This thread is not about KU...

[ShockerEngineer]

It was encouraging to me, until it devolved. I actually got the original purpose, and it was appreciated.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

I don't necessarily agree with the specifics, but I agree with the sentiment. I was hoping this topic wouldn't devolve into what it has, but I knew it was inevitable. In what is arguably the greatest season in Shocker basketball history, it felt like ShockerNet was flooded with claims of long-time posters being "BCS trolls", starting off wars of personal insults to the point that anyone who tried to say anything other than pure unadulterated Shocker love, even if reasonable, were attacked and labelled.

Maybe I'm just getting tired and soft in my middle-age years but I don't have the tolerance for that kind of hate and in-fighting anymore. It's not even fun to bash Creighton (yes, you can gasp in horror now). Why bother when I can just come here and watch Shocker fans bash each other to the point of threads being started by metaphorically blood-thirsty spectators to encourage it. It's exhausting and thoroughly unenjoyable to the point I'm considering becoming a part-time lurker.

Not that anyone would care, but I'm guessing there may be a few others who feel the same way. I don't know, maybe not. Perhaps I'm just delusional. I wouldn't rule it out.

Royal, I've always appreciated your comments. I hope that I haven't added too much to your frustrations with the board. I did come to the realization that my back-and-forths with Fever often entertained me at other's expense. I always felt like he escalated comments and drove conversations into eternal debates by being untruthful and constantly changing the subject, but at the same time, I fully admit that I pursued him down those rabbit trails at times when I should have just let him go.

Shockernet is a funny thing to me. I get much of my WSU info here while simultaneously using it as an outlet for my general facination with debating people. I'm a weird nerdy stat guy who likes sports and likes debating them. Weird combination, I know. I'll try to consider others a little more moving forward. No promises that I won't have future detailed debates, I'll just try to space them out a little more.

[rayc]

B.S. - When you start a topic with "This is NOT about ...", you can be sure that it is IS about ...

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

B.S. - When you start a topic with "This is NOT about ...", you can be sure that it is IS about ...

Interesting 1st post of the year rayc.

The real answer is that I was trying my best to emphasize my point by repeating myself over and over. The title, the opening paragraph. I tried to be as direct as I could so people couldn't take it the wrong way. I knew mentioning KU's message board would send some of our members into a tizzy. I tried to put out that fire before it started.

Sometimes you just can't win.

[ABC]

I don't necessarily agree with the specifics, but I agree with the sentiment. I was hoping this topic wouldn't devolve into what it has, but I knew it was inevitable. In what is arguably the greatest season in Shocker basketball history, it felt like ShockerNet was flooded with claims of long-time posters being "BCS trolls", starting off wars of personal insults to the point that anyone who tried to say anything other than pure unadulterated Shocker love, even if reasonable, were attacked and labelled.

Maybe I'm just getting tired and soft in my middle-age years but I don't have the tolerance for that kind of hate and in-fighting anymore. It's not even fun to bash Creighton (yes, you can gasp in horror now). Why bother when I can just come here and watch Shocker fans bash each other to the point of threads being started by metaphorically blood-thirsty spectators to encourage it. It's exhausting and thoroughly unenjoyable to the point I'm considering becoming a part-time lurker.

Not that anyone would care, but I'm guessing there may be a few others who feel the same way. I don't know, maybe not. Perhaps I'm just delusional. I wouldn't rule it out.

I hear what you are saying, but simply disagreeing with someone or something doesn't require it to devolve into name calling. Someone can simply disagree with the disagreement, right?

And I'm sorry, but is there a strawman somewhere in your statement: starting off wars of personal insults to the point that anyone who tried to say anything other than pure unadulterated Shocker love, even if reasonable, were attacked and labelled.

I just don't agree that that is the case very often on here.

It was simply an odd way to start a thread. There is a ton of Shocker love out there across the nation today, and it is easy to find.

