Shockernet Has Become Politically Polarized

[wufan]

Are most Democrats blaming Trump for violence? Or is that what you read on Breitbart or hear on Fox? Are most Republicans racists or is that somewhere on MSNBC? Who in their right mind believes this stuff?

Most aren’t blaming Trump. As I said, too many are. I can give you a list and you can decide if it’s too many or not enough.

[wufan]

Most of the crap—and that’s exactly what it is on here and in many political discussions: absolute CRAP—results from either side demonizing the other. It’s from generalizations and stereotypes. It’s from a lack of understanding. It’s from folks getting all worked up about something they read on a website instead of rationally looking at the issue from both sides and using some damn empathy.

When we spend less time jumping to conclusions, labeling, and thinking the other side is out to get us, and spend more time listening and asking questions, we’ll make some real progress.

Why can’t we just say “I disagree with Pelosi on many issues”? Or “Lindsay Graham supports Trump too much.” Instead, we’re like “PELOSI AND THE DEMOCRATS ARE SOCIALISTS AND EAT BABIES” and “LINDSAY GRAHAM AND EVERY REPUBLICAN WHO EVER LIVED WANTS TO TAKE HEALTHCARE AWAY—AND THEY ALSO EAT BABIES”.

God help us.

You quoted my post. I just corrected two wrong things. Your hyperbole is obviously your own. What did I say that wasn’t true? Read it again.

Now, who’s not looking at the issues and is jumping to conclusions?

[wufan]

I've not heard any on the right calling out the armed protesters who called for the murder, lynching, or beheading of Michigan's governor when they invaded the state capitol with arms and some were carrying swastika flags. Equating a political ideology with the extremes of that ideology is just fear-mongering.

There are idiots on both ends of the spectrum. Assigning the acts of the extremists to the non-extreme is a generalization that is not only inaccurate, but tends to categorize innocent and peaceful people with the worst of those on their side of the spectrum.

Those categorizations are splitting our country into camps that oppose each other. We do not benefit in any way from dividing into ideological camps. Russia and China benefit greatly from that.

Reagan won the Cold War by outspending and bankrupting Russia, but the battle lines changed. Now the effort is to bring down America from within. So far we are cooperating in every way possible.

Let me start by saying I condemn anyone, especially those that open carry firearms, that would threaten any other person. Those people should be arrested and charged.

Now let’s look at what happened vs what you say happened:

Witmore claims to ave received death threats on social media by anti-lockdown FB members. Some of these groups were associated with the protest. The actual reported “threats” while abhorrent and wrong, were not legal threats. These weasels use terms like, “she should be shot” or “i wish someone would behead her”. That’s noT illegal, but maybe it should be. I condemn these people.

During the three protests, no threats were made. There was one sign that said “Tyrants get the noose”. Maybe the governor views herself as a tyrant? The swastika sign said “heil Whitmore”. It wasn’t a Nazi flag as you are insinuating. I disagree with these two individuals.

The governor stated that anyone that was threatening at the protest would be arrested. No arrests were made.

Sean Hannity also spoke out against the protests.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/media/sean-hannity-message-to-armed-michigan-protesters.amp

[wufan]

Actually, no I’m not. I’ve never seen a legitimate source use the word “leftist.” The only place I’ve seen it is here. I don’t know what it means. I don’t know if “rightest” is a thing. I’ve never heard either term used in live conversation.

But I am reasonably sure it’s kinda silly.

https://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/political_commentary/commentary_by_ted_rall/the_difference_between_liberals_and_leftists

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/06/17/trump-warns-leftist-violence-dangerous-threat-emerges-right-wing-boogaloo-movement/%3foutputType=amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/07/09/politics/trump-biden-radical-left-attacks/index.html

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/02/22/why-leftists-go-right/amp

It’s also in all the dictionaries.

[wufan]

BTW, I don’t read Breitbart or watch Fox News. I read AP stories, then I click on the source link to the local outlet and I read that. The local stories provide the important nuance to stories that you can’t get from national media. Why would you assume I’m getting my information from right wing sources? Is it because you get yours from “centrist” MSM?

It used to be that we were told a story and had to decide what to believe. Now we are told what to believe, and have to decide if it actually happened.

[revenge_of_shocka_khan]

There were no unmarked DHS folks. They were all marked. When the gov tried to sue, the judge through it out because both instances had pictures and the officers had markings on four sides as well as a badge number and department. That’s all fake.

As to the white supremacist. Well, originally he was a police officer. You can dig up the 100s of stories on that. Now he’s a white supremacist. Well they took sworn testimony from an individual that swore under oath that someone told him who the person was. That’s it. Also, the riots were on day three when this guy started breaking windows.

It’s important that you know that you are being lied to. You can look up everything I just told you.

