Eagle WBB article coming

[ShockerFever]

What a bunch of crybabies.

Jane wore costumes at Halloween practices for God's sake. Biddy ball practices don't even have that.

These girls were softies. Sorry, but it's true.

I'll be looking forward to the Adams era with ACTUAL basketball players.. a la the nation's 48th ranked recruiting class. :good:

[shockerball05]

Turn your noses up at it all you want, there is a disturbing trend taking place right under your noses... Pass my A$$! What reason would these girls have of going to the media, what's the WIN for them? They are done at WSU, have nothing to gain from it other than maybe wanting people to hear their own side of the story. I find it funny that in the article JA makes a bunch of claims and yet the roster as it is set right now will consist of 11, count them, 11 african-american players and not a single caucasian. Sounds a bit strange to me... And for those of you who think it is the yelling and hard nosed attitude that drove these girls off it's time to wake up people, every athlete has dealt with a coach somewhere along the way who isn't afraid to get deep in your pockets. Maybe there really is more going on behind the scenes than everyone here realizes, I for one am not afraid to stand up and say things need to be thouroughly looked into.

[sekshoxfan]

I find it funny that in the article JA makes a bunch of claims and yet the roster as it is set right now will consist of 11, count them, 11 african-american players and not a single caucasian. Sounds a bit strange to me...

I'm confused...is Coach Adams supposed to be the racist...or are you?

[RoyalShock]

I've been on JA's side during all this. But in reading that article I got the impression that the former players are being forthright and honest, but we're getting a lot of spin from the coaches and administration.

Some of it could be whining, but the allegations being made tell me there is much more to it than just being upset about working harder and practicing longer.

This was Sexton's first major test and I can give him a little slack, but he needs to address the issues with Adams, if he hasn't already.

[BostonWu]

Going forward the proof will lie with Adams’ recruits. If we continue to see additional transfers and similar accusations along with the noticeable absence of white players then this program is dead in the water. Now if she starts winning then all of this is forgotten.

[Maggie]

I think this situation is a combination of a lot things and I don’t think it is right to dismiss some of these girls’ accusations out of hand.

To be fair I don’t follow the women’s program very closely but Albright’s coaching style, if you can call it that, as described in the article just seems bizarre to me. Compared to the way Adams's is described, I’m sure it was quite a shock to the returning players. From what I can gather, solely from the article, despite their protests, these girls didn’t appear to react to the change well. Which is perfectly normal – several of Turgeon’s players didn’t seem to adjust to CGM either.

There are two issues raised by the departing girls that I think need to be fleshed out a bit: (1) The racial issue; and (2) the practice time issue.

With regard to the first issue: Adams admits in the article that the team began to divide early on and it only became worse as the season progressed. This could simply be a reflection of the respective talents of individual players or it could have been fostered by the coaching staff. However, in this case I am willing to give Adams the benefit of the doubt. Adams appears to be very competitive. A competitive coach doesn’t care what color a player is, what type of background they come from or by what name they call God – they only care about giving playing time to players that earn it and will help the team win. It would be counterproductive, and self-defeating, for Adams to act otherwise. So I doubt that the coaching staff was harder on some players because of ethnicity or color. With regard to recruiting – I would hope that Adams recruiting efforts are not based on some sort of quota.

The practice time issue bothers me. These girls are making a serious accusation – one that could hurt the future of the program. I hope Adams and her staff are not violating NCAA rules.

I don’t know Adams but most everything I have read about her I like. And I wish her well.

[KC Shox]

Agreed. Once Adams has her own recruits in the program and no similar accusations arise, then we all know what happened. A) the players that left couldn't hack it and wanted to be pampered, and B) the players Adams have brought in are her type of player and have the guts to deal with tough love.

[pogo]

There is probably something to the players complaints but as alluded to by others it is up the the AD to get to the bottom of this and either clear up the allegations or hold the responsible parties accountable. As far as the false practice sheets being submitted I understood that the players had to sign the sheets to verify they were correct. Why would you sign something that was not true. I believe in a code of conduct much like the service academies have, in that I will not cheat nor tolerate those that do.
Shouldn't a student athlete be held to high standards or is it ok to go along to get along?

[WstateU]

"Women... can't live with them. Can't live without them..."

:D

[Shoxtastic]

[The Mad Hatter]

I think this situation is a combination of a lot things and I don’t think it is right to dismiss some of these girls’ accusations out of hand.

