'meat is dead'. He was wacky and expressing his second amendment rights. I had sausage and eggs that morning for breakfast. I ignored him and he went away.

I agree that it is completely relevant on this forum, I am just objecting to the placement. We have a forum for politics and it should probably be there. We don't all believe the same way, it would be a boring world if we did. Religion and politics are at least two things that you never discuss with other people, because most of our religious beliefs (or lack thereof) might insult other's sensibility. It's amazing how many people you can impact if you just leave religion and politics out of the equation.

Lastly and to emphasize the point I made in the last paragraph, one of the staffers at this foundation is a Wichita State alumnus, so he has a right to voice his opinion to the university. Could they have trolled a $20 through a trailer park and found him? Perhaps, but he does have an official position in the organization and he also attended the university, just like you and I did. He has a right to question the administration about how things are being run, just like people on this blog have, though the years, criticized the university president and the athletic director.

[Kel Varnsen]

Uh, I think the First Amendment is the one guaranteeing free speech. The Second Amendment is the right to bear arms.

[DUShock]

Uh, I think the First Amendment is the one guaranteeing free speech. The Second Amendment is the right to bear arms.

The First Amendment does not guarantee free speech but it does guarantee the right for our government (at any level) from adopting any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble or prohibiting, etc. etc.

It's a government/institutional based prohibition amendment rather than an individual/mano-e-mano based amendment.

[shocka khan]

I agree with your entire post. Respect should be shown to everyone. However, your statement above proves either a lack of knowledge of the message of the gospel or an act of ignoring the true message of the gospel to to make a biased point.

So Shockmonster, if you follow Jesus's teachings, are you supposed to act like him and convert people by convincing them in a positive manner the benefits of religion or do you form biased, subjective opinions to insult those who do not agree with you?

My point is that if you truly are a Christian, then you need to demonstrate it in the way you interact with others. Some people get that and some don't. Just like some muslims believe the Koran and some (like the muslim extremists) don't.

Even John Brown, the famous abolitionist preacher, thought it was OK for him to kill those who disagreed with him because 'God was on his side'. Was John Brown a Christian or was he using Christianity as a means to an end to suit his political beliefs?

[Kel Varnsen]

The First Amendment does not guarantee free speech but it does guarantee the right for our government (at any level) from adopting any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble or prohibiting, etc. etc.

It's a government/institutional based prohibition amendment rather than an individual/mano-e-mano based amendment.

That's essentially what I meant. I was just correcting shocka.

[shocka khan]

Uh, I think the First Amendment is the one guaranteeing free speech. The Second Amendment is the right to bear arms.

You're correct. Don't know why the 2nd amendment was stuck in my mind. Perhaps I've not had enough caffeine today.

[Kel Varnsen]

You're correct. Don't know why the 2nd amendment was stuck in my mind. Perhaps I've not had enough caffeine today.

I'm right there with you on that train, shocka.