We've lost our edge

[top20shock]

This thread should be locked.

[choida]

Marshall needs to keep looking for diamond in the rough players... Play angry can be established again by having high basketball IQ players that have a huge chip on their shoulders.

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Just checked the box score. VCU shot 50% from the field. LOL! Isn't that amazing? A team like them would never have broken 40% against the P.A. Shockers. Teams with UBER athletes like Ron Baker, Fred VanVleet, and Evan Wessel............................................ ...........


T


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I think the team deserves another comment on this issue from CB. Prior to Jaime going down, the team was actually playing fairly hard. They were nowhere near the level of VCU in terms of desperation and heart (Play Angry) but they weren't mailing it in either. All things considered we didn't gain or lose in the Play Angry department after yesterday's game. Still a long ways to go though.

Now, if we were at VCU's level of Play Angry I wouldn't be worried about losing Jaime. Of course the chances of anything special happening this season would be very low but we would be competitive and aspirations for the top half of the AAC would not be met with laughter. You see, when you are at Full Play Angry, you are ALWAYS in the game. When you are within a couple baskets with 3 minutes left anything can happen. Without Play Angry you get blown out like we have seemingly every other match. I think we've gotten blown out more games this season than all of Gregg Marshall's prior combined. Maybe an exaggeration but it sure feels like it. That begins and ends with P.A.


T


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It was tough watching "powerhouse" VCU's taller guard(s) exploit our smaller ones. That being said we might have won this game had Jaime not gone down. We were up about 6-7 pts. at the time. He demanded a double the second he touched the ball which lessened the "Havoc" effect. That's how good he is. Oh well.

By the way noobies... in case you wanted to know what we used to look like - minus a little unnecessary roughness - VCU made old CB nostalgic today. At the two minute mark VCU players were already glistening with sweat. Homeboys came to do work today. And even though they didn't hit an outside shot for about 75 minutes, they just kept pressuring, pressuring, pressuring. A casual observer would have thought that it was only a matter of time before VCU got worn out - then started to falter. I too saw that the clock was ticking, but I knew it was counting down to our demise. They weren't going to quit until we broke. They were playing for the zero-zero tie. They didn't need a basket. Those were men we met in Richmond and they smelled blood. They'll walk right into your family's kitchen and take the last loaf of bread off the table while staring down your hungry toddler.

Warriors. Killers. Victors.

Good for Mike Rhoades. His players aren't satisfied...


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[SB Shock]

They looked like the exact opposite team of the one on Wednesday.

ORU is 300 ranked team
VCU is a top 80 team

[Shock Top]

Mindset, not result.

[ShockerFever]

They looked like the exact opposite team of the one on Wednesday.

ORU at home vs. VCU on the road

[Shock Top]

They looked like the exact opposite team of the one on Wednesday.

[WstateU]

[WstateU]

That post is going to cost you a fortune...

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I thought my nuts were feelin' unusually heavy today. Relax that jaw pressure pie.


T


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[pie n eye]

Add a beat and replace a couple of words with f*** and this would raise the roof at CKA!

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Forgot to reply to your comment about NBA recruits. We have two NBA potentials on our current squad. Of course these aren't traditional NBA potentials, they are of the Shocker variety. But if they both get in, it will be two very different types of NBA players than we've sent in the past. One being an uber-athletic, highlight reel beast, the other a nimble big man with a soft touch and a taste for the rejection.

I need to start see something out of DD though, he's got SO much more game. I wonder if he's having problems between his ears; i.e., homesickness, girlfriend, etc. He was a monster during the summer. I was like, this dude could get called up Quickly. He'd hit back-to-back-to-back 3's off the break, finish wayyyyyyy over people. We saw a tiny glimpse of that in one game this year. Now he bangs his head. Hopefully it fixes more than it broke.

He's got the body, the height, the range... I mean... if he doesn't make it... what a waste that would be.

As far as Jaime is concerned... he has the potential to be the best big man we've seen since the 80's.


T


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There are also volumes of data that chronicle the fact that we have had at least one NBA player on our team each season since 12-13. We have maybe one fringe NBA player (and that's being generous) on the roster right now. Shoot, every starter from the 2011-2012 season is more talented than the player at their position this season. Every. Single. One.



