Start Fred NOW!!!!!!

[SubGod22]

I agree with this and if everyone posting in here had stated their opinions this well I would've stayed out of it. It was the "done with Armstead" and "all he does is jack up threes" talk that made me jump in. I've had no complaints with Fred's play the past few games.

Most of that is frustration from fans because Mal hasn't played that well the past week or two and has had some very visible problems at crucial times.

[rialaigh]

It comes down to the stupid turnovers that Mal commits and the horrible shots. FVV has done a much better job of not throwing the ball away and doesn't jack up shots that make you want to rip your hear out. That's where the movement is coming from.

Doesn't do any good to trade a guy shooting 39% on the season and taking a lot of bad shots for a guy shooting 36% on the season who takes only 2-3 shots per game. I think the reason Fred doesn't take the bad shots is because he passes it to someone else to take a bad shot..

Per 40 minutes Armstead is superior to Fred in every category except turnovers. I'm just afraid that swapping FVV for Amrstead would merely present us with another offensive liability. Unless FVV is willing to shoot 8-12 times a game (which I don't think he is, he passes up wide open three looks and other shots to pass to teammates, many times for his teammates to take a worse shot) then it will not benefit us to swap these guys...

That said. FVV Will be twice player Armstead is...maybe even next year, but not this year, not even close

[SubGod22]

Doesn't do any good to trade a guy shooting 39% on the season and taking a lot of bad shots for a guy shooting 36% on the season who takes only 2-3 shots per game. I think the reason Fred doesn't take the bad shots is because he passes it to someone else to take a bad shot..

Per 40 minutes Armstead is superior to Fred in every category except turnovers. I'm just afraid that swapping FVV for Amrstead would merely present us with another offensive liability. Unless FVV is willing to shoot 8-12 times a game (which I don't think he is, he passes up wide open three looks and other shots to pass to teammates, many times for his teammates to take a worse shot) then it will not benefit us to swap these guys...

That said. FVV Will be twice player Armstead is...maybe even next year, but not this year, not even close

I'd rather have my PG taking 3 or 4 good shots than jacking up 8-12 with at least half of them being very suspect. And at the same time, not turning the ball over.

[Kung Wu]

Where did all this sanity come from?

[pinstripers]

Most of that is frustration from fans because Mal hasn't played that well the past week or two and has had some very visible problems at crucial times.

I think we want somebody who will play well at crucial times.

[pinstripers]

Fred is a liability on defense, seems like. However, Marshall said if he had a senior and a freshman playing equally, he'd get more minutes to the freshman.

[Rlh04d]

I did something similar for Wiggins and Cotton when everyone wanted Wiggins to start. The numbers showed the offense was better when Wiggins was on the floor and Marshall started him last game. I don't get the bench Armstead movement but let's see if I'm wrong.

For the season with Armstead on the floor the team scores at a rate of 70.2 points per game. With Van Vleet on the floor it is 64.3. If you want to argue that Van Vleet has gotten better as the year has progressed I'd agree with you. So let's look at conference only play. With Armstead on the floor it is 68.4 ppg and Van Vleet it is 59.9 ppg. Maybe something magically happened to Armstead after the Bradley game and he's terrible now. Last 3 games: Armstead - 57.0, Van Vleet - 54.9. Basically the team is better with Armstead on the floor and the team as a whole has been scoring worse over the past three games. Swapping out Armstead for Van Vleet is not going to solve this.

Interesting numbers. I do think they're based to some degree on Armstead spending more time on the court with the other starters, though.

I was actually running some stats as well on the idea that FVV would look better on a per minute basis than Armstead, but the numbers are more vague than that. I even limited my look to since the Drake game near the start of conference play (where FVV had 4 TOs; he hasn't had more than 1 in a game since).

Basically evening out the numbers to per minute and then calculating them out at either player being in for 30 minutes a game (since Drake game):

FGs: Armstead wins, 38% to 36%. Armstead also taking 2 more shots over that time.
3s: FVV wins, 33% to 30%. Armstead takes 2.5 shots more.
FTs: Armstead hasn't missed a FT over that period. FVV is only 2 for 3, so sample size is too small to really say anything.
Rebounds: Armstead about 4, FVV about 3
Assists: FVV has the slight edge at 4.8 to Armstead's 4.67
Steals: Armstead dominates. 2 a game to FVV's .6
PFs: FVV 1.9, Armstead 2.1
TOs: FVV dominates with 1.1 versus Armstead's 3
Points: Armstead with 9.5 vs FVV at 6.5

So limiting the period to where FVV's really seemed to catch on to the D1 level more, I still don't think you can make an argument that he's a significant change from Armstead. While FVV protects the ball far more as far as TOs, Armstead creates far more TOs with steals. Of course, comparing TOs and steals means Armstead costs us one possession per 30 minutes, and FVV .5.

So FVV is a slight improvement at the traditional PG roles, assists and not costing us possessions. Armstead's a bit more of an offensive threat, although most of the points are probably due to him shooting more times over that time span (despite not having much difference from FVV in shooting ... FVV seems to look for passes more than MA).

On a per minute basis, the TOs and steals are the only significant difference between the two.

If you only look at the last four games, FVV looks a lot better, shooting better than 50% FGs, while Armstead is at under 30%. Over the longer period, though, I think there's a good argument to make that FVV should be playing nearly equivalent minutes to Armstead, but I'm not sure he should be the starter. I say play them both equally and then play whoever is having the better game at the end. Or to their strengths ... Armstead creating TOs, FVV avoiding TOs.

[RoyalShock]

I really don't think it matters which one starts. Want I want to see is for Marshall to be flexible enough to go with the guy who is having the better game or stretch of games in crunch time. All things being equal, then by all means go with your upperclassman. But when it's not equal, go with the guy who is getting it done.

[KBShocker]

It's time to play for the future and let the Fred VV era begin.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

The more I think about it, the less surprised I will be if the "FVV era" does indeed start on Saturday. A home game against the 2nd worst team in the Valley seems like a good opportunity for HCGM to shake things up a little.

[proshox]

I wonder what the opposing coaches think. I know I would make sure my better defenders would guard MA. In many instances they are in the games at the same time...

[forevershockerfan]

Fred has earned a start and look for 3G to do just that.

[tropicalshox]

Fred has earned a start and look for 3G to do just that.

I think it could happen. He had a very nice game last night.

[tropicalshox]

It's time to play for the future and let the Fred VV era begin.

Our future still includes this year.

[choida]

malcom does things we all like...but theres numerous occasions where he costs us games or hurt us in some...all the technical fouls, turning the ball over in the evansville game at the end of the game when we had a chance to tie or take the lead...the ball dribbling off his foot in the northern iowa game...the technical foul in the tennessee game...and I think he turned it over in the SIU game as well in a critical moment...but he negates anything positive he brings by all his shanagans and sometimes makes me think..."I cant wait for the Malcolm Armstead era to be over with...this one year deal was really to help FVV transition into D-1 ball." Again he does great things but negates it with bonehead moves...which makes his bottomline always in the RED...GOSHOX and heres to Saturday