[Gm 2] WSU vs Dirt Bags

[1972Shocker]

It's going to hurt, but every day Gene leads this program will just make it that much harder to return to where we are supposed to be.

Perhaps Gene will be more open to retirement as this team seems to have achieved what Gene preaches about a lot in recent years. Consistency. You have to admit this team is pretty consistent and perhaps even predictable.

[tripleshock]

BRENT says YOU CONTROL THE WAY YOU THINK, don't be a negative nancy. Be positive. Otherwise, he won't invite you over to play Apples to Apples.

LOL. This coaching staff is anything but positive. Gene is probably one of the most negative people you'll ever meet.

[SB Shock]

LOL. This coaching staff is anything but positive. Gene is probably one of the most negative people you'll ever meet.

I think he was directing it at Shockernet.

[Shocker85]

I think he was directing it at Shockernet.

If that is the case, he needs to get off the computer and coach these guys. It doesn't take a 30 year baseball guy to see that the team doesn't have the moxie to win in college baseball in 2012. In days past, hitting behind a runner, taking the extra base, digging deep for that little extra on the fastball was the Shocker Way. Now, flailing at breaking balls, striking out with RISP, and throwing bad breaking balls in pitchers' counts is more the norm.

[Shocker85]

They can't hit their way out of a wet paper bag.

I've been describing Shocker hitting in exactly those terms to people over the last few seasons.

Kudos to KCShox as well for hitting the nail on the head.

Gene, JT and Brent must go.

[SB Shock]

If that is the case, he needs to get off the computer and coach these guys. It doesn't take a 30 year baseball guy to see that the team doesn't have the moxie to win in college baseball in 2012. In days past, hitting behind a runner, taking the extra base, digging deep for that little extra on the fastball was the Shocker Way. Now, flailing at breaking balls, striking out with RISP, and throwing bad breaking balls in pitchers' counts is more the norm.

What crazy is he started talking about how they were getting it going by winning of 11 of 13, which is against totally sub-par completion - they are delusional.

[ShockTalk]

Turn the corner where?

Pitching has pitched well enough to give us a chance to win. Our hitting has been atrocious the past 4 years, and pretty much the reason why we have been average at best.

Team batting average from 2001 - 2008 was .306
Team batting average from 2009 - 2012 was .282

Let's face it, we simply are not getting the skill position recruits we used to and it shows. We've stayed competitive in the pitching department simply because Kemnitz still draws those young high school pitchers who know he is one of the best in the business in college baseball.

I thought you were being very kind in your batting average comparison. The previous 10 years to 2001, the team never hit less than .311.

Team batting average from 1991-2000 was .326.

[tripleshock]

I feel that the results get a bit skewed when you start comparing the -5 bat years to -3 bats years.

[ShockTalk]

I feel that the results get a bit skewed when you start comparing the -5 bat years to -3 bats years.

The point is that in the 90's the Shocks had one of the better hitting teams in college ball. By the early 2000's, we had become an average to good hitting team compared to the field. Now we are no better than an average hitting team, maybe below.

I remember @SB Shock: had a graph at one time that indicated our fall compared to all the D-I teams. That takes the "bat" arguement out of play.

[SB Shock]

I feel that the results get a bit skewed when you start comparing the -5 bat years to -3 bats years.

Good hitters are still good hitters regardless of the bats.

[shox1989]

AJ Ladwig starting tomorrow?

[SPEShockAlum]

AJ Ladwig starting tomorrow?

That is what is projected.

[Shocker85]

I feel that the results get a bit skewed when you start comparing the -5 bat years to -3 bats years.

Everone uses the same bats, right?

While some continue to make excuses for the Shox performance, maybe someone can find the number to compare NCAA D1 BA for several periods. 1985-1990, 1991-1995, 1996-2000, 2001-2005, 2006-2010, 2011-present. Then pull the Shox BA numbers. I don't know where to find those sort of stats or I would do it. I have no doubt a comparision will reveal that the Shox have fallen behind the overall curve, perhaps by a lot.

[tripleshock]

bats

I don't think anyone has any doubt that this year's (and for the last several years) team(s) are underperforming hitting-wise compared to earlier Shocker teams, and also as compared to national averages.

The thing about the changes in bats (from -5 to -3) is.... that it does make somewhat of a difference when comparing statistics between the pre-change and post-change periods.

[KC Shox]

I don't think anyone has any doubt that this year's (and for the last several years) team(s) are underperforming hitting-wise compared to earlier Shocker teams, and also as compared to national averages.

The thing about the changes in bats (from -5 to -3) is.... that it does make somewhat of a difference when comparing statistics between the pre-change and post-change periods.

Sure it does, you're going to see less HR's and less metal bat Texas Leaguers falling in. But it won't explain away 20 point drops in team batting averages. Hitters still have to possess great eye-hand coordination to square up the ball. Our hitters lack that ability compared to teams of the good ole days. Again IMO, the players we bring in now are just not what we have been spoiled to seeing. It's not their fault, other programs just have better players than we do.

2009 - 2012 the Shox had 8,326 AB's and struck out 1,719 times. Once per 4.84 AB's. Average Base-On-Balls was 250.25 a year

2001 - 2008 the Shox had 19,015 AB's and struck out 3,326 times. Once per 5.72 AB's. Average Base-On-Balls was 294 a year

It's clear that we are striking out more and walking less and that has nothing to do with the new bats. Add that to some suspect defense and shoddy bullpen performances (which have been far less egregious to hitting), pretty much sums up the average mid-major product that has been pranced out on the field the past four years.

I'm not going to blame the coaches for not making the guys better hitters, I'm not going to blame the players for not being able to hit. There comes a time where a certain ballplayer reaches his max capability of performance. You can coach a player up until you're blue in the face and it just won't happen. Gene and company, I'm certain, have not packed it in and still want to be winners and are out there everyday trying to coach up the players.

The true problem is what Gene and company are doing to adjust their recruiting practices to entice the better ball players to come to WSU in this day of age. We no longer are getting players who want to come to WSU to play for the best. They're now getting love from BCS programs and that is a hard influence to ignore. Again, my question is Gene and company doing all that is possible under the sun to recruit, or is their old age or lack of adjustment to recruit in this day of age affecting recruiting.