If that's the case, then Gregg Marshall should be fired immediately.



Watch the Cincinnati games from last season and tell me if our guys were "soft" then. Was the team with Baker and FVV "soft" after losing to UNI 2/3 times in 15-16 or blowing a lead at ISUr that season? Also, give specific examples of failed leadership or a lack of effort.

I'm cool with having this discussion, but you haven't really refuted any of my points from my first post.

I'm pretty satisfied with my earlier statement but I'll throw you a couple more bones out of respect. I don't know if I will go much further though. I think I've hit my post limit for the month. I don't wanna have to pay Kung more money (he charges me by the post you know - the really nasty ones get expensive).

Gregg Marshall has never signed an NBA recruit. Every single NBA player that's come to WSU in the Marshall era was developed. I'll even be so bold as to say that every Shocker who has made it wouldn't have under most programs. So Gregg deserves a ton of credit for his ability to turn decent college players into pros. The guys with a little extra make it to the NBA. But people have still got to be shaking their heads over Fred; he's not quick, he can't jump, and he's short - goes undrafted and now he's one of the top sixth men in the league. He owes HCGM a tip of the hat at a minimum. Same with Landry; no way does he go first round under any other coach. The Marshall Way is a known quantity in the Association now and that should be a tremendous recruiting tool.

Tekele Cotton came to WSU with the ability to run, jump, and catch a ball. He was as raw as a player gets. But what nobody could have known was the fact that he was the finest grade of pottery clay available anywhere in the world. Gregg put his hands around that boy and formed him into a beast. The more you scream at Tekele the harder he plays and he seems to not have a ceiling on effort. Then you meet him in person and he's as gentle as a lamb. A special dude.

So in an attempt to tie things back to my original statement: Gregg Marshall recruits players who are moldable and who appear, due to parenting, to be able to take a lot of heat and pressure. He tells them to go 110% at all times and the rest will take care of itself. He also routinely signs "gambles" of which he hopes to be left with a few diamonds after some heavy polishing. Cle', Shaq, Frankamp, Glass, Chance, Hamilton, Reaves, Willis, Burton etc. were all gambles. So you've got your known quantities which appear on the onset as if they have limited upside and then you have your unknown quantities who appear to have solid (talent) upside but have a few screws loose or a history of injuries. I would say that Fred and Landry are about the only known quantities who also seemed to have a higher upside than the typical Marshall recruit. It's all about making diamonds out of coal with Gregg Marshall's Shockers.

There are a couple reasons we played well (very well) at times last year. As I already alluded to, we didn't lose Play Angry altogether, it came and went. We also displayed a very potent brand of offense which allowed us to just outscore our opponents. How many times did we beat a team last year while also giving up a high defensive field goal percentage? It was often and disturbing. All that needed to happen was for us to go cold and then it was buh bye. Teams that played like we did last year never go anywhere in the tournament. The Omaha BJ immediately comes to mind.

I don't know how we lost Play Angry basketball. I also don't know how much responsibility lies at the feet of the players versus the coaches. All I know is it left last year at varying times (sometimes at the worst possible time) and anybody who has watched the team closely since the start of the Marshall era could see that fact immediately. Ultimately, the responsibility lies with the coaching staff.

No, we didn't win every game while in the MVC. There were times when the opposition was unconscious and we couldn't throw it in the ocean all game long. Still, as a Shocker fan you'd always expect us to make a comeback no matter how far things went south. We weren't always pretty, we just never cracked. The 19 pt. comeback against SWOMO was Play Angry personified. Last year you could just watch us melt down and then wilt. It was as foreign to me as if we had changed our team name to The Fockers. I didn't even know who or what I was watching. Then you'd see all the assistant coaches on the bench with their thumbs up their asses. The final straw was watching Gregg do press conferences in a state of bewilderment and resignation. In previous years he'd come to the table seething, just begging for a reporter to say something slightly off. There were times last year when Gregg acted like a Beta. It might have had something to do with the off-court issues, or maybe even a personal health or emotional issue. He just wasn't the same salty ***** we all know and love. He's not this year either. Maybe he's practicing Buddhism now.


T


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