Trump

[SB Shock]

I am surprised at the shot in the arm from Trump's election though.

I think it less about trump but just getting a socialist adminstration out of the way.

[CBB_Fan]

I think it less about trump but just getting a socialist adminstration out of the way.

so·cial·ismˈsōSHəˌlizəm
noun
a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

Socialism has a definition and it is not "big government," "government programs," "leftist," "regulations," or "welfare." If you want to redefine it as any of the above then Trump's government is still just as socialistic as Obama's.

We still have massive government, we still have onerous regulations, we still have pork projects, we still have welfare. Trump has signed very few executive orders and bills that affect the economy, and none of significantly change the nature of government.

It may seem pedantic, but words have meanings. Using the broad definition of socialism, EVERY government successful or unsuccessful for the past century was socialist. It paints Reagan under the same brush as FDR. But socialism isn't a sliding scale. It is a single bad idea, the total abolishment of private property and the capitalist economy, and we shouldn't confuse it for anything else.

[Kung Wu]

Socialism has a definition and it is not "big government," "government programs," "leftist," "regulations," or "welfare." If you want to redefine it as any of the above then Trump's government is still just as socialistic as Obama's.

We still have massive government, we still have onerous regulations, we still have pork projects, we still have welfare. Trump has signed very few executive orders and bills that affect the economy, and none of significantly change the nature of government.

It may seem pedantic, but words have meanings. Using the broad definition of socialism, EVERY government successful or unsuccessful for the past century was socialist. It paints Reagan under the same brush as FDR. But socialism isn't a sliding scale. It is a single bad idea, the total abolishment of private property and the capitalist economy, and we shouldn't confuse it for anything else.

tan·gent
/ˈtanjənt/

noun: tangent; plural noun: tangents

2. a completely different line of thought or action.

• "he quickly went off on a tangent about big government"

[CBB_Fan]

tan·gent
/ˈtanjənt/

noun: tangent; plural noun: tangents

2. a completely different line of thought or action.

• "he quickly went off on a tangent about big government"

In what world is "Obama was a socialist" tangential to "not under any reasonable definition?"

There was subtext underneath that (and it wasn't necessarily defending Obama), but the basic argument was directly related.

[ShockerPrez]

Socialism has a definition and it is not "big government," "government programs," "leftist," "regulations," or "welfare." If you want to redefine it as any of the above then Trump's government is still just as socialistic as Obama's.

We still have massive government, we still have onerous regulations, we still have pork projects, we still have welfare. Trump has signed very few executive orders and bills that affect the economy, and none of significantly change the nature of government.

It may seem pedantic, but words have meanings. Using the broad definition of socialism, EVERY government successful or unsuccessful for the past century was socialist. It paints Reagan under the same brush as FDR. But socialism isn't a sliding scale. It is a single bad idea, the total abolishment of private property and the capitalist economy, and we shouldn't confuse it for anything else.

I guess the same world where Trump and his followers are Nazis.

[ShockingButTrue]

I guess the same world where Trump and his followers are Nazis.

... and NBC is highly principled and fair-minded. What was the President thinking when he said they should have their licences revoked?

[CBB_Fan]

I guess the same world where Trump and his followers are Nazis.

Again, my issue is using socialist in a loose sense. SB Shock could have replaced "socialist" with bad and made no different to their intended meaning, while probably being more accurate. Using it merely as a pejorative makes it useless.

Socialism is a set of clear, defined policies which the US has not adopted. Not under Obama, not under Trump. If we replace that specific definition with a less precise one we not only imply that the USA has been a socialist country for a long time we undermine the actual terribleness of the abolishment of private property.

Nazis are less defined because they were a party, not an ideology. Fascism is also very poorly defined, and can't honestly claim to refer to anything but the actual Fascist party. Neither Trump nor his supporters are Nazis nor Fascists by their actual definitions, though it would be hard for members of 1930s European political parties to be American citizens today.

[ShockerPrez]

Again, my issue is using socialist in a loose sense. SB Shock could have replaced "socialist" with bad and made no different to their intended meaning, while probably being more accurate. Using it merely as a pejorative makes it useless.

Socialism is a set of clear, defined policies which the US has not adopted. Not under Obama, not under Trump. If we replace that specific definition with a less precise one we not only imply that the USA has been a socialist country for a long time we undermine the actual terribleness of the abolishment of private property.

Nazis are less defined because they were a party, not an ideology. Fascism is also very poorly defined, and can't honestly claim to refer to anything but the actual Fascist party. Neither Trump nor his supporters are Nazis nor Fascists by their actual definitions, though it would be hard for members of 1930s European political parties to be American citizens today.

I get it.

Maybe Socialism/communism is easier to associate with Obama because there are quite a few of his ardent supporters that would have no problem wearing a Che Guevara t-shirt, and who, in fact have supported such regimes, eg Jane Fonda. Or perhaps because Bernie Sanders, who caucauses as a democrat proclaims to be a socialist. I agree that when Obama bailed out the auto manufacturers, that was more of a facsist maneuver, as was Obamacare, in my opinion.

I get the overall premise. That bigger government is not necessarily socialism. But it is more a way that conservatives define left leaning principles.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

There's also these few things, but why let them get in the way of a false narrative?

