Dispelling the Carl Hall rumors

[McShocker]

iirc medical redshirts can only be requested after a player is out of eligibility.

My understanding, as well.

[WSUwatcher]

Without going through each post on this thread, this might be a repeat...if so, forgive me. Is CH's situation so unique that the recruiting process didn't uncover a need to be proactive about this issue? Is it me or is our administration a bit on their heels when it comes to the background knowledge of our student-athletes? HCGM might have recruited a little differently if Hall's potential eligibility challenge was known well in advance.

I don't claim to understand the process involved in seeking a 6th years, and I don't have the time or inclination to try to research it. But just looking at it from a procedural standpoint (i.e, based on the way legal and administrative proceedings typically work), it would be unusual for a governing body to address questions about expanded eligibility such as a sixth year before the usual five years had been exhausted. So I'm guessing WSU acted on this as quickly as they could, and Marshall took it into consideration as soon as he realistically could -- it isn't like he has a lot of extra scholarships floating around at this point; if anything, we're all marveling at how he's able to keep as many scholarship-caliber players as he has.

[shock]

I'm wondering if Carl does return, if it will even be on scholie. If Marshall presents a scenario of a kid paying his own way, going to school on his own dime, with a heart condition that hindered his progress over the last six years, who just wants to finish his four years of ball, they might be more inclined to grant the extra year of eligibility.

[SubGod22]

I'm wondering if Carl does return, if it will even be on scholie. If Marshall presents a scenario of a kid paying his own way, going to school on his own dime, with a heart condition that hindered his progress over the last six years, who just wants to finish his four years of ball, they might be more inclined to grant the extra year of eligibility.

The NCAA isn't going to care if he's on 'ship or not. I think his health concerns have been well documented and that that'll lead to a 6th year being granted. Heart conditions are nothing to sneeze at.

But as I've said, it's the NCAA and they don't always make a lot of sense.

[WuDrWu]

I've mostly stayed away from this topic since learning of the issue but the speculation that the staff was not aware of this situation is inane. If you subscribe to this theory, I suggest you re-evaluate your trust in 3G.

If it turns out that Carl is not granted a 6th year, then his recruitment and signing remain 100% worth it. There is no discussion.

I'm not positive, but I believe that if not granted a 6th year, Carl is still eligible to receive financial aid so as to complete his degree which he is more than on pace to do. Someone feel free to correct me if I am mistaken (at your own risk).

[Ricardo del Rio]

+1, but I am not taking any risks.

[BostonWu]

I'm going to assume that WSU admin have medical experts' testimony readily available that supports taking a year off when dealing with heart conditions. If that assumption holds true then I'm not sure how the ncaa could second guess Carl's course of action.

[martymoose]

I haven't followed every thread on this, but I seem to recall a few posters who think they are "in the know" who were slamming the guy who broke this story pretty hard. You know who you are.

[WSUwatcher]

I've mostly stayed away from this topic since learning of the issue but the speculation that the staff was not aware of this situation is inane. If you subscribe to this theory, I suggest you re-evaluate your trust in 3G.

If it turns out that Carl is not granted a 6th year, then his recruitment and signing remain 100% worth it. There is no discussion.

I'm not positive, but I believe that if not granted a 6th year, Carl is still eligible to receive financial aid so as to complete his degree which he is more than on pace to do. Someone feel free to correct me if I am mistaken (at your own risk).

There are certainly provisions that allow scholarship athletes to stay on "medical" scholarship even after they stop playing. It's fairly common in football, which is not surprising given the physically punishing nature of the sport. Whether such provisions would apply to Hall should it become relevant, I don't pretend to know.

Apart from that, a big +1. Marshall and his guys make a lot of money recruiting, in essence -- because it's a big part of coaching successfully enough to get paid as much as they do. They know what they're doing, so the chance that this snuck up on them is even smaller than the chance that KC would post something upbeat and encouraging about the baseball program. Oh, wait... (By the way, I know it's OT, but nice job, KC -- you old sunshine pumper! Check out the baseball forum, everybody, about good things on the horizon.)

[shockmonster]

I've mostly stayed away from this topic since learning of the issue but the speculation that the staff was not aware of this situation is inane. If you subscribe to this theory, I suggest you re-evaluate your trust in 3G.

If it turns out that Carl is not granted a 6th year, then his recruitment and signing remain 100% worth it. There is no discussion.

I'm not positive, but I believe that if not granted a 6th year, Carl is still eligible to receive financial aid so as to complete his degree which he is more than on pace to do. Someone feel free to correct me if I am mistaken (at your own risk).

There has been a lot of negativity to this development (in as much as fans weren't aware of this situation and how could our staff take a chance on recruiting Hall). However, I have to believe that HCGM knew about this situation when Hall was recruited. And I have to assume that the coaching staff felt that Hall had a good chance of winning the appeal to the NCAA. However, this assumption has been false in the past. I would be willing to assume that we have at least a 50/50 chance to win the appeal (at least the staff felt that we had at least a 50/50 chance when he was recruited).

[The Mad Hatter]

I'm going to assume that WSU admin have medical experts' testimony readily available that supports taking a year off when dealing with heart conditions. If that assumption holds true then I'm not sure how the ncaa could second guess Carl's course of action.

That would be the reasonable thing to do, but the NCAA has denied a 6th season to players where there was no question that their injuries were real and prevented them from playing for multiple years.

[rrshock]

I think that at this point I am expecting not to see Carl hall as a player this year. So then if he does get the waiver, I'll be pleasantly surprised.

[jocoshock]

Here's one waiver granted so far...

There was good news for Minnesota Golden Gopher fans. Power forward Trevor Mbakwehas decided to return to Minnesota next season after a knee injury wiped out his senior year. He is taking advantage of an NCAA ruling granting him a sixth year of eligibility. Tubby Smith has to be thrilled with that decision as Mbakwe will be one of the top players in the Big Ten next season.

http://espn.go.com/espn/dickvitale/story/_/id/7845599/roundball-chatter

[WSUwatcher]

It's inconceivable that Marshall and Co. were unaware of Hall's history. It's their job to know such things. We didn't, partly because it isn't our job, and partly because coaches simply know so much more than we do. But Hall was one of the best juco players in the country, and he played the exact position that had just been cleaned out from WSU's roster with the departure of Durley, Blair, and Ellis, whose only other replacement was a true freshman in Jake White. (Keith DeWitt, the potential USM refugee, was a longshot who of course ultimately didn't pan out anyway.)

So as Doc says, with all that in mind, signing Hall was a no-brainer even if WSU WAS only sure of having him for one year. The chance to have him for two by getting him a sixth year -- something the coaches knew about in those terms even as we unknowingly assumed he'd be around for two years because that's the way it usually works with jucos -- just made Hall even more compelling. We may be fussing, because we didn't know what was going on and just now found out. But inside the program, this was no doubt all expected, and no doubt also part of the reason for the continuing big-man recruiting that has had our Shockernet scholarship counters mystified for so long. It all makes sense now -- to us. But to Marshall and his staff, you can bet it all made sense all along.

[swiltar71]

Should know something by Friday. It's up in the air.