Union/Gov't Battles

[SB Shock]

- Unions and their members don't care about jobs, only their salary. They would rather lose jobs than take low single-digit reductions in pay to save those jobs.

We see that here in town at HBC which they pretty much said that exactly.

[ISASO]

Another tidbit that some may not connect the dots on is that a LOT of the TARP/Stimulus money handed out was given to teachers and other union-driven interests.

Think about the money-laundering circle going on here. The Democrat-controlled government gives taxpayer money to union workers who in turn, via union dues, funnel it back to election campaigns of those who support unions, Democrats.

Every American taxpayer was forced to help get Democrats elected, whether they like it or not. The TARP/Stimulus package was nothing but a slush fund for the unions.

[WSU and Reds Fan]

Something else to consider is that as union membership started declining in the '70's so did the income gap between middle class and the elite.

[Maggie]

On Teachers and Others - In judging teachers’ claims, we might compare their lives with the lives of, say, farmers or welders or interstate truckers

by Victor Davis Hanson

[SubGod22]

Idaho Votes to Phase Out Teacher Tenure, Restrict Collective Bargaining

The measure is part of Superintendent of Public Instruction Tom Luna's plan to reform the K-12 education system in Idaho. It would restrict collective bargaining agreements to salaries and benefits while also phasing out "tenure" for new educators and current teachers who have yet to attain it. New educators would instead be offered one- to two-year contracts following a three-year probationary period.

"Through this plan, we are going to attract and retain more quality teachers in Idaho by offering a two-year contract, increased pay and the opportunity to earn bonuses," said Republican state Rep. Bob Nonini, according to Fox 12 in Idaho.

Teacher tenure is a longstanding benefit for public school teachers and college professors dating back to the beginning of the 20th century. The campaign for tenure sprung out of other workers' rights movements and was tied to the push for broader women's rights -- it was meant to keep experienced teachers safe from the whims of administrators and cultivate talented instructors.

But over the years, teachers' unions have pressed for expanded rights, and critics of tenure -- which in some cases can be earned in just two years -- say it's morphed into a tool to keep bad teachers from being fired.

Under the Idaho proposal, teachers with seniority would no longer be safe when school districts reduce their work force; a program that provides cash incentives for teachers to retire early would be eliminated; and Idaho school districts that lose students would no longer get to hold on to 99 percent of the state funding that came with that student for another year to avoid teacher cuts.

[ShockBand]

Just please be aware that in Kansas, a teacher who does not have tenure can be released and absolutely no reason has to be given by the district. No cause, no due process, no plan of nor opportunity to improve has to be given, nothing. Any teacher in Kansas, BTW, tenured or not, can be RIFed, and that has happened over the past few years as budgets have been cut. Though they tend to go for the non-tenured first since no cause has to be given.

Should it be easier to get rid of poor teachers, tenured or not? Probably so, but also keep in mind the level of direct observation for evaluation in most cases. For my evaluations this year, it was based on the direct observation of two class sessions. A rookie teacher might have 4-6 class sessions observed. Over the course of the year, I teach over 1000 class sessions. But better evaluation systems aren't likely to happen because to do so would likely be an increased cost. Being a teacher outside the core subjects, and thusly not one of the state assessed areas, how should the achievement of my students be measured when no instrument or metric exists other than my own grading?

Times are tough and tough decisions do have to be made, but please don't make the comparison between private and public situations. I've worked extensively in both and can verify that cost between the two is very much an apples and oranges comparison. One of my previous employers, The Independent School in Wichita, is one of the most frugal private schools around. Currently their tuition for all day kids ranges from about $7500 at the elementary level to about $9500 at the high school level. And TIS will state that tuition only covers about 80% of the total cost of operating the school - the rest has to come from fees for athletics and activities and fundraising, making the real cost range from a little over $9000 to a little under $11,000 per pupil. Collegiate? Add a few thousand to that. Catholic schools aren't always a fair comparison even to other private schools since some of their costs are carried through the diocese at large. Add to all that the fact that private schools can be selective about who they accept and public schools take all, including the very expensive special education students, and the comparisons get even further apart.

That said, public schools are going to have to make cuts, but the public is going to have to accept that it may mean fewer extracurricular athletic and activity programs, more fees for things, larger class sizes, fewer curricular offerings, and quite possibly fewer days of school, though many could cut contract days by cutting down on inservice days. I fully expect my pay to be down 1-3% this coming year, if it even stays stable, I will thank my lucky stars.