To be fair I don’t follow the women’s program very closely but Albright’s coaching style, if you can call it that, as described in the article just seems bizarre to me. Compared to the way Adams's is described, I’m sure it was quite a shock to the returning players. From what I can gather, solely from the article, despite their protests, these girls didn’t appear to react to the change well. Which is perfectly normal – several of Turgeon’s players didn’t seem to adjust to CGM either.

There are two issues raised by the departing girls that I think need to be fleshed out a bit: (1) The racial issue; and (2) the practice time issue.

With regard to the first issue: Adams admits in the article that the team began to divide early on and it only became worse as the season progressed. This could simply be a reflection of the respective talents of individual players or it could have been fostered by the coaching staff. However, in this case I am willing to give Adams the benefit of the doubt. Adams appears to be very competitive. A competitive coach doesn’t care what color a player is, what type of background they come from or by what name they call God – they only care about giving playing time to players that earn it and will help the team win. It would be counterproductive, and self-defeating, for Adams to act otherwise. So I doubt that the coaching staff was harder on some players because of ethnicity or color. With regard to recruiting – I would hope that Adams recruiting efforts are not based on some sort of quota.

The practice time issue bothers me. These girls are making a serious accusation – one that could hurt the future of the program. I hope Adams and her staff are not violating NCAA rules.

I don’t know Adams but most everything I have read about her I like. And I wish her well.

I think that this is pretty much spot on and I would like to add a thing or two about the issue of race:

1. I believe that many of the racial issues are more about culture and class than about race. Jody is a blue collar person who wants to recruit blue collar players. The reality is not whether we are likely to see white players on Jody's teams, but whether we are likely to see middle class players.

There is a strong tradition of minority groups and the lower classes using sports as a means of social advancement, because they have fewer options and can make something of themselves through determination and hard work. (See Italians in baseball 50 years ago, African Americans and Eastern Europeans in basketball now, etc.). Jody came from that background and has an approach and value set that is effective with players from those backgrounds.

Jane wanted middle class well rounded people, Jody wants working class basketball obsessed people. It shouldn't be surprising that the black players responded better than the middle class white players to Jody's coaching, but because of culture rather than race.

2. Jody comes from the the South, and if you have any understanding of Southern culture, there is a much greater degree of ease with which race is discussed than in other parts of the country. The fact that (mosty rural) mid-western white girls listened to Jody and thought she put everything in racial terms doesn't necessarily mean that Jody was putting any particular emphasis on race, but rather that as a Southerner she doesn't have the same cultural paranoia about using racial terms that exist elsewhere.

3. Anyone familiar with basketball subculture, particularly in the inner city, knows that things be cast in racial terms has nothing to do with racism. The fact that when picking teams for a pick up game it goes something along the lines of "I'll take the white boy, or the puerta rican guy, or the big black dude, etc." does not mean that racism is going on. Many in basketball culture will tell you that things get framed in racial terms all the time, but that is not the same as racism in any way shape or form. The fact that this was not culturally the way Jane was or that white girls who were mostly from rural Kansas were not used to it does not mean that Jody inappropriately cast things in racial terms for a basketball coach, even if we believe the extreme claim that everything was cast in racial terms, which my guess is an exaggeration based on frustration and surprise at the culture shock that was experienced under the change in coaches.

Culture shock is a real and powerful phenomenon. The fact that some players were shocked by the dramatic shift in culture from Jane to Jody does not mean that anything wrong was done. When I live out of the US for a semester, not only was I shocked by the culture I was (in England), but I was emotionally very upset and thought that the way things were done in Britain was stupid and wrong and I just wanted to be back home where things were familiar. Does that mean that English culture is objectively wrong or evil because I had emotional trauma? No. While I can't prove that the accusations in this case are definitively attributable to culture shock, I would in no uncertain terms say that they were at least largely influenced by it.

[WstateU]

I find it funny that in the article JA makes a bunch of claims and yet the roster as it is set right now will consist of 11, count them, 11 african-american players and not a single caucasian. Sounds a bit strange to me...

I'm confused...is Coach Adams supposed to be the racist...or are you?

I wonder what 'shockerball05' thinks about the title of this WBB headline?

http://www.goshockers.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=7500&ATCLID=3747090

Hey 'shockerball05'... what do you think of the 2009 Volleyball Roster?

http://www.goshockers.com/SportSelect.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=7500&KEY=&SPID=2838&SPSID=61210

:clap:

[The Mad Hatter]

I find it funny that in the article JA makes a bunch of claims and yet the roster as it is set right now will consist of 11, count them, 11 african-american players and not a single caucasian. Sounds a bit strange to me...

