Fire Todd Butler

[DUShock]

It wasn't so much his wins/losses that were the driver but his off field shenanigans. @BOBB: and I have a similar recollection. Although the Shocks declining MVC performance was an issue, but secondary to his embarrassing behavior.

Go Shocks!

[1972Shocker]

Gene averaged 37-24 over his last 5 years with a record of 0-4 in NCAA regional games with both appearances auto-bids from winning the Valley Tournament. Yep, we would certainly take that over what we have gotten over the past 4 years.

What we don't know is what Gene's record would have been over the past 4 years. Maybe it would be far superior to HCTB's, maybe not. Clearly no way of knowing.

What we also don't know and probably will never know is exactly how Gene's termination went down. Was Gene simply summarily dumped with little to no disucssion? Was Gene approached with an offer to discuss a transition to a new coach and responded in perhaps a less than civil way? Were Gene's off the field antics that big of any issue or perhaps worse than what was made public? Did Gene take those issues seriously or tell his superiors it was none of their business?

Here is the bottom line. Gene is no longer the Coach at Wichita State and is not coming back. The relationship between Gene and Wichita State is unfortunatley very poor to nonexistent and may or may not be salvagable. Wichita State made a poor hire in replacing Gene and compounded it with a bad contract. Rehashing all of this and taking one side or the other perhaps makes for entertaining message board exchanges but unfortunately doesn't do anything to deal with getting Wichita State back on track. Hopefully, the current athletic administration understands that they have a problem with the baseball program that needs addressing and hopefully they have both the will and the wherewithal to do something about it.

[shockfan89_]

I agree with 1972 but I think it is VERY important to get Gene back involved. Regardless of what happened, Gene is a college baseball pioneer that was the face of Shocker baseball for 37 years and still lives in Wichita. Unless Gene is involved in the future I think there will continue to be a divide. We need to name the stadium for Gene, involve him in the next coaching search, and bring the Shocker family back together if we want to be successful in the future!

I laugh when I see things like Wichita State Baseball Legends Weekend advertised with no mention of Gene.

We also need to get those damn wins reinstated. Who was the f'ing idiot that agreed to let those be taken away?

[Aargh]

So if I'm Sheldon, and you were my Leonard.....where were you with the sign?

Please, please help me refrain from making a "here's your sign" joke. Please, please!

[1972Shocker]

I laugh when I see things like Wichita State Baseball Legends Weekend advertised with no mention of Gene.

Yeah, when I saw that I thought that could be a bit awkward to invite all these Shocker Legends back without having the builder and the leader of the program they played for and helped to build.

I like the idea, but perhaps it could have at least been deferred to a time when the program was on more solid footing and worthy of the legacy these guys built. this actually has the potential to be somewhat embarrassing. Hopefully, that won't be the case.

I think we should attempt to mend the relationship with Gene but just not sure it can be done unless one his protege's like Hoop or Mark is leading the program. And even then he might tell WSU to go jump in the lake. I am just not sure how toxic the relationship is? But it sure doesn't seem to be very good at all.

[shockfan89_]

I think we should attempt to mend the relationship with Gene but just not sure it can be done unless one his protege's like Hoop or Mark is leading the program. And even then he might tell WSU to go jump in the lake. I am just not sure how toxic the relationship is? But it sure doesn't seem to be very good at all.

You are probably right, but one sure way to find out is to approach him when you are ready to look for the next coach. Getting his input would seem like a smart way to 'bury the hatchet' and get input from someone who knows a little something about turning a program around. Floating out "Stephenson Baseball Complex" or "Stephenson Stadium" would probably go a long way towards mending the relationship.

[molly jabali]

You are probably right, but one sure way to find out is to approach him when you are ready to look for the next coach. Getting his input would seem like a smart way to 'bury the hatchet' and get input from someone who knows a little something about turning a program around. Floating out "Stephenson Baseball Complex" or "Stephenson Stadium" would probably go a long way towards mending the relationship.

I guess I'm in the camp of 'he brought part of this on himself'....I DO recognize his immense contributions, but it's pretty evident he undermined his own status with how he 'relationshipped' people.

But that's just me....btw, when was the last time a field/building was named after someone who had been fired?

[shockfan89_]

I agree he is also responsible, but the baseball program needs him now more than he needs us. We will never know the results if he would have stayed, but things are way worse than most ever thought possible. We need to eliminate this division and make all WSU baseball alumni feel comfortable coming back to campus and supporting the program they helped build.

Good point on naming a field/building after someone who has been fired. I guess another question would be has anyone that successful ever been fired?

[1972Shocker]

Good point on naming a field/building after someone who has been fired. I guess another question would be has anyone that successful ever been fired?

Joe Paterno.

[shockfan89_]

I thought of Paterno but I forgot he was fired before his retirement. If I am not mistaken they named the field after him.

[shockfan89_]

We are officially halfway through the season and though we have shown improvement in pitching and fielding, the offense has fallen so far that we are not a very good team.

Excluding OU's loss to us, the combined record of our opponents for the games we've won is 55-99 (.357 winning percentage).
Here is our record broken out by RPI:

             1-10 against RPI 1-99
             7-3 against 100-199
             6-0 against 200+

Of our 14 wins, most have been close games with 6 by one-run and 3 by two-runs.
Our average loss has been by 4.38 runs and we have lost 6 times by a margin of 5 or more runs.
We currently have a 112 RPI and are 12-4 at home and 2-9 on the road.
Our 28 remaining games have an average opponent RPI of 139.8 including 13 games of 200+ RPI teams.
We have 13 home games and 15 road games remaining.
We should finish 3rd or 4th in the 10th or 11th ranked MVC but will have a much better record in the MVC than last season.

My guess is that we will finish the season ~ 31-25. Overall this may be the worst possible outcome as we've shown improvement in our record but only against bad teams. We have won several games this season our bullpen would have blown last year, but there is also very little to get excited about for the future other than what PCMS has done with the pitching staff. I don't think there is much point in continuing the direction the baseball program is going, but I also doubt the AD will have any desire for a large buyout, or to search for a baseball coach given the huge undertaking of moving to a new conference.

[Cdizzle]

New AD. New conference.

Perfect recipe to bring back Gene.

[1972Shocker]

New AD. New conference.

Perfect recipe to bring back Gene.

New AD yes but not an oustider. DB was the Assistant Athletic Director when Gene was cut loose and Todd Butler hired. I have no idea how much ADDB may have been involved in that transition but I am not sure Gene will necessarily see him as new.

[molly jabali]

New AD. New conference.

Perfect recipe to bring back Gene.

I can't tell if this a serious thought.

Butler MAY be a disaster hire, but Gene was not the Gene of old....do you think?

[shoxlax]

Again to the disgruntled: Are you more upset about the firing of Gene or the hiring of Butler?

Were there that many people in disagreement with the firing at the time?