Wichita State (#23) at Tulsa Game Thread

[ShockerFever]

He Needs to recognize that JB has talent, but is not his guy to attack the basket.
Can he attack the basket against Oral Roberts/Gardner Webbs of the world?
Sure.
AAC level teams?
Did you see the three really bad turnovers he committed, plus the silly offensive foul all in the second half?
They were 4 major offensive possessions he literally gave to Tulsa.
Thats why they need to develop TE to attack the basket, in addition to his long distance shooting ability.

I'm not knocking JBs effort. Not at all, as he busts his tail every game.
But he doesn't have AAC level ability to attack the basket in the role they are playing him.
You see the length teams like Houston and Cincy have and how well they clamp down on undersized drivers. it just ain't gonna happen.

TE has that type of body and ability, it just needs to be developed. They better start doing so or beat the recruiting trail to death and find that type of guy(s).

That is all.

Cdizzle isn't gonna like this post.

[Teddy Graham]

“HCGM needs to recognize”.....”he needs to understand”.....”he needs to realize”

Yeah, how did he win all of those games? Oh that's right, assistants...SMH.

[ShockerFever]

Shoot just 40 % on wide open 3s and it's a double digit win

How many of the wide open 3's were taken 3 or more feet from behind the line. Sometimes they're open for a reason if we're deep behind the line. ES in particular will chuck it up 2 feet behind the NBA line, including his last one with 14 seconds left on the shot clock. Those are BAD shots, whether they're open or not. They have less than a 15% chance of going in.

Our shot selection SUCKS.

[N Crestway]

Personally, I believe a few have blown the ES incident out of proportion nearly all, including ES, anywhere have forgotten all about it.
I seriously doubt that is a reason he has not shot well lately, He is not the only one shooting poorly and not singularly responsible
for the teams poor play on offense. Too much dribbling, poor ball movement, poor passing, and players standing around watching
all the dribbling and not moving without the ball. Improve in those areas and the shooting will improve, as well. I also agree with
anothers comment about our size. Overall, we are a small team. For some time now I have advocated playing a bigger line up. We
have not used AM and PB to our advantage and by not doing so I don't think we have, or will, reach or potential. Put me down as a
poor poster for bringing AM up so much but if he only gets 1-2 minutes a game I don't see ow people put him down so much. As
always I will point to his play mid January thru the end of last season as a measuring stick against some pretty good competition.

Well said... Without AM and PB we are a small team. Would rather see more of AM and less of Udeze. I agree that AM for 1 to 2 minutes per game is not enough playing time to get him into any kind of rhythm. Get the impression that if anything the kid is becoming more and more detached from the team and the game given all his time on the sidelines.

[Teddy Graham]

I could only follow the second half via the phone. What adjustments did Tulsa make and what adjustments should WSU have made ? Obviously there are several posters with the same thoughts. Thanks.

I'm in the same boat as ABC...I missed the first 10 minutes of the 2nd half and had to listen. Interestingly, the thing I remember Mike K saying is how baffled he was at how far off TE's 3's were (not down on TE at all - love his attitude and game - but that is just what I can recall Mike mentioning). I would also be interested in the specific moves that were made and not countered in the 2nd half. My thoughts after the game were Ref's original note - 3G can't shoot it for them - he needs to scheme so they are in position to make a play, but they have to hit the shot. Ref, even removing the disparity in D1 experience of these teams and home court advantage in this game, it still looks to me like the next time Haith outcoaches Marshall will be the first.

[shoxlax]

Just got back from the game.. didn't read all of the thread but here's my observations..

We can't shoot for **** anymore. We shot horribly, and still almost won. That won't fly against the next few teams on the schedule.

Did the refs review anything? ES made what looked to be a clear 3 in the first half, they ruled it a 2 and didn't see them review it. In the second half Dexter had a shot blocked that looked like it was clearly a goal tend. Didn't see a review of that either. Refs weren't horrible but I think Tulsa had 12 fouls and I think 6 of them were on offense. Did they really only foul 6 times on defense? Probably not.