So the video of him breaking windows and staling stuff was fake. Interesting.

[pinstripers]

On his deathbed, a lifelong Republican supporter suddenly announced that he was switching to the Democrats. “I can’t believe you’re doing this.” said his friend. “For your entire life you’re been a staunch Republican. Why would you want to become a Democrat now?” “Because I’d rather it was one of them that dies than one of us.”

[pinstripers]

As near as I can figger, most on the right just wanna be left alone; most on the left just wanna tell others what to do.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

AOC is a member of the Democratic Socialist party. Yes she defines herself as a socialist. I’m not giving her a pejorative, I’m identifying her as she identifies herself.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox...ist-of-america

The Democratic Socialists are not a political party. Technicality, I get it.

From your source: "Socialists often get a bad rap in the press. Some US citizens who lived through the Cold War era succumbed to fears that socialism was “the close cousin of Soviet communism” and that a single-payer health care system was “a first step to the gulags,” according to the Guardian’s Chris McGreal. Some in the media (mostly Fox News) used socialism as an epithet against President Barack Obama, thereby giving voters a reason to fear him."

And so what happens?

Look right here on SN. "AOC is a socialist and she eats babies!!!!!!"

Obviously, I'm exaggerating to make a point.

I personally don't agree with AOC on some of her beliefs. AND THAT'S OK. I don't have to disagree with her, think she's the anti-Christ, and get all worked up.

Is she an example of how the Democrats are moving left? Probably, though Bernie has been caucusing with them for years. It's why I didn't join the Democrats when I left the Republicans.

But none of this means I have to believe the Democrats or the leftists or whatever the hell you guys call them are bad.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

Most aren’t blaming Trump. As I said, too many are. I can give you a list and you can decide if it’s too many or not enough.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. This is what is so frustrating on these forums and elsewhere in this country's discourse.

"Most" aren't blaming Trump, meaning only some are. Which gets turned into "Democrats blame Trump!!!!"

Why can't it be "Pelosi blames Trump", or "Lindsay Graham blames protesters". Instead, we generalize and demonize an entire freakin' group based on the actions of a few.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

https://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/political_commentary/commentary_by_ted_rall/the_difference_between_liberals_and_leftists

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/06/17/trump-warns-leftist-violence-dangerous-threat-emerges-right-wing-boogaloo-movement/%3foutputType=amp

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/07/09/politics/trump-biden-radical-left-attacks/index.html

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/02/22/why-leftists-go-right/amp

It’s also in all the dictionaries.

Thank you. This is the first time I've seen this from legitimate sources. Now I know it's actually a thing.

Still seems silly to me. Whether we're leftists or rightists, we're all in this together and we all have the same goal: move the country forward. I don't understand why we have to have several different labels for each other that all mean the same thing.

Unless, of course, something or someone is trying to divide us.

[wufan]

So the video of him breaking windows and staling stuff was fake. Interesting.

No, not at all. That video is real. They currently have a warrant to determine if a suspect was in the area at the time of the event. It could very well be that they have their guy and he is a white supremacist posing as Antifa. I’m just saying that the headlines are inaccurately reporting that the police know who did this, just like it was wrong six weeks ago. I am not yet ready to concur that the guilty party is as advertised, but may change my perspective when new evidence comes out.

[wufan]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. This is what is so frustrating on these forums and elsewhere in this country's discourse.

"Most" aren't blaming Trump, meaning only some are. Which gets turned into "Democrats blame Trump!!!!"

Why can't it be "Pelosi blames Trump", or "Lindsay Graham blames protesters". Instead, we generalize and demonize an entire freakin' group based on the actions of a few.

I was really clear. You quoted it and interpreted it that way when that wasn’t what was said.

[wufan]

Thank you. This is the first time I've seen this from legitimate sources. Now I know it's actually a thing.

Still seems silly to me. Whether we're leftists or rightists, we're all in this together and we all have the same goal: move the country forward. I don't understand why we have to have several different labels for each other that all mean the same thing.

Unless, of course, something or someone is trying to divide us.

The reason there are numerous labels is because not all democrats are centrists. Not all democrats are leftists. Not all democrats are progressive. Not all democrats are socialists. You need multiple labels to distinguish the multiple beliefs. They aren’t the same, but they all caucus together as democrats. This is how we establish nuance in the discussion.

[Rocky Mountain Shock]

I was really clear. You quoted it and interpreted it that way when that wasn’t what was said.

Sorry, I haven't made this clear. I've never been talking specifically about you. This whole time I've been talking in broad terms about the experience of having a discussion on this forum and in this country in general.

People take things to the extreme, label each other, demonize each other or entire groups, and defend their chosen political side like it's blameless and perfect.