An alternative to Firing Gene Stephenson...

[SB Shock]

Here is a simple solution for not having to fire Gene Stephenson:

Gene Stephenson somehow motivating this team to play over their head and somehow find a way to get back to CWS. That will shut all the critics up.

[GoShockers89]

Yes, that solution sounds good to me.

[shocker3]

Here's why I am calling BS on the requirement of a certain amount of Kansas players.

Only 11 scholarships are allowed in college baseball. As most know, few players, if any, get anything close to a full ride.

In-state tutition and fees per year, based on 15 hours: $5,890

Out-of-state tuition and fees per year, based on 15 hrs: $13,924

The difference per year b/t all 11 scholarships being in-state vs. out of state is $88,374. Obviously, there is a mix.

ABC I can guarantee you that Belnap put the 1/3 of scholarship players from Kansas in Gene's contract.

It happened at a time when Belnap was trying to slash budgets. Gene's budget at the time (not including salaries or scholarships) was $70,000 (basically operations and recruiting). Belnap was trying to cut it greatly and tried to get rid of Cub (Gene's AA) and cut the baseball secretary to part time. He was also wanting to no longer fully fund the 11.7 scholarships for baseball to save money (previous to that time there was a period when WSU wasn't fully funding all baseball scholarships).

Gene almost left over the budget fights. The fight was actually pretty public.

In the end, they agreed to allow Gene to start the Battery club to fund his own budget. They also agreed to allow him to keep Cub if he funded him from private sources. Belnap agreed to keep Gene's budget at $70,000 and to fund the full 11.7 scholarships.

In return Gene agreed to raise the money (battery fund and all american club), agreed to recruit at least 1/3 of the scholarship players from Kansas and also agreed to schedule at least 1/4 of the non-conference games against teams that were ranked during the previous two seasons.

I know these provisions were added to Gene's contract by Belnap in 1994.

I don't know if they are still in there or not, but I have not heard of any changes to those provisions and I am pretty close to the program.

Gene's contracts are public information, so I am sure someone who knows how to find these things can find those 1994 contract changes. I am not computer savvy enough to find those kind of things, but I know there are some on shockernet who can. My memory though on these sort of things is still pretty sharp.

I know the money amount seems relatively small but up until that provision was added to Gene's contract it was a real struggle for him to get the university to fund the full 11.7 scholarships each year.

[ABC]

1994 is 17 years ago. That's a long time.

Until someone shows me the current contract with these provisions, I ain't buying it.

[DwShock]

Not sure if this is what you want but look on this page for Kansas Employee Contracts.

http://www.kansasopengov.org/StateGovernment/Contracts/tabid/1262/Default.aspx

[shockfan89_]

I'm no lawyer but I don't see anything in any of the amendments that removed the 1/3 rule added in 1994. I would assume from this contact that it still applies unless I missed it somewhere.

[1972Shocker]

I'm no lawyer but I don't see anything in any of the amendments that removed the 1/3 rule added in 1994. I would assume from this contact that it still applies unless I missed it somewhere.

Yeah, looks that way to me also. This provision may have been easier to deal with in the days you could pretty much carve up your scholarship money in any way you wanted. However, I believe the NCAA now requires a miniumum of a 1/4 scholarship (although I could b e wrong about that.)

The current contract runs through June 30, 2014. Gene will be 68 at that point and, hopefully, he will be ready to turn the reigns over at that point (if not sooner).

Based on what Gene has done for Wichita State baseball I, for one, can live with another 3 years of Gene. I think Gene has earned the right to complete the current contract term if he wishes. Hopefully, he will announce in advance that the 2014 season will be his last.

I do not think it is in the best interest of Wichita State to extend this contract beyond that season, although a run to the CWS between now and then might change my mind. And then again it might not.

At that point the stadium should probably be renamed in Gene's honor if possible.

[Kung Wu]

Page 26 of this document has the clause (Addendum 3.C - Financial Aid):

http://www.kansasopengov.org/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=s0rGbnYVdxE%3d&tabid=1262&mid=2438

It appears to me that collectively 1/3rd of players receiving financial aid in a year have to be from Kansas.

- It doesn't say 1/3rd of the recruits in a single year have to come from Kansas.
- It also doesn't say that the Kansas students have to have full rides, or consist of 1/3 of the total financial aid -- just that 1/3rd of those receiving aid come from Kansas.

I also don't see where that was changed. In fact each agreement thereafter specifically leaves the 1994/1997 agreements in tact.

[1972Shocker]

Found the following:

Starting in 2009-10, only 27 players can receive financial aid, each of whom must receive at least one-third of a full scholarship.