Student section was... Well I would have been embarrassed if I was a Tulsa fan. Besides the already mentioned getting in the players faces, they were flipping off the Shocker crowd section, at one point started chanting Maggie Marshall for some reason, had several vulgar chants, and then to top it off, they trampled one of their own fans during the court storm. Girl laid on the court for a couple minutes before being helped up. Solid class.

Other than that, good game by Tulsa. Made the plays they needed... We didn't

Okay please do not throttle me for asking because I just got back from Tulsa and don’t want to go through 100 + messages, but has anyone watched the Erik shot that was called a two and the goal tending no call on replay?

[SHOCKvalue]

Okay please do not throttle me for asking because I just got back from Tulsa and don’t want to go through 100 + messages, but has anyone watched the Erik shot that was called a two and the goal tending no call on replay?

Consensus seems to be it was a two, and it was goal-tending.

[pinstripers]

Jamie had 13 in the first half, 2 in the second half. Was that due to halftime adjustments by Haith? Or did Marshall forget to go to him in the second half? You choose

[Shocktheheck]

They fronted JE the second half and dropped another down, which should leave someone open if you swing the ball. But we dribble , don't pass and rarely work inside out. I believe our offense is a bit archaic for many players. IE look at scoring averages of LS and FVV after they leave this system.

[another shocker]

Jamie had 13 in the first half, 2 in the second half. Was that due to halftime adjustments by Haith? Or did Marshall forget to go to him in the second half? You choose

3rd season in , marshall is having a bit of a rough go at it in the aac. you would think that he would have a power forward in place by now. no such luck.

[WuDrWu]

They fronted JE the second half and dropped another down, which should leave someone open if you swing the ball. But we dribble , don't pass and rarely work inside out. I believe our offense is a bit archaic for many players. IE look at scoring averages of LS and FVV after they leave this system.

And therein lies a lot of the final. Jamie was abusing Tulsa, Frank realized this and had to pick his poison. He choice to front and double help over the top, and in turn he knew he was likely to give up some open 3s. He chose to give up open 3s instead of easy post moves from Jamie. He rolled the dice and got a little lucky (yes, I think our 3% being so low was lucky for TU). It is what it is.

[BOBB]

Nm

[TheShocktocles]

We lost because we don't know how to play against a zone. If Tulsa would have played strictly man-to-man, it wouldn't have been a contest. Plus Tulsa would have had more fouls.

I disagree that we lost because they played zone. We lost because we stop making shots. Tulsa went into their zone after 4 minutes into the game. The shocks were not surprised by it. The shocks prepared for that zone all week.The shocks had the lead at the half and should have been up more. There is nothing wrong with our offense. Whats wrong is that they missed wide open 3 point shots. Did the same thing in the second half when they started double teaming JE.

Look at last year stats on the game in Tulsa. They played a zone again and we lit them up. Why? Because last year our guys shot the 3 point shot well in that game. DD went 6-9, SHJ 5-10, and ES 3-6. Now look at this year. DD1-7, TE 2-8 and ES 0-6. The entire team was 6-31. Game over.

We need to move on. Cincy will play another strong defense but different. Hope we play good defense again and maybe make more shots this game. Go Shocks.

[shoxlax]

I disagree that we lost because they played zone. We lost because we stop making shots. Tulsa went into their zone after 4 minutes into the game. The shocks were not surprised by it. The shocks prepared for that zone all week.The shocks had the lead at the half and should have been up more. There is nothing wrong with our offense. Whats wrong is that they missed wide open 3 point shots. Did the same thing in the second half when they started double teaming JE.

Look at last year stats on the game in Tulsa. They played a zone again and we lit them up. Why? Because last year our guys shot the 3 point shot well in that game. DD went 6-9, SHJ 5-10, and ES 3-6. Now look at this year. DD1-7, TE 2-8 and ES 0-6. The entire team was 6-31. Game over.

We need to move on. Cincy will play another strong defense but different. Hope we play good defense again and maybe make more shots this game. Go Shocks.

Agree 100%.

[Kel Varnsen]

Thought this was a really cool clip, even though it came about because of an unfortunate loss for us. Joiner talks about hitting the game-winner in front of his father, who had largely not been in his son's life and watched him play for the first time on Saturday.