WSU VERSUS DEPAUL PREDICTIONS AND PREGAME DISCUSSION

[1972Shocker]

Here is some discussion.

If the Shocks do not improve their 3 ball make percentage, it will be a long year.

Right now, two of the top eight players are making 1-20.

Right now, three of the top nine players are making 1-23.

I'm just sayin'.

Ron Baker (9-25 = 36.0%) and Evan Wessel (7-14 = 50%) are a combined 16 of 39 for 41.0% which is pretty decent. The rest of the team is 5 for 39 for 12.8%.

At some point, 3G may have to restrict who has the green light if that does not improve. Perhaps just being a little more selective in their shot selection would help quite a bit.

I think if they are selective D-Will, Jake, Fred and Nick look like they can be a capable outside shooters. OTOH, Malcolm, Cleanthony and Tekele don't really look very good or confident with their perimeter shots and they may need to dial it back and focus on other ways to score.

In any case, we need a 2 or 3 guys in addition to Ron and Evan to step up and knock a few shots down and for everybody else to understand their strengths and weaknesses. I think that will eventually come to fruition.

[WuDrWu]

How many good 3 point shooters did we have last season?

[1972Shocker]

How many good 3 point shooters did we have last season?

I guess it depends on what you define as a "good" 3-point shooter. To me the cutoff line is at 33% (which in terms of scoring efficiency equates to a 50% 2-point shooter).

Joe Ragland wasn't good last year, he was great at 59-117 = 50.4%
Ben Smith 56-145 = 38.6%
Demetric Williams 19-54 = 35.2%
David Kyles 55-158 = 34.8% (but OMG was he streaky as he could be)
Tekele Cotton 8-23 = 34.8%

That gave us 5 last year if you buy my definition of a "good" 3-point shooter. David was so streaky though, that he wasn't real dependable.

This year we have 2 good 3-point shooters at this point. Hopefully, more to come.

[Ricardo del Rio]

How many good 3 point shooters did we have last season?

I suspect your question is rhetorical. Nevertheless, I will answer it.

Rags - 50.4%
Smith - 38.6
Williams - 35.2
Kyles - 34.8
Cotton - 34.8

Close Category
Stutz - 30.3

[ShockerPrez]

How many good 3 point shooters did we have last season?

I would only put Ragland and Smith in the good shooting category.

Kyles and Murry never seemed to hit one in the clutch, while taking a very healthy amount.

[Snapshot9]

Irregardless of the 3 pointers, I would like to see 2 players that have a good midrange game. Those baskets in the lane can do a lot for opening up a game to hit the inside man by the basket.

[1972Shocker]

Irregardless of the 3 pointers, I would like to see 2 players that have a good midrange game. Those baskets in the lane can do a lot for opening up a game to hit the inside man by the basket.

I agree. I good mid-range pull-up jumper can be a very effective range. Somewhat of a lost art it seems.

Cleanthony with his length and athleticism, in particular, could be very dangerous if he can develop a consistent mid-range game. You would think he has it in him the way he shoots free-throws.

[ShockerPrez]

What irks me more than not making treys is taking them at the most inopportune time in a possession.

[Spaulding]

It appears that Depaul will press a lot. It will be crucial for Mal or DWill / Fred to feed the post regularly. I am not overly concerned with the shooting beyond the arc, particularly if we can develop a mid-range game to bust any potential zone defense. The Shox have two senior PG's who should know how to stay within the game and control a team like Depaul.

[1972Shocker]

What irks me more than not making treys is taking them at the most inopportune time in a possession.

I agree. Hopefully, a little more patience in working the offense and a better perimeter shot selection will go a long ways to improving our 3-point efficiency as a team.

However, regardless of what we do I don't think we will match Joe's efficiency from the perimeter last year at the point.

I do think our wings have the potential to be as good or better from the perimeter as we were last year.

[jrschh]

Ron Baker (9-25 = 36.0%) and Evan Wessel (7-14 = 50%) are a combined 16 of 39 for 41.0% which is pretty decent. The rest of the team is 5 for 39 for 12.8%.

At some point, 3G may have to restrict who has the green light if that does not improve. Perhaps just being a little more selective in their shot selection would help quite a bit.