That's enough grist for the mill for now, hopefully you can see I do ponder both sides as much as I can. Peace.

[wu_shizzle]

Just please be aware that in Kansas, a teacher who does not have tenure can be released and absolutely no reason has to be given by the district. No cause, no due process, no plan of nor opportunity to improve has to be given, nothing.

I don't want to minimize your post, as I appreciate those who serve as educators. And I understand the difficult choice of taking the public school's money or choosing the private school's culture.

But I have to say, it is going to be very hard for you to receive sympathy from those who work in the business world about teacher's job security.

The situation you describe above is normal for most people and I doubt many have a problem with that.

Also having a background in management, I find it difficult to believe that good teachers are being dismissed without cause and without a track record of negative performance reviews.

[ShockBand]

Just please be aware that in Kansas, a teacher who does not have tenure can be released and absolutely no reason has to be given by the district. No cause, no due process, no plan of nor opportunity to improve has to be given, nothing.

I don't want to minimize your post, as I appreciate those who serve as educators. And I understand the difficult choice of taking the public school's money or choosing the private school's culture.

But I have to say, it is going to be very hard for you to receive sympathy from those who work in the business world about teacher's job security.

The situation you describe above is normal for most people and I doubt many have a problem with that.

Also having a background in management, I find it difficult to believe that good teachers are being dismissed without cause and without a track record of negative performance reviews.

I've been non-renewed from a private school (tenure doesn't exist there) for no stated reason other than "we want to make a change" so I'm fully aware of the practice. I know its idealistic to say, but it still doesn't make it right in any situation. Anyone being terminated should be informed as to the specific reasons for the termination. And I would be willing to bet your business world experience might find the methodology of education performance evaluations lacking in depth, but I'm just guessing there.

What you state is reasonable, and such instances of no-cause terminations are not common, but they do exist. But in thinking about your business world and performance review statements, let me ask something. Do you place the burden on your workers for the quality of incoming materials and/or resources if it affects the outcome of their performance? For instance, would you fault a manufacturing worker for poor performance on the making of a bad part if it were determined the raw material piece was substandard? Or would you expect the worker to correct and improve the raw material? Or would you expect the worker to reject the raw material for one of acceptable quality? In public education, we have to take all our "raw materials" as they are and do our best with them. If I could reject all my "raw materials" that come in substandard, I could get spectacular results on a consistent basis.

While there operational aspects of a school district that can and SHOULD be run in a businesslike manner, the K-12 classroom itself is not a business nor should be treated as such. Businesslike and real world might mean booting kids who have no desire to learn and maybe even those who are intellectually slower in pace. But I doubt many would say that is what is best for each child individually. Much as I might like to fire a few students, my job is to hang in there with those tough ones every day, hoping that if I don't see the results, maybe someone down the road will. And if that happens, I won't get the credit for it, the teacher that year will. And you know what? That's OK. I'm not in this profession for my own glory. I'm in it with the hope and prayer that each day I make this world a little better place than the day before through the power and joy of learning. And I feel confident that if every day I keep learning and thinking and questioning my own practices, I can tuckpoint my little bit of mortar into the whole structure.

Thanks, when I'm not too tired and cranky I do enjoy the dialogue and conversation.

[SB Shock]

I've been non-renewed from a private school (tenure doesn't exist there) for no stated reason other than "we want to make a change" so I'm fully aware of the practice. I know its idealistic to say, but it still doesn't make it right in any situation. Anyone being terminated should be informed as to the specific reasons for the termination.

It is idealistic. Here is what happens in the private sector (at least in the aircraft industry.

a. On a Friday, manager shows up at your desk and ask you to come to his/her office.

b. Person is informed they are riffed with no other explanation. They are given a quick briefing on the severance benefits.

c. That person is given a box and told to pack up their personal things and then are immediately walked out of the building.

And I would be willing to bet your business world experience might find the methodology of education performance evaluations lacking in depth, but I'm just guessing there.

No I doubt it. I can only speak at my company, but performance management is a joke. I pretty much fill out my own reviews and then my supervisor then signs it and then chooses my rating.

In fact we just have do our yearly goals on a new system that was rolled out by HR, but before we were trained on the whole new procedure they wanted us to follow. It is such a joke.

