SOUTH DAKOTA STATE (4-5) vs. WICHITA STATE (7-2) Game Thread

[SB Shock]

Didn’t watch the game (obviously) but this who did, does this cast any shadow of doubt in mills?

Does Mills make makes the team go 11 for 43 from 2 while having their best 3pt shooting night? Pohto couldn’t hit a 3 foot or Ft, if he does WSU is up at halftime and I bet wsu wins.

[ShockingButTrue]

“Good team”?

SDSU is not good.

What about Liberty and Missouri Dingleberry? Are they good or is too hard for you to see beyond the b12? Oh, wait...

[Stickboy46]

Does Mills make makes the team go 11 for 43 from 2 while having their best 3pt shooting night? Pohto couldn’t hit a 3 foot or Ft, if he does WSU is up at halftime and I bet wsu wins.

that's part of it .. but we also took a lot of forced crappy shots .. which is at least part on Mills. Though you are correct, if we make our bunnies, we win, though it was probably still a close game. Which a game vs SDSU shouldn't be a close game. We made them look like a Final Four team when they were on offense. They completely carved us up. That concerns me most IMO. We couldn't stop Mayo from getting in the lane, and when he did, we over corrected and left their shooters WIDE open.

So not all on Mills, but not all on Pohto either.

[ShockRef]

Didn’t watch the game (obviously) but this who did, does this cast any shadow of doubt in mills?

I knew while watching the on line scoring updates of this game, there would be stupid ass comments like this just after the game.
And Bingo...here it is.

Every team has one of these type games through the year. Lots of teams are vulnerable to this type of performance especially during Finals week.
Ask FAU about the turd they dropped while losing to Bryant!

It happens people. I recall the outrage on here when WSU got "Evilled' by the Purple Pimps a few years ago.

Sometimes, guys are just not focused on the job at hand and the other team is zeroed in.
Just like last night.

I even remember many years ago WSU losing in STL to a really bad Drake team.
Drake had a dude who just went off that night and sent WSU home before I had my first shot at getting some of Pappys BBQ or Hodaks chicken.

So calm down and remember, its long season and there will be some pain before all is said and done.

The is all.

[Stickboy46]

https://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/article282880448.html

"Mills believes it will be an outlier performance from a WSU team that had used its size and athleticism all season to score efficiently this season.

Read more at: https://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/article282880448.html#storylink=cpy"

Hopefully that is just "media speak" ... The reason we have been able to use our size and athleticism to score efficiently this year is because we have played majority junk teams so far. There are going to be more teams closer to Mizzou, SDSU, Liberty the rest of the way than teams like Coastal Carolina. So hopefully he's not actually thinking the gameplan of getting in the lane one on one and forcing up a contested shot is the way to go. We have to find a way to generate shots that isn't just pass it around the perimeter until we get a one on one that we want and then go iso.

[1972Shocker]

Wasn’t there something said about him not being able to carry this year over? Use it or lose it for some reason.

I think this is what your are referring to: https://shockernet.net/forum/wichita...31#post1414631

[shockrah]

https://www.kansas.com/sports/colleg...282880448.html

"Mills believes it will be an outlier performance from a WSU team that had used its size and athleticism all season to score efficiently this season.

Read more at: https://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/article282880448.html#storylink=cpy"

Hopefully that is just "media speak" ... The reason we have been able to use our size and athleticism to score efficiently this year is because we have played majority junk teams so far. There are going to be more teams closer to Mizzou, SDSU, Liberty the rest of the way than teams like Coastal Carolina. So hopefully he's not actually thinking the gameplan of getting in the lane one on one and forcing up a contested shot is the way to go. We have to find a way to generate shots that isn't just pass it around the perimeter until we get a one on one that we want and then go iso.

Non Eagle link:

https://news.yahoo.com/cold-shooting-start-dooms-wichita-015306298.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall

[shock]

What I’ve seen is the year immediately after the Covid short season was the Covid year, so that doesn’t make sense.

[Singeril]

"our energy wasn't right"....one of the weakest excuses I've read. There is NO excuse for that.

