State of Kansas Finances

[wu_shizzle]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/k...-year-40060847

I thought there was a requirement for a balanced budget. Evidently not if you are borrowing money from the bank of KDOT and pension plans to get us through until June 2017. Is this a ploy to destroy/default government pension plans?

This doesn't seem to be any different than how Kathleen Sebelius ran things.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

A bigger load of bullshit has never been spewed.

I actually enjoy the conversation from out of staters, but MVJ is correct. When "I usually stay out" is really "I'm a major participant", there is some real doubt cast on why I should listen to anything else that person says.

Shocka, just come clean, admit you were full of poo on that one, and maybe, just maybe, we can let it go.

[shockmonster]

This doesn't seem to be any different than how Kathleen Sebelius ran things.

Now your defense of the current governor and legislature is that the Republicans are no worse than the Democrats. You sound like Hillary going after Trump. That's just weak.

[shocka khan]

I actually enjoy the conversation from out of staters, but MVJ is correct. When "I usually stay out" is really "I'm a major participant", there is some real doubt cast on why I should listen to anything else that person says.

Shocka, just come clean, admit you were full of poo on that one, and maybe, just maybe, we can let it go.

I don't pay any attention to what Troll Valley John says. It's sort of like the relationship you have with Kung on this board.

So are you taking sides?

And actually I did not know what was going on, except from a distance. I have seen numerous articles predicting that the path that Brownback has blazed is going to lead to fiscal carnage for Kansas, much as what Bobby Jindal did to Louisiana. I am much more up on what's going on there, and I can tell you it is a train wreck. And unlike Troll, I actually grew up in Kansas, so I am interested in what is going on there.

This is the article I came across:

http://www.thekansan.com/news/20160614/possible-school-shutdown-decades-in-making

Here is the gist of the article, note that it goes on for a number of pages.....

“"I hope (the threat) is not real at all, but at the same time, it is realer than it has ever been,” said superintendent Deb Hamm. “ … The stars aligned. This is where we ended up. We have a tax policy, the belief that schools need to be reformed, that we are spending too much money.”

That leaves the state Legislature without a constitutional way to disperse funds to schools, or to levy taxes to support them. The court gave the Legislature a deadline of June 30 to fix the formula. If that fix is not found, schools may have to close down.

“I think were closer to jumping this time than we have been in 30 years,” said John Robb, a Newton attorney who has been part of lawsuits against the state for decades. “It has to do with the political makeup, ideologies and extremism in Topeka.”

That political makeup is also what concerns Hamm.

“We got here through a series of events, not just in our state, but our country with people feeling like they are paying too much and there is government waste,” Hamm said. “There is the perspective that we need to cut back and there are inefficiencies. There may be legitimate examples of that, I also would hold that there are far fewer and far less inefficiencies as some believe. We are paying the price for that belief system.”

Schools have been in court for for decades, and have won 13 decisions while losing none in the last 10 years. More than 50 judges have reviewed lawsuits by schools against the legislature leading up to a February decision this year that set the deadlines for this year."

So Troll can troll all he wants to. It won't make any difference to me. And you can even help him Jamar. I think I'm asking a legitimate question, we'll see if this is some public official getting hysterical, a statistical outlier or something else.

It is still a reasonable question. As of this morning, I have not seen anyone state that their school district has put together a contingency plan to put in place if the legislature doesn't act, so I'm guessing that this example is an isolated instance, not a trend.

[MoValley John]

I don't pay any attention to what Troll Valley John says. It's sort of like the relationship you have with Kung on this board.

So are you taking sides?

And actually I did not know what was going on, except from a distance. I have seen numerous articles predicting that the path that Brownback has blazed is going to lead to fiscal carnage for Kansas, much as what Bobby Jindal did to Louisiana. I am much more up on what's going on there, and I can tell you it is a train wreck. And unlike Troll, I actually grew up in Kansas, so I am interested in what is going on there.

This is the article I came across:

http://www.thekansan.com/news/20160614/possible-school-shutdown-decades-in-making

Here is the gist of the article, note that it goes on for a number of pages.....

“"I hope (the threat) is not real at all, but at the same time, it is realer than it has ever been,” said superintendent Deb Hamm. “ … The stars aligned. This is where we ended up. We have a tax policy, the belief that schools need to be reformed, that we are spending too much money.”