I think if they are selective D-Will, Jake, Fred and Nick look like they can be a capable outside shooters. OTOH, Malcolm, Cleanthony and Tekele don't really look very good or confident with their perimeter shots and they may need to dial it back and focus on other ways to score.

In any case, we need a 2 or 3 guys in addition to Ron and Evan to step up and knock a few shots down and for everybody else to understand their strengths and weaknesses. I think that will eventually come to fruition.

I agree 100% w/ what you just said!

Overall we don't need to put up 20 3 pointers in a game to succeed. We just need to shoot (and make) enough that keeps the other teams "honest" on defense. This means we need to be a lot more selective on our 3 point shots.

MA should not be shooting 4 threes in a game! My personal shot limit would be for him to take no more than 2 a game until he starts showing some consistency. My feeling is the same for CE. He is/going to be a great scorer for WSU. However, just because he is a great "scorer" doesn't necessarily mean he is a great "shooter". (Hopefully, that point makes some sense)

VCU is the only game I've seen played. What I noticed was that both MA and CE have issues w/ their mechanics. MA looks like he shoots the ball off his pinky vs his index finger. CE tended to shoot the ball off of his palm vs his index finger. (It's almost like he's second guessing whether he should shoot or not.) It's interesting w/ CE, because when he shoots free throws you see more of a traditional release off of the index. (Which is a reason for his high percentage on FTs) If he can transfer that into his game-time shot, I think he could eventually be a threat from 3 - point land.

[pogo]

Irregardless of the 3 pointers, I would like to see 2 players that have a good midrange game. Those baskets in the lane can do a lot for opening up a game to hit the inside man by the basket.

How much do we miss James Anacreon's mid range jumper?

[shockmonster]

The type of 3 point shots is what matters. When you go inside and he is double teamed, you have an open step up jumper that you have to take. If they aren't doubleing the inside players, Hall can manuever and either get a good shot or get fouled. OTOH, shots that are just jacked up outside of the offense are usually missed and will ultimately kill you.

[ShockTalk]

I guess it depends on what you define as a "good" 3-point shooter. To me the cutoff line is at 33% (which in terms of scoring efficiency equates to a 50% 2-point shooter).

Joe Ragland wasn't good last year, he was great at 59-117 = 50.4%
Ben Smith 56-145 = 38.6%
Demetric Williams 19-54 = 35.2%
David Kyles 55-158 = 34.8% (but OMG was he streaky as he could be)
Tekele Cotton 8-23 = 34.8%

That gave us 5 last year if you buy my definition of a "good" 3-point shooter. David was so streaky though, that he wasn't real dependable.

This year we have 2 good 3-point shooters at this point. Hopefully, more to come.

I'm a little (or a lot) confused. If Baker and Wessel replace Rags and Smith (well I don't expect anybody to replace Rags), you still have Dwill and Cotton from that last year group. From Armstead's history, he would be an adequate replacement for Kyles. That still leaves Wiggins who should be one of your top 3 point shooters as he sees more time. Frankly, I think White may be as good or better from the 3 as Stutz and Early, if selective, will be a threat.

[1972Shocker]

I'm a little (or a lot) confused. If Baker and Wessel replace Rags and Smith (well I don't expect anybody to replace Rags), you still have Dwill and Cotton from that last year group. From Armstead's history, he would be an adequate replacement for Kyles. That still leaves Wiggins who should be one of your top 3 point shooters as he sees more time. Frankly, I think White may be as good or better from the 3 as Stutz and Early, if selective, will be a threat.

Ron and Evan are the only ones qualified statistically at this early stage of this season as "good" 3-point shooters (assuming you agree with my definition of "good").

D-Will and Tekele have yet to prove that they can repeat last year's performance. Both have had some injury problems that have slowed them down. I hope they come on, but in Tekele's case I don't see him shooting a lot of treys. I agree that Jake can be as good or better from 3 than Stutz or Early, but whether or not that comes to fruition or how many opportunities he will get this year remain to be seen. Jake is 0-3 so far this year. Maclolm is 0-10 this year.

I think the confusion is you are going on past history and I presenting the numbers based on this year's early season performance. Since it is early and the sample sizes are pretty small I still have hope that this will turn around for the Shocks.