I'm confused...is Coach Adams supposed to be the racist...or are you?

Also, in what world is Alicia Sanchez African American?

http://www.centralaz.edu/Home/Athletics/Teams/Womens_Basketball/2008-2009/Roster/Athletes/Alicia_Sanchez.html

[shockerball05]

WstateU... grow up, I am simply trying to point out that I see a disturbing trend, the incoming recruits along with the comments made in the paper seems to make a decent argument for itself. I want to be as fair as possible, I just see a disturbing trend. If you know any of the players from the article or have talked to them as I have, I find no reason NOT to believe them.

[Maggie]

I think this situation is a combination of a lot things and I don’t think it is right to dismiss some of these girls’ accusations out of hand.

To be fair I don’t follow the women’s program very closely but Albright’s coaching style, if you can call it that, as described in the article just seems bizarre to me. Compared to the way Adams's is described, I’m sure it was quite a shock to the returning players. From what I can gather, solely from the article, despite their protests, these girls didn’t appear to react to the change well. Which is perfectly normal – several of Turgeon’s players didn’t seem to adjust to CGM either.

There are two issues raised by the departing girls that I think need to be fleshed out a bit: (1) The racial issue; and (2) the practice time issue.

With regard to the first issue: Adams admits in the article that the team began to divide early on and it only became worse as the season progressed. This could simply be a reflection of the respective talents of individual players or it could have been fostered by the coaching staff. However, in this case I am willing to give Adams the benefit of the doubt. Adams appears to be very competitive. A competitive coach doesn’t care what color a player is, what type of background they come from or by what name they call God – they only care about giving playing time to players that earn it and will help the team win. It would be counterproductive, and self-defeating, for Adams to act otherwise. So I doubt that the coaching staff was harder on some players because of ethnicity or color. With regard to recruiting – I would hope that Adams recruiting efforts are not based on some sort of quota.

The practice time issue bothers me. These girls are making a serious accusation – one that could hurt the future of the program. I hope Adams and her staff are not violating NCAA rules.

I don’t know Adams but most everything I have read about her I like. And I wish her well.

I think that this is pretty much spot on and I would like to add a thing or two about the issue of race:

1. I believe that many of the racial issues are more about culture and class than about race. Jody is a blue collar person who wants to recruit blue collar players. The reality is not whether we are likely to see white players on Jody's teams, but whether we are likely to see middle class players.

There is a strong tradition of minority groups and the lower classes using sports as a means of social advancement, because they have fewer options and can make something of themselves through determination and hard work. (See Italians in baseball 50 years ago, African Americans and Eastern Europeans in basketball now, etc.). Jody came from that background and has an approach and value set that is effective with players from those backgrounds.

Jane wanted middle class well rounded people, Jody wants working class basketball obsessed people. It shouldn't be surprising that the black players responded better than the middle class white players to Jody's coaching, but because of culture rather than race.

2. Jody comes from the the South, and if you have any understanding of Southern culture, there is a much greater degree of ease with which race is discussed than in other parts of the country. The fact that (mosty rural) mid-western white girls listened to Jody and thought she put everything in racial terms doesn't necessarily mean that Jody was putting any particular emphasis on race, but rather that as a Southerner she doesn't have the same cultural paranoia about using racial terms that exist elsewhere.

3. Anyone familiar with basketball subculture, particularly in the inner city, knows that things be cast in racial terms has nothing to do with racism. The fact that when picking teams for a pick up game it goes something along the lines of "I'll take the white boy, or the puerta rican guy, or the big black dude, etc." does not mean that racism is going on. Many in basketball culture will tell you that things get framed in racial terms all the time, but that is not the same as racism in any way shape or form. The fact that this was not culturally the way Jane was or that white girls who were mostly from rural Kansas were not used to it does not mean that Jody inappropriately cast things in racial terms for a basketball coach, even if we believe the extreme claim that everything was cast in racial terms, which my guess is an exaggeration based on frustration and surprise at the culture shock that was experienced under the change in coaches.

Culture shock is a real and powerful phenomenon. The fact that some players were shocked by the dramatic shift in culture from Jane to Jody does not mean that anything wrong was done. When I live out of the US for a semester, not only was I shocked by the culture I was (in England), but I was emotionally very upset and thought that the way things were done in Britain was stupid and wrong and I just wanted to be back home where things were familiar. Does that mean that English culture is objectively wrong or evil because I had emotional trauma? No. While I can't prove that the accusations in this case are definitively attributable to culture shock, I would in no uncertain terms say that they were at least largely influenced by it.

You make some very good points.