[SHOCKvalue]

The unfortunate reality is the "positive" phog posts copy and pasted in this thread by JH4P are one-starred to death on their forum, while the most ridiculous, irrational, WSU hate-fest posts are five star-ed out the ying-yang.

Tells you all you need to know.

[proshox]

If you want to get past the name calling and idiotic stuff that happens - have everyone use their real names.

[SHOXAAC]

If you want to get past the name calling and idiotic stuff that happens - have everyone use their real names.

Or get rid of the name callers...except when I do it, because everyone on this forum knows it would 100% justified.

[RoyalShock]

I hear what you are saying, but simply disagreeing with someone or something doesn't require it to devolve into name calling. Someone can simply disagree with the disagreement, right?

And I'm sorry, but is there a strawman somewhere in your statement: starting off wars of personal insults to the point that anyone who tried to say anything other than pure unadulterated Shocker love, even if reasonable, were attacked and labelled.

I just don't agree that that is the case very often on here.

It was simply an odd way to start a thread. There is a ton of Shocker love out there across the nation today, and it is easy to find.

I get why he titled it the way he did, and everyone else here does, too. But of course, let's pick apart the minutia and miss the point. That's how the internet functions these days.

Why is it such a big deal to you and a few others that he decided to show that there are KU fans who are capable of showing respect? It gives off the vibe that some on here can't handle anything that doesn't fit the hate-KU narrative.

JH4P has been around SN for a long time and never showed any signs of being anything more than a WSU fan. Strip away all the crap flung back and forth from both sides (if that's even possible now) and it boils down to him being labelled a BCS apologist/troll because he dared use KenPom to argue whether some team was garbage.

I'm sure there are other examples with other posters, but that's the one I noticed the most, probably because I can relate to playing the devil's advocate and looking at things from a secondary perspective. Living and working in an area that is predominantly made up of KU and KSU fans I've had to learn how to have reasonable, objective discussions about all three schools. Fortunately the KU and KSU fans I have those discussions with are humble and reasonable, too. This is the only place I can engage in and follow discussions from fellow Shocker fans, and it's disappointing to find so much petty bickering.

I just think a bad combination of sensitivities and nastiness has developed here. I know it's not everyone or every topic. You can have a really clean house, but if there's a dead mouse rotting in the basement, the whole place can stink for awhile.

Again, maybe I'm the outlier, the proverbial voice in the wilderness. If so, I can accept that. I just figured I'd put the minority opinion out there and find out just how minor it is.

[TalkWUtome]

I repeat... This thread is not about KU. I stole comments from KU's message board during our game with Kentucky.......

Go Shox - JH4P

thanks JH4P - this made me breathe a little easier

[SHOXAAC]

I get why he titled it the way he did, and everyone else here does, too. But of course, let's pick apart the minutia and miss the point. That's how the internet functions these days.

Why is it such a big deal to you and a few others that he decided to show that there are KU fans who are capable of showing respect? It gives off the vibe that some on here can't handle anything that doesn't fit the hate-KU narrative.

JH4P has been around SN for a long time and never showed any signs of being anything more than a WSU fan. Strip away all the crap flung back and forth from both sides (if that's even possible now) and it boils down to him being labelled a BCS apologist/troll because he dared use KenPom to argue whether some team was garbage.

I'm sure there are other examples with other posters, but that's the one I noticed the most, probably because I can relate to playing the devil's advocate and looking at things from a secondary perspective. Living and working in an area that is predominantly made up of KU and KSU fans I've had to learn how to have reasonable, objective discussions about all three schools. Fortunately the KU and KSU fans I have those discussions with are humble and reasonable, too. This is the only place I can engage in and follow discussions from fellow Shocker fans, and it's disappointing to find so much petty bickering.

I just think a bad combination of sensitivities and nastiness has developed here. I know it's not everyone or every topic. You can have a really clean house, but if there's a dead mouse rotting in the basement, the whole place can stink for awhile.

Again, maybe I'm the outlier, the proverbial voice in the wilderness. If so, I can accept that. I just figured I'd put the minority opinion out there and find out just how minor it is.