If this is accurate than 9 of our roster players must be from Kansas and must receive one-third scholarships. Since that represents one-third of the number of players that can receive financial aid then our home-grown players will be getting one-third of the financial aid at a minimum.

This was not necessarily the case when the 1994 contract provision was added.

Whether or not this is causing Gene and Brent a lot of grief I can not say. I have not heard either of them complain about it, but that doesn't mean it is not an issue.

[SHOCKvalue]

Not sure if this is what you want but look on this page for Kansas Employee Contracts.

http://www.kansasopengov.org/StateGo...2/Default.aspx

Thanks for the link. The financial nerds around here (which includes me) will find that very useful.

3G's contract has yet to be updated on that site, BTW for anyone wondering.

[ShockTalk]

Found the following:

Starting in 2009-10, only 27 players can receive financial aid, each of whom must receive at least one-third of a full scholarship.

If this is accurate than 9 of our roster players must be from Kansas and must receive one-third scholarships. Since that represents one-third of the number of players that can receive financial aid then our home-grown players will be getting one-third of the financial aid at a minimum.

This was not necessarily the case when the 1994 contract provision was added.

Whether or not this is causing Gene and Brent a lot of grief I can not say. I have not heard either of them complain about it, but that doesn't mean it is not an issue.

Even though only 27 players can have scholarships and each must be at least 1/3 of a scholarship, there are 35 one-third scholarships available with 11.7 total scholarships. Nine KS players might only use up 3 of the total 11.7 available or about 25% of the total. The other out of state players could divide up the remaining 8.7 scholarships.

[1972Shocker]

True dat, ShockTalk. I didn't think that all the way through.

[shox1989]

Page 26 of this document has the clause (Addendum 3.C - Financial Aid):

http://www.kansasopengov.org/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=s0rGbnYVdxE%3d&tabid=1262&mid=2438

It appears to me that collectively 1/3rd of players receiving financial aid in a year have to be from Kansas.

- It doesn't say 1/3rd of the recruits in a single year have to come from Kansas.
- It also doesn't say that the Kansas students have to have full rides, or consist of 1/3 of the total financial aid -- just that 1/3rd of those receiving aid come from Kansas.

I also don't see where that was changed. In fact each agreement thereafter specifically leaves the 1994/1997 agreements in tact.

Seeing the date on those contract changes really struck me- July, 1994.

That is the same contract that also required Gene to basically raise his own budget.

I don't know if it is just a coincidence but the last time we went to Omaha was 1996. I really have to wonder if those additional resposibilites and restrictions have helped keep us from getting to Omaha.

[tripleshock]

from WSU schedule of fees:

Undergraduate Student Tuition: In-State / Out-of-State / International

Regular Semester (Per Credit Hour) $157.40 / $425.20 / $448.90

------

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but according to the above information, players recruited from outside of Kansas
are substantially more expensive (by a factor of 2.7) than their in-state counterparts.

So, if that is the case, how is it a bad thing to require more in-state recruiting?

Seems like it would be an advantage to recruit more in-staters and thus leave more money available to be used for the out-of-staters, wouldn't it?

[shockfan89_]

from WSU schedule of fees:

Undergraduate Student Tuition: In-State / Out-of-State / International

Regular Semester (Per Credit Hour) $157.40 / $425.20 / $448.90

------

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but according to the above information, players recruited from outside of Kansas
are substantially more expensive (by a factor of 2.7) than their in-state counterparts.

So, if that is the case, how is it a bad thing to require more in-state recruiting?

Seems like it would be an advantage to recruit more in-staters and thus leave more money available to be used for the out-of-staters, wouldn't it?

It would be best to use the scholarship money for the best players regardless of where they come from. Think of the amount of time our coaching staff has to invest to make sure this is met year to year.

It is much harder to get a kid from out of state to play baseball than it is in any other sport because of the scholarship limits. Most of these guys are paying 2/3 of the cost themselves (not like basketball and football where everyone has full scholarships). The out of state students pretty much have to have families that can afford to pay the additional cost (almost 3 times what it would cost for them to play at OU or OSU if they are from Oklahoma). It will basically cost an out of state player twice as much to come to WSU with a 1/3 scholarship than it would to go to a school in their own state with NO scholarship. Obviously OK turns out more quality high school players than KS does.

I believe this is what GS meant when he commented that it will be much easier to recruit at OU than at WSU. It has much more to do with finances (and finances of the athletes family) than it has to do with effort the coaching staff puts in to recruiting. Given this fact I would much rather be coaching in a warm weather state that produces a lot of quality athletes. If baseball would have 20 or 25 full scholarships it would greatly reduce this inequity. Right now a scholarship for an out of state player is basically a joke as far as a financial incentive to play baseball.