That leaves the state Legislature without a constitutional way to disperse funds to schools, or to levy taxes to support them. The court gave the Legislature a deadline of June 30 to fix the formula. If that fix is not found, schools may have to close down.

“I think were closer to jumping this time than we have been in 30 years,” said John Robb, a Newton attorney who has been part of lawsuits against the state for decades. “It has to do with the political makeup, ideologies and extremism in Topeka.”

That political makeup is also what concerns Hamm.

“We got here through a series of events, not just in our state, but our country with people feeling like they are paying too much and there is government waste,” Hamm said. “There is the perspective that we need to cut back and there are inefficiencies. There may be legitimate examples of that, I also would hold that there are far fewer and far less inefficiencies as some believe. We are paying the price for that belief system.”

Schools have been in court for for decades, and have won 13 decisions while losing none in the last 10 years. More than 50 judges have reviewed lawsuits by schools against the legislature leading up to a February decision this year that set the deadlines for this year."

So Troll can troll all he wants to. It won't make any difference to me. And you can even help him Jamar. I think I'm asking a legitimate question, we'll see if this is some public official getting hysterical, a statistical outlier or something else.

It is still a reasonable question. As of this morning, I have not seen anyone state that their school district has put together a contingency plan to put in place if the legislature doesn't act, so I'm guessing that this example is an isolated instance, not a trend.

We can't bust heads like we used to, but we have our ways. One trick is to tell 'em stories that don't go anywhere - like the time I caught the ferry over to Shelbyville. I needed a new heel for my shoe, so, I decided to go to Morganville, which is what they called Shelbyville in those days. So I tied an onion to my belt, which was the style at the time. Now, to take the ferry cost a nickel, and in those days, nickels had pictures of bumblebees on 'em.*Give me five bees for a quarter,*you'd say.

Now where were we? Oh yeah: the important thing was I had an onion on my belt, which was the style at the time. They didn't have white onions because of the war. The only thing you could get was those big yellow ones...

[Aargh]

I believe most school districts have set up contingency plans in case schools are shut down.

[Jamar Howard 4 President]

It is still a reasonable question. As of this morning, I have not seen anyone state that their school district has put together a contingency plan to put in place if the legislature doesn't act, so I'm guessing that this example is an isolated instance, not a trend.

Yes, a reasonable question. I don't know the answer and indeed would be interested to hear from anyone who does.

But that's not the point. You got called out for a totally contradictory statement. It would be a big nothing if you just said "yep, that first statement was dumb" and we would have moved on. The fact you are trying to stand by everything you've said gives me little reason to trust your judgment on anything else.

[MoValley John]

Yes, a reasonable question. I don't know the answer and indeed would be interested to hear from anyone who does.

But that's not the point. You got called out for a totally contradictory statement. It would be a big nothing if you just said "yep, that first statement was dumb" and we would have moved on.

Exactly. If Shocka would simply say that he does like to discuss Kansas politics, great! But he makes some jackass comment about trying to stay out of these discussions, all the while, he's made a sport of trashing Brownback, well that's bullshit. If Shocka would simply take back that one comment, by all means, I'd never quote that post again.

That said, when a man claims to stay out of stuff, all the while miring himself in it, I call bullshit.

[shocka khan]

Yes, a reasonable question. I don't know the answer and indeed would be interested to hear from anyone who does.

But that's not the point. You got called out for a totally contradictory statement. It would be a big nothing if you just said "yep, that first statement was dumb" and we would have moved on. The fact you are trying to stand by everything you've said gives me little reason to trust your judgment on anything else.

I've posted on this thread maybe 5 or 6 times. I don't think I've posted anywhere on this specific thread stating 'I usually don't comment'. You are welcome to look through the now 6 pages and correct me if I'm wrong. Any specific reference any troll made that was outside this specific thread has no relevance to the subject discussed. I think the Troll has yanked your chain and you fell for it. Are you that simple-minded?

Perhaps you need to be ignored as well. It might save me some time by not having to explain inaccurate statements made by others with an intent to deceive (which you have obviously relied on).

[jdshock]

I've posted on this thread maybe 5 or 6 times. I don't think I've posted anywhere on this specific thread stating 'I usually don't comment'. You are welcome to look through the now 6 pages and correct me if I'm wrong. Any specific reference any troll made that was outside this specific thread has no relevance to the subject discussed. I think the Troll has yanked your chain and you fell for it. Are you that simple-minded?

