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Recant Regards Ralph Miller

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  • #16
    This year will be a "total disaster" compared to the pre-season predictions of a top-3 league finish and on the NCAA bubble. By that metric, I was expecting a "total disaster". We are getting pretty much what we should have been expecting. If you want to win in this league with only 2 returning players (I'm not counting Midtgaard), you better have at least a couple of top-100 guys in there.

    Many SN posters thought this was an elite recruiting class. So far there hasn't been much seen on the court to support that assumption.

    Miller had one HUGE advantage over Marshall. Not a single school south of here, and NOT very many north of here were recruiting black players during Miller's time here. Quite a different environment for recruiting.

    Edit: Added the word "NOT" in my previous paragraph. I meant to say that Miller was one of few coaches actively recruiting black players.
    Last edited by Aargh; January 7th, 2019, 08:58 PM.
    The future's so bright - I gotta wear shades.
    We like to cut down nets and get sized for championship rings.

    Comment


    • Shocker1976
      Shocker1976 commented
      Editing a comment
      I do not agree with your statement "Miller had one HUGE advantage over Marshall. Not a single school south of here, and very many north of here were recruiting black players during Miller's time here. Quite a different environment for recruiting." Miller did start his career by recruiting Cleo Littleton(6' 3" guard/forward) to join him at Wichita but Dave Stallworth was the only black All American to play for Miller. Nate Bowman and Gene Wiley were two 6' 10" centers who went on to play in the NBA.

      Ralph's write-up by journalists often pointed out that he over-achieved with less than stellar players.

  • #17
    Originally posted by insaneykaney View Post

    I sincerely hope you woke up this morning and re-read this with regret.
    Sorry to disappoint you but research I did this morning convinces me more than ever that Ralph Miller was the best coach to lead the Shockers; Marshall ranks behind Miller IMO.

    Comment


    • #18
      I didn't think freshmen even played in the Ralph Miller era.

      Comment


    • #19
      Originally posted by Windiwu View Post
      I didn't think freshmen even played in the Ralph Miller era.
      Ralph Miller was the former coach at East High School and his star player was Cleo Littleton. They both came to then WU and Cleo played and starred for a full four years. Taking nothing away from Coach Miller as an outstanding coach, bringing Cleo along with him was the smartest move he ever made.

      Comment


      • #20
        Originally posted by Shocker1976 View Post
        After today's loss to Temple, I want to recant my posts regarding Marshall surpassing IMO Ralph Miller as the greatest Shocker Mens Basketball Coach. I was premature drawing such a conclusion.

        I was very young when Ralph was coaching the Shockers but I cannot recall a single season in which he coached the Shockers where the Shockers would clearly establish their superiority in the first half and then lose the game(s) in the second half. I also recall that Ralph's record with the Shockers season after season was built on playing the best teams in the country both out of conference and in conference; i.e. playing in the Valley of Death rather than in the Valley of Mediocrity.
        I don't recall the year, but most likely it was around in 1959 or 1960 time frame, when we blew a huge first half lead, at home, of somewhere around 20-25 points, against a highly rated Bradley team, which we did not beat very often back in those days. Then we came out the second half and instead of continuing what had gotten the huge lead, which was we were out shooting, outrunning, out rebounding them, and were physically outplaying them. But Coach Miller had the team come out and play the same game tactics that Hank Iba at Oklahoma A&M (OK State) used to beat him very frequently at, The Stall. No Shot Clock back then and you could hold on to the ball as long as you wanted by passing it, or dribbling it, until you had a wide open basket, or got fouled. Only problem was that our guys rarely, if ever, practiced it. And of course the lead agonizing disappeared, and we lost.

        This was clearly the most pronounced loss of its type during Coach Miller's time. I should add that other than normal losses, I do not recall that losing leads was a significant problem.

        Comment


        • WstateU
          WstateU commented
          Editing a comment
          Did this game lead to the 'egg tossing' incident at coach Miller's home? I was pretty young at the time and don't recall the details. I believe coach Miller mentioned it in his book, Spanning the Game.

          Here's a good article following coach Miller's passing...

          "Mike Kennedy, the radio announcer for the Shockers in the '80s and an authority on their history, recounted a story of when Miller took Wichita State to North Texas State in the early 1960s.

          Miller's team had a comfortable lead and the reserves were in. Home fans started throwing debris at the visitors' bench, so Miller went to the opposing coach and asked him to ask the fans to stop.

          "(Blank) you!" came the reply.

          Miller stormed back to his bench, waved his five starters in and blew the home team out by 40 points. Afterward, the North Texas State coach approached Miller and said, "Ralph, you didn't have to pour it on."

          Miller's reply: "(Blank) you!""

          http://mailtribune.com/archive/mille...anned-the-game

      • #21
        1960
        Originally posted by 60Shock View Post

        I don't recall the year, but most likely it was around in 1959 or 1960 time frame, when we blew a huge first half lead, at home, of somewhere around 20-25 points, against a highly rated Bradley team, which we did not beat very often back in those days. Then we came out the second half and instead of continuing what had gotten the huge lead, which was we were out shooting, outrunning, out rebounding them, and were physically outplaying them. But Coach Miller had the team come out and play the same game tactics that Hank Iba at Oklahoma A&M (OK State) used to beat him very frequently at, The Stall. No Shot Clock back then and you could hold on to the ball as long as you wanted by passing it, or dribbling it, until you had a wide open basket, or got fouled. Only problem was that our guys rarely, if ever, practiced it. And of course the lead agonizing disappeared, and we lost.

        This was clearly the most pronounced loss of its type during Coach Miller's time. I should add that other than normal losses, I do not recall that losing leads was a significant problem.
        1960 Bradley beat the Shocks 71-70 and in 1961 score was 57-56 at Henry Levitt Arena, which game do you remember? I can't recall the half time scores but do recall Chet Walker was Bradley's stud!

        Comment


        • #22
          WstateIU, can't sweat to it but now that you mentioned it, the 'egg tossing' does ring a very distant bell.

          And almost as bad, a stuffed dummy was hung and burned in effigy. I know that for a fact as I saw it.

          WstateU commented
          22 hours ago
          Did this game lead to the 'egg tossing' incident at coach Miller's home? I was pretty young at the time and don't recall the details. I believe coach Miller mentioned it in his book, Spanning the Game.

          Comment


          • WstateU
            WstateU commented
            Editing a comment
            I have the book put away somewhere and will try and locate it. There's some good quotes I'd like to share in this thread.

          • 60Shock
            60Shock commented
            Editing a comment
            If the 1960 game was at the Roundhouse, that was most likely the game. If not,it couldn't have been 1961 because I had graduated in June,1960 and was no longer living in Wichita when the 1961 season began. Sorry it has been around 60 years ago. I have no recollection whether the egg throwing and the hanging and setting fire to the dummy took place at the same date. But, certainly could have.
            Last edited by 60Shock; January 11th, 2019, 08:47 PM.
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