[ShockBand]

Yes, I know its idealistic. Nevertheless, it lacks honor, dignity, and respect, something our society is sorely lacking.

Boy, if I could fill out my own reviews I could look the goose that laid the golden egg!

[SB Shock]

Yes, I know its idealistic. Nevertheless, it lacks honor, dignity, and respect, something our society is sorely lacking.

I agree.

Boy, if I could fill out my own reviews I could look the goose that laid the golden egg!

If you do them to good, HR in their review will say that "no person is that good" and then they will make the performance review be revised.

[Maggie]

ShockBand,

I always enjoy reading your posts because you obviously take the time to think before you write. That said, in my judgment, there are so many lamentable problems with the education system in America, K-12 especially, that it is hard to know where to begin. But I will venture to wade into the waters (well at least dip my toe in) with a few observations:

(1) I have written before about what I perceive, generally speaking, to be a complete lack of accountability in the school system;

(2) I would also note rigid instructional requirements, which takes away the individual teachers ability to adapt to their students;

(3) It seems to me that in many school districts there is an inordinate amount of funds allocated to administrative costs – maybe, just maybe, those funds are better spent elsewhere;

(4) The benefits to teaching, as opposed to working in the private sector, are readily apparent – you get paid a full salary for three quarters of the year, excellent benefits, and superior job security (some of this, however, contributes to the problem);

(5) One of the other issues I see with those benefits is that they are heavily back loaded – perhaps they shouldn’t be, in exchange for a little accountability on the part of teachers and administrators; and…..

I could keep going, I’m sure, but I just don’t have time now. The public education system, as a whole in the United States, has become bloated, bureaucratic, corrupt, and self serving (by that I mean it exists to serve itself – not its students). This is the fault of politicians of all persuasions, the fault of Unions, the fault of teachers, and the fault of citizens. It is high time someone take a close look at the system, trim the fat, streamline the process – make the schools serve students. Because quite often the opposite is occurring now.

[ShockBand]

Maggie, to respond in short since I have just a couple minutes, your five points you list certainly have merit and are worth consideration. I think one of the fears of many teachers is the loss of collective bargaining might mean the loss of any voice in the pay, benefits, and working environment structures. Those things could still be negotiated without unions, the question is whether or not they would. The rub in what teachers will argue is whether or not their desires are really in the best interest of the students, or in their own self-interest. One of those things, KPERS (the pension system in KS) will likely start getting sliced and diced on this legislative session. It has some teachers really flipping out, but I'm not one of them. I'd rather know now that my benefits multiplier will be a little lower and that I won't be eligible for benefits until a little later. KPERS does need to be put on sound financial footing if it is going to be offered as a benefit.

As for the educational-industrial complex (which includes textbook and testing companies and their lucrative interests in maintaining the status quo), the increasingly easier access to information and resources via the internet will, I believe, become a great leveler. I do believe the revolution in education is coming, whether the current educational institutions want it or not. I hope to be a part of that, but for now it means I have to be more "discreetly subversive".

The solutions lie in smaller numbers, not larger numbers. Good education is about relationships, not mass numbers. The revolution is coming.

[Maggie]

Okay. I hear you and I hear others – my sister is a teacher, both my in-laws are teachers (and they are teachers in NJ) – so I have heard it all. Change is hard but it is coming. I know nothing about the benefits you have been offered – but they may not be realistic (or appropriate) and some teachers may need to take a beat and understand they were lied to (and that is not too strong a word)….by their Union, by politicians, and speaking for one person I am truly sorry – I feel for the teachers that actually care. The education system has been corrupted and manipulated – you became a teacher for a reason (by your own account a good reason) – the system doesn’t serve that ideal. Sorry.

And I’ll step slowly, knee deep maybe, into the shallow end of the pool. Not that it matters, I can’t change anything. But I will share my thoughts.

To begin with – it is time to stop focusing on the benefits and start focusing on the children. With the right leadership and after seeing tangible results – “we” (taxpayers) will take care of our teachers.

[ShockBand]

I'll add that in most private schools, there is a lot of collegiality between administration and teachers. In most public school settings, the level of distrust and snarkiness between administration and teachers is frankly appalling. It is one aspect that really bothers me, and could well drive me back to private education or something else entirely.