[Blackmag]

Went to the game last night. Yes I was one of the idiots who paid $75x2 to go. Felt like supporting a team that was playing hard and improving. But last night I really didn’t see any of that. We missed so many shots at the rim, some contested many not. Pohto really had an off night along with Bell. No punch off the bench last night. SD really played physical and we didn’t respond. We pressed with about 2-3 minutes left and it bothered them but with our lack of bench it’s not doable for long periods. SD out hustled and we couldn’t handle the penetration and kick out. They seem to hit 3s when we tried to make a run. All in all we lost to a team we should beat, especially the way we had been playing as of late. Big disappointment but still hoping for better days….

[WuDrWu]

I wish I could go back and rewatch the game and break it down a little more than as I watched in person.

That being said......

The end of semester funk is a real thing and, for whatever reason, it or something similar was painfully evident from the get go. My proximity to the bench was way different than my seats in the Chuck so I know I wasn't paying as close attention as usual, but last night was the first time I didn't see the bench engagement I've become used to seeing this year. I don't think it suggests we've "lost the team" but as I said, there was a funk about. Perhaps it was Cold's insidious virus idk.

I've said for months that our margin for error is razor thin and nothing has happened to change that so you can't be surprised when things go bad, like last night. We literally have nothing else to plug in and try to change direction.

There's no doubt we missed some close in shots early and just a reasonable amount of those going in changes the complexion of the game in ways that can mean a Shocker win. And as Stickboy46 said, SDSU contested every shot like no one I've seen all season. Good on them.

BUT

There are also some things that these eyes cannot un-see. First, game prep. Our guys were unprepared for what SDSU threw at us. I don't care about any mitigating factors...it's SDSU for crying out loud. MAC teams seemed ok prepping for this bunch, we should have been better prepared.

The Mayo kid was better than anyone we have...a reminder of how far we need to go, talent wise.

I don't know how SDSU only shot 12-33 from 3. I can't remember that many WIDE open 3s. EVER. Any quality team is going to knock down 50% of those open looks and there were a **** ton of them. It's fair to say a few were well guarded or forced, but not many. And you're going to give up great looks now and then....but last night was a far cry from "now and then".

Giving the ball to our posts, especially Q, in terrible spots like deep short post or just inside the elbow is inexcusable. There's nothing good that's going to happen there. Reverse the ball and try the other side. Call for the pick and roll....literally anything besides throwing a pass to guy who can't handle the ball, who's 10-15 feet from the basket being guarded by a guy twice as quick as he is....just dumb and we did it time and time and time again.

The start of the 2nd half might have been as bad as bad gets. I don't know if we even took a shot in the first 3 minutes before we had call a timeout down 14. Someone tell me that didn't actually happen.

Down a ton, late, and nothing working, I can understand some malaise, but around 5 minutes we had made a couple of buckets to get it around 10 (8-12 SDSU lead) and we were sitting on 3 fouls. Now, I get you don't want to put them on the line because they're good foul shooters. But we had 4 to give to even get that to be a problem. We should have been aggressively trapping and double teaming them etc...and if we get fouls called so be it. Not putting yourself in a position to foul at the end of the game is just poor coaching. Also, not at least trying to go small (with Joy) late when we needed to chase (Kenny & Q just aren't built for it) and trap and foul is stubbornness and short sided. We were either stupid or gave up, take your pick. Neither is acceptable imho.

I didn't expect much to start the season. I'm certainly pleased with most of the results to date and those carry a lot more weight than just last night by itself. But, there were some things I cannot un-see.

Beverly makes some mistakes, but at least he's playing his freaking tail off all game. That always works.

Their fans, numerous, were better than ours. And it was easy for them to be better.


It bears repeating, the Shocker Sound Machine has been and was again great last night. As was the spirit squad. I don't know if there has been a change in leadership or directive from above or a change in how they go about selecting members and then training...but both cheer and dance are out there with a purpose, look well prepared and serious but still cheer leading. A standing ovation for that group and last night was not an outlier, it was the norm this season. And I think someone here has a niece or daughter out there....please tell them thank you. Job very well done.

[Maizerunner08]

This was the first game I felt we should have won on paper and didn’t. I’ll give the benefit of the doubt. Flush this one away.

[Stickboy46]

What I’ve seen is the year immediately after the Covid short season was the Covid year, so that doesn’t make sense.

Covid Short year was 19-20 (March 2020 was when the NCAA Tourney was cancelled) .. those players did NOT get another year (otherwise we would have had Jaime another year).

The freebie Covid year was 2020-21

Cortes started in 21-22, so I do not think he has a covid year.