Not minor at all. It's interesting how the allure of posting in anonymity turns some into what I call keyboard cowards. There is no real and consistent accountability when it comes to having a discussion on this fan board without throwing out offensive statements or personal insults. I have been goaded into it on occasion, but overall I get tired of the same crowd spouting off the same rhetoric. If some of the same discussions happen face-to-face in the real world like they happen here, the jails would be even more over crowded with violent criminals.

Now, back at City Hall were Batman and the Joker are facing off in the episode called "You're a puzzie if you really thing that."

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

The unfortunate reality is the "positive" phog posts copy and pasted in this thread by JH4P are one-starred to death on their forum, while the most ridiculous, irrational, WSU hate-fest posts are five star-ed out the ying-yang.

Tells you all you need to know.

Tells us that the trolls do all they can to cover up the fact that they are the minority?

[ABC]

I get why he titled it the way he did, and everyone else here does, too. But of course, let's pick apart the minutia and miss the point. That's how the internet functions these days.

Why is it such a big deal to you and a few others that he decided to show that there are KU fans who are capable of showing respect? It gives off the vibe that some on here can't handle anything that doesn't fit the hate-KU narrative.

JH4P has been around SN for a long time and never showed any signs of being anything more than a WSU fan. Strip away all the crap flung back and forth from both sides (if that's even possible now) and it boils down to him being labelled a BCS apologist/troll because he dared use KenPom to argue whether some team was garbage.

I'm sure there are other examples with other posters, but that's the one I noticed the most, probably because I can relate to playing the devil's advocate and looking at things from a secondary perspective. Living and working in an area that is predominantly made up of KU and KSU fans I've had to learn how to have reasonable, objective discussions about all three schools. Fortunately the KU and KSU fans I have those discussions with are humble and reasonable, too. This is the only place I can engage in and follow discussions from fellow Shocker fans, and it's disappointing to find so much petty bickering.

I just think a bad combination of sensitivities and nastiness has developed here. I know it's not everyone or every topic. You can have a really clean house, but if there's a dead mouse rotting in the basement, the whole place can stink for awhile.

Again, maybe I'm the outlier, the proverbial voice in the wilderness. If so, I can accept that. I just figured I'd put the minority opinion out there and find out just how minor it is.

Wow Royal. Maybe get off your high horse a bit; you certainly found some minutia. Show one time I didn't think Jamar has been a Shockerfan? You are simply wrong on that point. I offered some additional factoids. I pay tuition for two kids to KU and they are great examples of KU-WSU fans. I think you are reading WAY WAY WAY too much into my comments.

Strawmen isn't munitia. It is a poor way to make a point, even on an anonymous message board.

Whatever I said in those few words, doesn't mean I "think it is a big deal" however you measure that on anonymous message boards. Seems like you are doing what you say you dislike. Seems like you are doing plenty of bickering.

I think Jamar's intention was above board. As I've typed twice already, Phog.net is just an odd place to get the info. There's a lot of Shocker love out there and it isn't hard to find. Maybe you are too sensitive, I don't now. I know you've already read this from me too on this thread but I will state it again: there are plenty of KU fans that like and respect WSU (including two of my children.)

[Shock Therapy]

Not minor at all. It's interesting how the allure of posting in anonymity turns some into what I call keyboard cowards. There is no real and consistent accountability when it comes to having a discussion on this fan board without throwing out offensive statements or personal insults. I have been goaded into it on occasion, but overall I get tired of the same crowd spouting off the same rhetoric. If some of the same discussions happen face-to-face in the real world like they happen here, the jails would be even more over crowded with violent criminals.

Now, back at City Hall were Batman and the Joker are facing off in the episode called "You're a puzzie if you really thing that."

The commenting on Kansas.com became far more civil when they started requiring that you use your Facebook account.

[ABC]

The commenting on Kansas.com became far more civil when they started requiring that you use your Facebook account.

I would be in favor of not being anonymous.