American Athletic Conference

[pogo]

ESPN has the cache if you will. It has become synonymous with sports. It has built its brand and its tough when you're a distant #2.

[mulligan]

The more I think about it the more I say we sit tight in the MVC. The power four conferences are far from done. With the new football playoff system and the Big 12 not having a championship game, I would think Texas and OU will become unsettled if they are snubbed. Big 12 teams will have to run the table for a shot at a spot. If OU and Texas bolt then teams will be looking to join or form a new conference.

[shox1989]

How do our ESPN2 viewership compare to the A-10 viewership? If we don't know, VCU v. LaSalle is on this week. We can compare apples to apples.

Also, I wonder what the viewership is for our Cox 22 games? Think it is more than 50,000?

We shouldn't throw stones at teams getting paid twice as much as we are for games on channels that EVERYONE across the COULD watch, and as we continue to build our brand, the viewers will come... if they can see us.

First of all not everyone can get those channels: ESPN2 is available in 98 million homes, ESPNU in 75 million homes, NBCSN in 77 million homes, FS1 in 85 million, FS2 in 38 million and CBSSN in 48 million. NBCSN is closer in reach to espnU then espn2 and CBSSN in far fewer than either. http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/201...t-2013/199072/

Second even though many millions can get them they are not drawing viewers. CBSSN has been around since 2002. Since 2008 they have included CBS in the name and it still hasn't helped. Their ratings have gotten so bad that they no longer contract with Nielsen to even record ratings (they were tired of all of the 0s). NBCSN has only been officially around since January, 2012 but that channel has been a sports channel for many years (it was previously called VERSUS). So far NBCSN is doing worse than VERSUS used to. And finally FOX replaced the SPEED channel with FS1. On most weeks, FS1 is doing worse than the SPEED channel did for the same time period last year. About the only thing that is drawing decent numbers at all on FS1 is UFC. I am not sure how long FOX is going to continue to promote a channel that appears to be going nowhere in the ratings. I could see them pretty much dropping basketball and all of their poorly viewed talk and sports news shows with a 24 hour a day UFC type channel.

I didn't know how the A-10 has done on their few espn2 and espnU appearances so I looked them up to answer your question. And for the most part, I was surprised at how low even their espn family ratings are. Here are all of the ratings I could find for any A-10 games on espn/espn2/espnU: 1/11- SLU-Dayton on espn2: 201,000 (the only SLU game on espn2 so far this year and one of only 4 that they have scheduled for espn2 this year and the first of only 2 games that Dayton will have on espn2). 12/30- SLU-Vanderbilt on espnU: 169,000 (the only time SLU will appear on espnU this year). 12/14- VCU-UNI on espnU: 142,000. 11/24- UMass-Clemson on espn2: 162,000 (one of only 2 appearance that UMass will have on espn2 all year)/ 11/22- UMass-New Mexico on espnU: 54,000 (one of only 2 appearances that UMass will have on espnU this year). 11/12- UMass-LSU on espn2: 174,000 (the other of the only 2 appearances that UMass will have on espn2 this year). 11/12- VCU-Virginia on espn2: 554,000 (the only time VCU has appeared so far on espn2 and by far the highest rated A-10 game this year). http://sonofthebronx.blogspot.com/20...ratings_8.html

For the most part the Shockers TV ratings (as I have reported earilier) are better for their 4 espn2 appearances so far and their one espnU appearance so far (espn 2 games: 562,000, 502,000, 362,000 and 265,000-the midnight game and 157,000 for the espnU game). WSU should have 2 more games on espn2 this year and at least one more on espnU. I have no idea what the ratings for the games on Cox are. They may not be 50,000 (although they could be considering it is state-wide and there are a lot of Shocker fans these days) but they are probably much better than the ratings the A-10 games are getting on CBS sports net. I do think the WSU games on the MVC-TV are probably close to 50,000 mark.