Perhaps you need to be ignored as well. It might save me some time by not having to explain inaccurate statements made by others with an intent to deceive (which you have obviously relied on).

In post 85 you said you tend to stay out of Kansas discussions.

This comment totally misses the point that the legislature approved the cuts to school funding to accommodate Brownback's tax plan. Those cuts are the root cause the education budget and the general fund are 10's of millions of dollars short, not 'social services over-stepping their bounds (sic)'. If you disagree with me, please provide evidence that demand for these 'social services' has increased since the tax cut.

Try being a little more objective next time. I try to stay out of these 'Kansas' discussions as I do not have contexting (neither myself or anyone in my family lives there anymore), but in this case you are so far off base as to how this happened that I felt compelled to comment.

I will say that my general observation on this whole topic is that Brownback appears to have done what Bobby Jindal did - wreck the entire economy of a state based on rich people kvetching they're paying too much in taxes.

[shocka khan]

By the way, Jamar, and just so you know, I did, at one time, make a comment regarding the structure of property taxes in Kansas and was rather quickly corrected by a number of other posters. The lesson I took away from that was that I should be a little more careful commenting on complex local matters (such as tax structures) because the design of those structures can differ from state to state and even municipality to municipality if laws allow for the deviation. That's why I made the comment (on another thread) that some troll copied and pasted over here, that I don't usually comment on such matters.

So that's where the comment came from. From an old, bored troll who didn't go to Wichita State (and didn't live in Wichita) and has a chip on his shoulder. One who is friends with the Doc and has decided (with him) that his goal in life is to harass me into leaving the board, which I'm obviously not doing.

Said troll and his traveling friends were put on ignore and will be until further notice.

My apologies to the rest of you for posting these off-thread remarks.

[MoValley John]

Your comment was on THIS thread. Not another thread, this one. Just say that you do like to, and will continue to post on these threads, and everything is fine.

Oh, and I don't want you to leave this board, I just want you to post honestly.

[shocka khan]

In post 85 you said you tend to stay out of Kansas discussions.

OK. I looked through the posts and did not see where I made that remark, but I obviously did. My apologies to you, Jamar and the rest of the board for my oversight.

As far as my opinion goes, I reserve the right to change my mind about making comments on this topic. It's obvious that Brownback has really dug a deep hole for the state, since that remark was made based on Aargh's post yesterday regarding the state budget. It has also come to light (at least to me) since I made that statement regarding Brownback's attempt to intimidate the judiciary. That also changed my mind.

Our democracy can't work effectively with a governor who oversteps his political bounds to intimidate people into following his 'plan'.

I like Sam Brownback about as much as I like Hillary Clinton, but I have a right to that opinion and I will keep posting here.

[WuDrWu]

I can see reasons for parents to send their kids to private schools. However, if I did this, it would be for their opportunity to attend church and be educated in a Christian setting. Kids of parents who care and who pay attention to what is happening with their children, have children who are almost always successful in public school. The public schools and their teachers are not the problem imo.

I would have a hard time disagreeing more.

There are discipline issues at public schools that A) often never occur at private schools and B) when they do, they are met with an entirely different form of punishment.

I'll concede that good and bad teachers are at both public and private schools, but the bureaucracy of the public schools, mostly the unions, are a huge problem.


You can argue that kids and parental involvement are at the genesis of the differences, and yes that is true. but the way they are managed cuts deep.

[MoValley John]

I would have a hard time disagreeing more.

There are discipline issues at public schools that A) often never occur at private schools and B) when they do, they are met with an entirely different form of punishment.

I'll concede that good and bad teachers are at both public and private schools, but the bureaucracy of the public schools, mostly the unions, are a huge problem.


You can argue that kids and parental involvement are at the genesis of the differences, and yes that is true. but the way they are managed cuts deep.

Having kids in both public and private schools, I have an idea of the difference between public and private schools. Quite simply, it's one word: expectations. You are expected to behave in the private setting, you are expected to do your homework in the private setting, you are expected to be polite in the private setting and you are expected to learn in the private setting.

In my experience, the public schools replace the word expectations with the word hope.

And that is exactly why a child can get a phenomenal education in the public setting, while at the same time, the kid that sits next to him simply passes through.