[Stickboy46]

I wish I could go back and rewatch the game and break it down a little more than as I watched in person.

That being said......

The end of semester funk is a real thing and, for whatever reason, it or something similar was painfully evident from the get go. My proximity to the bench was way different than my seats in the Chuck so I know I wasn't paying as close attention as usual, but last night was the first time I didn't see the bench engagement I've become used to seeing this year. I don't think it suggests we've "lost the team" but as I said, there was a funk about. Perhaps it was Cold's insidious virus idk.

I've said for months that our margin for error is razor thin and nothing has happened to change that so you can't be surprised when things go bad, like last night. We literally have nothing else to plug in and try to change direction.

There's no doubt we missed some close in shots early and just a reasonable amount of those going in changes the complexion of the game in ways that can mean a Shocker win. And as Stickboy46 said, SDSU contested every shot like no one I've seen all season. Good on them.

BUT

There are also some things that these eyes cannot un-see. First, game prep. Our guys were unprepared for what SDSU threw at us. I don't care about any mitigating factors...it's SDSU for crying out loud. MAC teams seemed ok prepping for this bunch, we should have been better prepared.

The Mayo kid was better than anyone we have...a reminder of how far we need to go, talent wise.

I don't know how SDSU only shot 12-33 from 3. I can't remember that many WIDE open 3s. EVER. Any quality team is going to knock down 50% of those open looks and there were a **** ton of them. It's fair to say a few were well guarded or forced, but not many. And you're going to give up great looks now and then....but last night was a far cry from "now and then".

Giving the ball to our posts, especially Q, in terrible spots like deep short post or just inside the elbow is inexcusable. There's nothing good that's going to happen there. Reverse the ball and try the other side. Call for the pick and roll....literally anything besides throwing a pass to guy who can't handle the ball, who's 10-15 feet from the basket being guarded by a guy twice as quick as he is....just dumb and we did it time and time and time again.

The start of the 2nd half might have been as bad as bad gets. I don't know if we even took a shot in the first 3 minutes before we had call a timeout down 14. Someone tell me that didn't actually happen.

Down a ton, late, and nothing working, I can understand some malaise, but around 5 minutes we had made a couple of buckets to get it around 10 (8-12 SDSU lead) and we were sitting on 3 fouls. Now, I get you don't want to put them on the line because they're good foul shooters. But we had 4 to give to even get that to be a problem. We should have been aggressively trapping and double teaming them etc...and if we get fouls called so be it. Not putting yourself in a position to foul at the end of the game is just poor coaching. Also, not at least trying to go small (with Joy) late when we needed to chase (Kenny & Q just aren't built for it) and trap and foul is stubbornness and short sided. We were either stupid or gave up, take your pick. Neither is acceptable imho.

I didn't expect much to start the season. I'm certainly pleased with most of the results to date and those carry a lot more weight than just last night by itself. But, there were some things I cannot un-see.

Beverly makes some mistakes, but at least he's playing his freaking tail off all game. That always works.

There fans, numerous, were better than ours. And it was easy for them to be better.


It bears repeating, the Shocker Sound Machine has been and was again great last night. As was the spirit squad. I don't know if there has been a change in leadership or directive from above or a change in how they go about selecting members and then training...but both cheer and dance are out there with a purpose, look well prepared and serious but still cheer leading. A standing ovation for that group and last night was not an outlier, it was the norm this season. And I think someone here has a niece or daughter out there....please tell them thank you. Job very well done.

As far as the 2nd half start .. that's what I remember too. We had everything from pocket picked, to lazy passes ... to having a freaking fast break oop blocked .. not at the receivers end but at the passing end ... The end of the first half and beginning of the second half was some of the worst basketball I've see in a LONG time.

[WuDrWu]

One last thing...we've all griped and complained about ticket prices and fan engagement and how someone bungled this entire fiasco....and I am certainly one of those people. And if you were like me and dropped some coin to go, thank you for your support. And if you didn't, I certainly understand and I don't blame ANYONE for not going.....

But, let me just say this. It is the holiday season. Take the $15 you would have spent and buy something on the Wish Tree or the Food Bank or make some food for a less fortunate family member....anything you chose. Everyone here has it pretty good....we (and we absolutely includes me) should do more. Here's a good time to do just that. Merry Christmas to all.