[need_a_rival]

Hello Shox fans -- Bluejay fan here, and I come in peace. :) Love your team this year: Baker, VanFleet, Cotton, and Early are all studs. I thought you would experience a drop-off with the loss of Armstead and Hall, but instead your team is even better. You guys really need to find a better conference than the MVC...it's clear that the gap between you and the rest of the league is even exceeding what Memphis was to the rest of the CUSA. My hope is that the Big East will drop the "private school" philosophy and add VCU and WSU. Form two divisions (Midwest and East), with CU, WSU, Marquette, Xavier, Depaul, and Butler in one division. That would make for some terrific basketball!

[ISASO]

WSU has no rival either, at this point. Why wouldn't a conference want a school that just went to consecutive Final Four's?

[shox1989]

I'd put it at more like 80%+. The size of the ticket blocks is not reflective of the total attendees for a school- so many folks buy at the window or from scalpers that there's no way to gauge it based on pre-sales for schools like WSU and Creighton. For the Sunday game alone, I would say at least an extra 1,500+ fans came down from Omaha and about 1,000 from Wichita. Almost none of those folks had seats in the team blocks.

On the other end of the spectrum, there is zero chance Evansville brought even a hundred fans. I bet we can count the number of non-player relatives in attendance for Loyola at St. Louis on one hand.


Using last year's attendance figures is disingenuous at best for what the event will draw going forward. If the MVC loses WSU, Arch Madness would be lucky to break 3,000/game.

My wife and I have gone to Arch Madness a few times and we have never sat in the Shocker block.

[Rlh04d]

My concern is that the added travel costs for our sports would far exceed the additional $350,000 in TV revenue. Being a baseball fan, I also have a lot of concerns about what a move to the A-10 would do for baseball.

Also have to factor in NCAA tournament credits. Essentially, the MVC will be getting the NCAA credits we give them for the foreseeable future, with an outside shot that MoSt or UNI could make a run in the next few years.

If we're in a conference that will get multiple NCAA tournament bids, that would result in more NCAA credits that we can hope to get in the MVC.

Also, I think the A-10 have made their bed, and they want to be on the east coast exclusively.

[Rlh04d]

I know my opinion on this will not be popular with many, but I'm going to say it anyway. First, let me say that I am not a proponent of staying in the MVC. Frankly, I think that WSU has outgrown the Valley and not only in Men's basketball, but most sports. Budget wise and performance wise the other Valley schools cannot match us. In the past the AAC appealed to me. The geographic proximity of the schools (Tulsa, SMU, Houston and Cincy) appeals to me very much, and I used to be very hopeful that we could move to that conference. However, as I have thought this through I think it could potentially be harmful to WSU to be the only non-football member of a football conference whether it's the AAC, MWC, or anyother conference. For most of these schools their football program is the highest priority, and they are going to vote for, and do things that put their football programs in the greatest position EVEN IF that means it is somewhat detrimental to their basketball programs. We don't have to look any further than what happened to the old Big East to know that is what takes place. The football schools voted in members with the better football programs even if it meant that their conference RPI took a hit in basketball. Football was (and is) first for these schools.

To me we need to be in a conference that has schools that are like minded with WSU meaning that we need to be affilliated with schools where basketball is KING. Unfortunately the new Big East only looks like they are going to allow private institutions as conference members. In my opinion the best option for us is the A10. The A10 is respected by the members of the East Coast and national media. It is a better conference for RPI, SOS and multiple bids to the tournament. Just like Creighton has the challenge of travel for its non-revenue sports, so we would have these challenges in the A10 (we would also have this challenge at least in the MWC).

OK, go ahead and hurl your bricks and stones at me. I know that I can take it.

And I know my opinion on this probably won't be popular, but we simply don't have the ability to be picky.

Is basketball even king in the MVC anymore? It seems like most MVC schools are placing increasing emphasis on DII football in the hope of finally moving up. How many MVC schools do we truly think have a commitment to basketball long-term?

MWC and AAC ... basketball will never be king. The major conferences, also, never going to be an option.