- Manufacturing expands at fastest pace in 13 years
- Home builder confidence at a 12-year high
- Manufacturing confidence at a 20-year high
- Q2 GDP up 3.1%
- Household wealth in America reaches record high
- Food stamp usage has fallen every month under Trump
- Wages rising faster than prices
- Median income climbing for the 1st time since 2007
- US Job satisfaction highest since 2005
- Trump cuts more US debt than any President
- Construction wages in Texas have increased 30% due to lack of illegal workers
- US exports hit 2 1/2 year high
- Black unemployment lowest level in 17 years
- CEO confidence highest since 2014
- Federal spending as a percentage of GDP down
- Job killing regulations slashed
- All federal agencies ordered to create task force to cut regulations
- US Manufacturing index at a 33-year high
- Illegal immigration has fallen drastically

If you want to attribute all of those things to Trump, or if you want to even claim all of those things are actually true, then I think you need to reexamine what is--and what is not--a false narrative.

[Aargh]

"He knew what he signed up for..." spoken to the mother and widow of a deceased soldier.

I believe our Commander-In-Chief has now lost the right to accuse others of disrespecting veterans. Sure makes it sound like that black life didn't matter. Not a good optic on this, but it seems to go past optics to something deeper. One has to question why it would even occur to someone to say that to grieving family members.

[ShockingButTrue]

http://nypost.com/2017/10/17/team-obamas-stunning-coverup-of-russian-crimes/

Collusion would just the tip of this iceberg

[CBB_Fan]

http://nypost.com/2017/10/17/team-ob...ussian-crimes/

Collusion would just the tip of this iceberg

I think you are going to want to throw stones carefully, though I will admit I was shocked. I've never seen you post to a news article instead of a comic. But anyway, the New York Post article isn't as good as the one on the Hill, and makes a few crucial leaps of logic.

The very cursory reading of the article gives the impression that Russians bribed Clinton/Mueller for permission to sell the mine. This is entirely false. The article on the Hill shows the actual story: Vadim Mikerin as a representative of Tenex took bribes from US companies as part of a racketeering scheme. These bribes turned into a complex scheme to launder the money in Crypus and provide kickbacks. Every piece of evidence shows that some in the FBI were aware of this scheme and failed to report it to higher-ups, including the FBI director and cabinet members like Clinton.

If anything, the scheme calls several Trump associates into question. The same bank used to launder money for the kickbacks (The Bank of Cyprus), was used by Trump campaign manager Paul Manafort, who admitted to taking wire transfers to Cyprus banks and is under suspicion of laundering Russian money. For instance, Vadim Mikerin started his racketeering scheme in October 2009; that same month a Manafort shell company received a $1M payment from the Bank of Cyprus and that same day sent two transfers of $500k to anonymous accounts.

Again, the implication is not that Russia worked to illegally lobby for the selling of the mine. It is that American and Russian businessmen illegally engaged in corrupt practices to personally profit from the sale, and Manafort is very likely a suspect in this exact scheme.

[SB Shock]

“It was one of the untold stories of the Russia trip. People have focused on Uranium One and the speaking fees, but opening up a business spigot for the family business was one only us insiders knew about,” the friend said.

Conservative author Peter Schweizer, whose 2015 collaboration with The New York Times first raised questions about the Uranium One deal and Clinton donations, said Thursday the new emails were “stunning they add a level of granularity we didn’t have before."

“We knew of some sort of transactions in which the Clintons received funds and Russia received approvals, and the question has always been how and if those two events are connected,” he said. “I think this provides further evidence the two may be connected.”

http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/356323-bill-clinton-sought-states-permission-to-meet-with-russian-nuclear

Frankly I don't care which side - if there was corruption; whether with Trumps people or Clinton's - they should be made an example of.

[shockfan89_]

"He knew what he signed up for..." spoken to the mother and widow of a deceased soldier.

I believe our Commander-In-Chief has now lost the right to accuse others of disrespecting veterans. Sure makes it sound like that black life didn't matter. Not a good optic on this, but it seems to go past optics to something deeper. One has to question why it would even occur to someone to say that to grieving family members.

You should watch the video of Trump's call with another Gold Star widow, Natasha De Alencar.

Very respectful and very much appreciated by the widow, who is an amazing woman. I think Trump very much respects the men and women of our military and feel it is very disrespectful the way his comments are being taken out of context. We have an all voluntary military, and are in the middle of a long war against terrorism, so everyone know what they are signing up for. But that Trump said, that conveniently isn't reported is that EVEN THOUGH he knew what he signed up for, when it happens, it still hurts. Even General John Kelly has defended Trump and said those calls are very difficult. I tend to think he knows a little something about the calls since his son was also killed in combat. Too bad the POTUS at that time didn't give him a call too.

[Aargh]

You should watch the video of Trump's call with another Gold Star widow, Natasha De Alencar.

Very respectful and very much appreciated by the widow, who is an amazing woman. I think Trump very much respects the men and women of our military and feel it is very disrespectful the way his comments are being taken out of context. We have an all voluntary military, and are in the middle of a long war against terrorism, so everyone know what they are signing up for. But that Trump said, that conveniently isn't reported is that EVEN THOUGH he knew what he signed up for, when it happens, it still hurts. Even General John Kelly has defended Trump and said those calls are very difficult. I tend to think he knows a little something about the calls since his son was also killed in combat. Too bad the POTUS at that time didn't give him a call too.

Apparently Trump is more conscientious when he calls grieving people of his own ethnicity. First Trump made the "he knew what he was signing up for" comment. Then he tweeted that he didn't say it, and the the lady reporting it was lying. Then Kelly explained what Trump meant when Trump made the statement Trump had denied making.

The republicans need to come up with someone they can support on some level besides being "better than Hillary".