A-10 and the Big East are the only two conferences that will meet your description. The A-10 is expanding east and likely losing their only western members, in which case I can't see them as an option. The Big East doesn't seem like it wants to go for non-Catholic schools.

There simply isn't a conference that exists that is an option for us and meets your description. Including the one we're in. I don't think a perfect situation will ever exist for us. We're a large, public university in a geographically sparse region of the country with no football and excellent basketball. There aren't more than a few schools that meet that description, if any others.

[Shock Therapy]

My hope is that the Big East will drop the "private school" philosophy and add VCU and WSU. Form two divisions (Midwest and East), with CU, WSU, Marquette, Xavier, Depaul, and Butler in one division. That would make for some terrific basketball!

I couldn't agree more. Getting to be in the same conference as both Creighton and VCU would be great! The rest of the top half of the big east would just be the icing on the cake.

[1979Shocker]

If Wichita State left the MVC, that would be one less school making the NCAA Tournament that would normally make it if WSU just stayed put, assuming the MVC remains a one-bid conference. So WSU would still get their bid, and now a team from what is left of the MVC would get an automatic bid, leaving some other team without a bid.

[UofMemphis]

And I know my opinion on this probably won't be popular, but we simply don't have the ability to be picky.

Is basketball even king in the MVC anymore? It seems like most MVC schools are placing increasing emphasis on DII football in the hope of finally moving up. How many MVC schools do we truly think have a commitment to basketball long-term?

MWC and AAC ... basketball will never be king. The major conferences, also, never going to be an option.

A-10 and the Big East are the only two conferences that will meet your description. The A-10 is expanding east and likely losing their only western members, in which case I can't see them as an option. The Big East doesn't seem like it wants to go for non-Catholic schools.

There simply isn't a conference that exists that is an option for us and meets your description. Including the one we're in. I don't think a perfect situation will ever exist for us. We're a large, public university in a geographically sparse region of the country with no football and excellent basketball. There aren't more than a few schools that meet that description, if any others.

football will always be important because of the money involved...but men's basketball...women's basketball, baseball...all very important for the AAC...coming from CUSA the AACs ESPN exposure is great.

[ICTShockerFan]

football will always be important because of the money involved...but men's basketball...women's basketball, baseball...all very important for the AAC...coming from CUSA the AACs ESPN exposure is great.

So in your opinion do we have a realistic shot of an invite to the AAC. I would be thrilled if that where to happen.

[UofMemphis]

So in your opinion do we have a realistic shot of an invite to the AAC. I would be thrilled if that where to happen.

As of now, no...when Navy joins for football only (2015) I think you will see a big push to add 1 Olympic sports member to offset them.

But Navy could technically back out at anytime since they're an Indy...that's why I don't think there would be any movement until Navy is actually playing games as an AAC member.

[Play Angry]

But Navy could technically back out at anytime since they're an Indy...that's why I don't think there would be any movement until Navy is actually playing games as an AAC member.

Interesting. I'd figured this offseason would be when the wheels would turn for adding the olympic sports member, with membership set to be official in 2015-16 (like Davidson with the A-10 last offseason). I hadn't given much thought to Navy backing out.

Is there reason for concern that Navy won't actually arrive? Or is it just as you say, they have flexibility as an independent and face minimal repercussions if they change their mind?

[UofMemphis]

Interesting. I'd figured this offseason would be when the wheels would turn for adding the olympic sports member, with membership set to be official in 2015-16 (like Davidson with the A-10 last offseason). I hadn't given much thought to Navy backing out.

Is there reason for concern that Navy won't actually arrive? Or is it just as you say, they have flexibility as an independent and face minimal repercussions if they change their mind?

Just that they could...no indications they want to...but if we added an Olympic sports member now and Navy backed out...it would put the AAC in an odd situation.

The AAC is pretty much a brand new conference...so "play it safe" is the mantra...I would think 2017 would be the earliest WSU could realistically join.

UConn, Cincy, Memphis, Temple, Tulsa, SMU, WSU, etc sure would be a lot of fun...and a VERY good conference